#164180 - 01/21/09 04:17 PM
Sobering report on EMS
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Enthusiast
Registered: 09/13/07
Posts: 378
Loc: SE PA
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Found this report on MSNBC detailing the state of EMS in the US. While the headline is mis-leading (911 does not equal EMS) it is a very scary article. I'm sure that the pros among us can amplify on the challenges they face. This is an area that could gather more attention from the Feds with VP Biden being a leading supporter of first responders.
_________________________
In a crisis one does not rise to one's level of expectations but rather falls to one's level of training.
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#164186 - 01/21/09 04:57 PM
Re: Sobering report on EMS
[Re: Andy]
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Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 2997
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Happens with more than EMS, Fire, Police, etc are just as busy.
years ago I had a job installing e-911 systems including the ANI/ALI controller, dispatch consoles, Computer Aided Dispatching, etc. I was in and out of serveral counties in my own state and several other states around. What I learned was the people on the other end of your 911 call are just like any other profession where you have competent and incompetent people. It worried me enough seeing some of the incompetent people who might be the ones I would get if I ever had to call that made me start getting prepared. Then if you factor out the bad ones you still have the public wasting the time of the good ones. I saw so many dispatchers answer "I locked my keys in my car" call. Or people calling to ask for directions even.
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#164217 - 01/21/09 06:44 PM
Re: Sobering report on EMS
[Re: Andy]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 04/09/02
Posts: 1920
Loc: Frederick, Maryland
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One of my best (or worst) BS calls took place a number of years ago, before I became a paramedic and strictly rode the ambulance (we have BLS ambulances with ALS chase cars). Around 4am we were dispatched for a “sick person”, the call was 2 blocks from the hospital. When we arrived on scene, a little old lady was standing along the curb with a small suitcase by her side. We inquired as to where we might find the patient and if she knew what was wrong with the patient. She answered “I am the patient, I am scheduled to go to the hospital in the morning for surgery and I could not sleep, so I thought I would go in now”. We asked her if her symptoms were worse and is that why she requested an ambulance, she answered “no, the cab company, would not send a cab, so she called for the ambulance, knowing we would come”.
Back then our EMS was 100% volunteer (both BLS and ALS) and did not charge for any emergency medical services, today BLS is 50%/50% volunteer/career and ALS is 5%/95% volunteer/career. Now, we do charge for services, but if the patient cannot or choices not to pay, the county just writes off the charge so there is little incentive to dissuade misuse.
Last year I posted regarding my giving up my ALS license/affiliation due to the ever increasing continuing educational requirements. I decided to complete the requirements and renewed my ALS license/affiliation, which will take me to April 2010. However, I have pretty much made up my mind not renew my ALS license/affiliation for the next time period.
Pete
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#164227 - 01/21/09 07:07 PM
Re: Sobering report on EMS
[Re: paramedicpete]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 12/18/08
Posts: 1534
Loc: Muskoka
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Can't afford medics, but can bail out bankers.
Hmmm.
_________________________
May set off to explore without any sense of direction or how to return.
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#164232 - 01/21/09 07:18 PM
Re: Sobering report on EMS
[Re: paramedicpete]
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Addict
Registered: 06/10/08
Posts: 601
Loc: Southern Cal
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Pete,
I'm curious, you're giving up working as a Paramedic because of educational requirements? No offense but since when is learning more a detriment to working in EMS?
I work as a Set Medic with an EMT-B credential and given the level of some of the folks I see working in EMS, I wish the standards and educational requirements were higher. Long range plans are to continue with my Respiratory Therapy degree and move into that field. RT requires an AS degree just to get started, unlike EMS which in some states doesn't even require a full high school education.
One of, if not the biggest problem in EMS is the lack of educational standard and requirements, the reason why many EMS workers are not more respected in the medical field is due to the lack of training and educational standards. The NREMT is only now getting to the point where Paramedic training programs will have to be certified in order for graduates to take their national test and it's expected to take another 3 years to implement that. For those not in the field, it's the equivalent of a school being certified by a national body of experts.
JohnE
_________________________
JohnE
"and all the lousy little poets
comin round
tryin' to sound like Charlie Manson"
The Future/Leonard Cohen
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#164245 - 01/21/09 08:14 PM
Re: Sobering report on EMS
[Re: JohnE]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 04/09/02
Posts: 1920
Loc: Frederick, Maryland
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I'm curious, you're giving up working as a Paramedic because of educational requirements? No offense but since when is learning more a detriment to working in EMS?
