I'm going the other way here. I've used glo-toobs, and was less than impressed. the website does a good job making them seem really luminescent, but mine looked just like what they were: a bunch of 5mm leds blinking in the distance. And kind of big/clunky for my 30# dog.

I've also had close to a dozen past-exp. date light sticks not work. I used to keep about 2 dozen in my car, in lieu of flares. Well, now I have one glo-toob (used to be 2) and 2 flares. Just more reliable, and still plenty bright.

Apropos of nothing whatsoever....
If one was in a military training environment, and was armed with a 5.56 NATO fed rifle firing blanks one could remove the blank adapter and insert one of these



in the barrel from the bore. When one pulls the trigger on the blank, the chem stick leaves the barrel looking all the world like a tracer in the night.


Scares the hell out of the folks that think there are only blanks being fired to suddenly see one tracer fly into the air.

I have to disagree on the use of chemlights for spelunking. I carried them when I was actively caving twenty years ago and found them quite reliable and useful. Considering that they have improved over this time, they are more consistent and last longer in storage, than they used to I think they have their uses.

My usual lighting plan was:
Carbide light with spare water, carbide and a spares kit. Strong light and a source of heat. One baby bottle of carbide and two of water gives you, in very rough terms, perhaps 36 hours of light. Less if run wide open. Generally too bright for anything but huge caverns. More if kept to a pinpoint.

One 2-C flashlight with an under-driven incandescent bulb to extend the run time, a 3v light using a 4.5v bulb and at least one set of spare batteries and bulb. Run time was about four hours per set of batteries. Before LED lights this was state of the art.

2- votive candles and several ways to light them. Heat and light. Run time roughly 6 hours per candle. Less run time, and much harder to keep lit, if there was a wind.

Three to seven milspec 12 hour green chemlights. These were used blind diving wet sumps, route markers in same or across open spots, placed in or near important steps or hand holds, used to mark drop offs and other hazards.

They were also quite handy as a backup. Coming out of a low spot or sump we were never quite sure the electric lights would work after being dunked. So it was common for the first through to activate a chemlight. This also provided a nice luminous beacon, and sometimes confirmation they made it to the other side, for the next one through. It also provided a reliable area light to get warmed up, dry out your carbide lamp and to test and work on the electric lights. You always wanted to know what you had left to work with before pushing on deeper and keep at least two-thirds of your resources for the return trip.

Chemlights are no more subject to failure or exhaustion than any other light. I wouldn't go spelunking with only chemlights. They don't provide any warmth. But then again I wouldn't go with just a flashlight or just a carbide light. there is safety in diversity and redundancy. In terms of weight, bulk and burn time they were more of a bargain than any flashlight. Even today, with krill lights and LED flashlights, they hold their own quite well. They have their strengths and weaknesses. As with everything else you have to play to their strengths and work around their weaknesses.

As long as they were rotated and used while fresh they worked fine. They were sometimes the only reliable light source. Even expensive dive lights often became unreliable after a few trips. They were also heavy and bulky for the light provided.

Experienced cavers practiced the practical skills of being able to dry out and relight a carbide headlamp by feel after it was dunked. I could completely disassemble, dewater, repair and replace all parts my flashlight by touch. We practiced getting candles lit while cold and wet and in complete darkness. But after we started using chemlights, other than practice and showing off, we never had any call to have to do it.

Cracking a chemlight was quick, easy and cost effective. It also helped calm inexperienced spelunkers. Being cold, wet, in a confined space that is completely dark causes some people to freak out. Go figure.

My favorite light for caving and terrain search is still a good carbide headlamp mounted on a climbing helmet. Loads of bright white light in a long running, fuel efficient, compact unit. A subject for another day.

> WHERE did I mention that items were LEFT??? Just where.

I read this comment:
> Also, disposable is nice to toss into caves, or into water etc.

Where did I read that you went and got them after you tossed the disposable lightsticks into caves, into water, etc.?