Keep in mind I am a volunteer, additionally I am a Firefighter/Technical Rescue Specialist and must maintain all of the additional training requirements for those disciplines as well as EMS. My passion is technical rescue (rope/mountain, swift/flood water, confined space, trench and collapse rescues) and while I started out in EMS and drifted into fire and technical rescue, I have sought to maintain my Paramedic status more in support of those disciplines rather then straight EMS. I could not agree more with the need for additional educational requirements, high standards and on going training for all levels of EMS (especially Paramedic) and support 110% the position you are advocating. However, for me I can no longer maintain the increasing requirements to maintain my ALS license/affiliation, technical rescue training requirements, my “real” job and family life. I suspect in the future, others in the Fire/Rescue/EMS fields (career and volunteer) will also have to make the tough choice and chose between Fire/Rescue and upper level (Paramedic and above) EMS. I further suspect that unless upper level (Paramedic and above) EMS providers (career and volunteer) are given major incentives to remain at the advanced EMS level, many will choose Fire/Rescue over EMS. Note: You will notice I mention upper level EMS providers as; Paramedic and above and wonder what is above Paramedic (I am not talking about Doctors, PAs or Nurses). In many areas, Paramedics are specializing in such areas as critical/aero- transport, general medical care (treat and release on-scene medical care) and neo-natal care. This is over and above the standard Paramedic education. Pete
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#164252 - 01/21/09 09:16 PM
Re: Sobering report on EMS
[Re: paramedicpete]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 12/18/08
Posts: 1534
Loc: Muskoka
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I can see the underfunding problem.
One of my nieces started her career by being on an ambulance crew. As soon as she had enough time in it was on to nurse training and from there to radiology.
As long as EMT and Paramedics are regarded as training spots instead of pros in their own right it will always be like that.
_________________________
May set off to explore without any sense of direction or how to return.
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#164277 - 01/21/09 11:00 PM
Re: Sobering report on EMS
[Re: scafool]
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Addict
Registered: 06/10/08
Posts: 601
Loc: Southern Cal
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Pete,
Forgive me, I didn't realise you were a volunteer. Kudo's to you for doing so.
JohnE
_________________________
JohnE
"and all the lousy little poets
comin round
tryin' to sound like Charlie Manson"
The Future/Leonard Cohen
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#164289 - 01/22/09 12:04 AM
Re: Sobering report on EMS
[Re: paramedicpete]
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Veteran
Registered: 11/01/08
Posts: 1530
Loc: DFW, Texas
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I'm curious, you're giving up working as a Paramedic because of educational requirements? No offense but since when is learning more a detriment to working in EMS?
Keep in mind I am a volunteer, additionally I am a Firefighter/Technical Rescue Specialist and must maintain all of the additional training requirements for those disciplines as well as EMS. My passion is technical rescue (rope/mountain, swift/flood water, confined space, trench and collapse rescues) and while I started out in EMS and drifted into fire and technical rescue, I have sought to maintain my Paramedic status more in support of those disciplines rather then straight EMS. I could not agree more with the need for additional educational requirements, high standards and on going training for all levels of EMS (especially Paramedic) and support 110% the position you are advocating. However, for me I can no longer maintain the increasing requirements to maintain my ALS license/affiliation, technical rescue training requirements, my “real” job and family life. I suspect in the future, others in the Fire/Rescue/EMS fields (career and volunteer) will also have to make the tough choice and chose between Fire/Rescue and upper level (Paramedic and above) EMS. I further suspect that unless upper level (Paramedic and above) EMS providers (career and volunteer) are given major incentives to remain at the advanced EMS level, many will choose Fire/Rescue over EMS. Note: You will notice I mention upper level EMS providers as; Paramedic and above and wonder what is above Paramedic (I am not talking about Doctors, PAs or Nurses). In many areas, Paramedics are specializing in such areas as critical/aero- transport, general medical care (treat and release on-scene medical care) and neo-natal care. This is over and above the standard Paramedic education. Pete Thank you for your volunteer service.... I have to ask though... You enjoy trench rescue???? I have been near one, and it really looked like it bit the big one to me. Of course I have no idea what your "real" job is, but with the economy the way it is, I think I would hang on to every possible qualification available. Thanks again.
_________________________
I do the things that I must, and really regret, are unfortunately necessary.
RIP OBG
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#164310 - 01/22/09 02:26 AM
Re: Sobering report on EMS
[Re: Desperado]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 03/08/07
Posts: 2208
Loc: Beer&Cheese country
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Nothing really suprising in the report for anyone that's been in EMS. I can tell you that as the EMT on a call, I'm the "beach" for the firefighters.
For example... even though they have union jobs, >$70K/year, health insurance, and come in teams of 4 (on an engine)... they often made me and my partner carry the patient down the stairs - we who were lucky to be making $10/hr, no benefits, and very little gaurantee that if injured we'd even get workman's comp.
And the patients are rarely better. The term "bus" used on the East Coast is pretty apt. My favorite examples.. my first call ever. A traffic accident... an hour ago... the person that called was a doc... needed to get to work, and "coincidentally" we found ourselved headed to that hospital's ER. example number 2, another car wreck, for a lady with a nose bleed that wasn't bleeding. Yep, nothing wrong with her either.
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