Well, the gas issue I hadn't considered and come to think of it...I may have to reevaluate.

On the caving side, I remember talking to old-time cavers that loved kerosene lights. Mammoth Cave gets a lot of folks on their lantern tours. Sure, it is romantic...but not practical. That's the same way I now see carbide and for the life of me at this point in time can't see a purpose for lightsticks in caves. Light can and be your life in a cave. I can carry stenlight, batteries, backup headlamp and batteries, and two more light sources...and batteries for far less weight and bulk then bottles, carbide, etc. And I'll get far more hours of light.

I do have friends that LOVE their carbide. I never did like the stuff. I also have friends who don't like LEDs over incandescent because they have lived for so long loving the yellow or orange glow that white light looks weird to them.

We're all different, and it's nice to see discussion from all viewpoints, so please don't take this as argument...it isn't meant that way.

(Art and Yeti)
I have never had to use carbide and getting the carbide itself is a problem.
The way the water drip to generate the gas was regulated seemed a little fiddley to me too, but that is the nature of the lamp.

Yet consider that something which lasted so long as the standard hatlamp for underground miners obviously has some good points.
Especially since it was only replaced when light weight rechargeable 12 volt battery packs able to last 12 hours became available.

I expect the 12 volt lamps used underground by miners now will all be replaced by led versions soon too.

Chemical light sticks would never stand up well enough in a mine to be useful. They would all be broken and glowing less than 100 feet inside the portal.
If it wasn't for the fragility of them I could see them being used by miners as backup lights instead of Zippo lighters.

I can also see Art's uses for them in sport caving as trail and hazard markers very well.
I suppose if you wanted to light a sump or check it for how strong of a current it had they would be nice there too.

People tend to choose their opinions based on their experiences and I certainly would't reject either of these opinions without at least giving them some consideration.

I said earlier, all of the really good uses I had seen for chemlights were people lighting themselves up so they would be seen.
Then
Desperado told us about using them for lighting a helicopter landing zone, and after I thought about it I realized we do that in the northern mines with permanent tritium powered lights.

Art told us about using them as hazard markers underground.
Other people added other uses too.

I have learned a bit on this thread, and as Yeti says, it is nice to see the discussion coming from different viewpoints on it.

Our team uses chemical light sticks at night to check for “strainers” under bridges, etc. and to get an estimate of how fast the water is moving. We will put one in an empty soda bottle, close the lid and throw it into the water.

No, we do not recover the soda bottle and light stick. Trust me, during a flood a few soda bottles/light sticks are not much of an issue with all kinds of stuff coming down the waterway.

We also tape them to our helmets with different colors for river right or river left operations.

I have both a Krill light and Glow-Toob attached to my PFD and/or dry suit.

Pete

"strainers"?

I forgot to mention that to keep the chemlights from being crushed, they really aren't that fragile but it is possible to accidentally activate one if you land a knee square on it. For protection we would cut a length of 1-1/2" PVC SCH-40 pipe long enough to hold the chemlight and use two end caps to close the ends. Trick was to file a groove into the removable cap so you can tell by feel which comes off. The other one was usually glued. To make the removable cap easier to take off without tools we used sandpaper or a file on the opening end to taper it a bit so it didn't stick. The tapering goes faster on a lathe but it can be done by hand. You want a slip fit that is firm and still as water tight as possible. A spritz of silicone spray helps sometimes.

Everyone had a slightly different version. One friend used the threaded screw-cap clean-out plug type fitting. A few would drill a small hole in each end, or the cap and side, and string a piece of accessory cord between them so the cap couldn't be lost. A dab of epoxy around the line helped keep the container watertight.

The 1-1/2" pipe held five or six 6" chemlights depending on who makes them and how much excess foil wrapper they use. It is possible to use the thinner DWV pipe and it gives you more room inside and it is lighter. But it isn't as tough. Works okay in shorter lengths where the end caps are close enough together to help support the diameter.

Any suggestions on what colors to carry?

I.E. what colors are generally used to signal certain things...