Am I the only one who carries little or no para cord? I just read where one hiker carries 100' - just in case. I'd rather use the space/$/ weight in my pack for other items...

as a day hiker i carry about 50' of paracord in my pack. it doesn't take up that much space and doesn't weigh that much. its uses are endless. i also have about 50' of manila rope on my hiking staff.

Since I'm the one who carries 100' of it... I find it has many uses, is relatively cheap (only costs about $7 for 100'). I rather have more than less, especially when building improvised shelters. Space take is also relatively minimal without sacrificing anything else.

Seems that Doug also packs about 50' - 100' in his aviation kit.

But, since I raised the question in my post, and you started this thread, which makes complete sense, I'm very curious as to how many paracord others pack with them.

So, question, what would you use that extra space, weight, $ for?

Mike

See my comment on Mike's thread.

Edit:
OK that was a bit too abrupt of me TeacherRO.

One of the things I see all the time is people underestimating how long lines have to be.
When you start adding up the cordage just to pitch a normal tent people are surprised at the amount of cord involved.

I suggest you think of it in individual lengths first.

Just as an example you should guess how long of a piece is needed to lace a pair of boots, and then measure it.
Now look at a tent and add up the amounts of line involved.

I just bought 20 meters (65 feet) of 400lbs test cord.
It cost 10 dollars and could fit into a coat pocket.
It is just about enough to pitch a small tent, but that would be a waste of strong cord...
If i was to double this cord it could maybe hold 800 lbs.
4 strands of it would give a breaking stress of 1,600lbs(3/4 ton)but a safety allowance of 4 to 1 drops that back to 400 lbs again.
Just enough for me to be suspended from.

EDIT NOTE: People are getting confused about this and think I am recommending Paracord as a rappel line. It is not possible to use Paracord as a rappel line, even if there was no strength problem.
You could no more rappel down Paracord than you could rappel down a steel wire.
Even though you can use it to hang yourself from a parachute just fine.
I was only using my weight as an example of a load.
So substitute anything you want as the weight, OK
And a special thanks to everybody who thinks I might really weigh 400 pounds

Now lets look at the length again. 65/4 =16.25
So after allowance for knots I might be able to use it to lower myself about 10 feet.
If I was to accept a 2 to 1 safety factor (no thanks, emergency only) I might get 25 feet out of it with a breaking stress of 800lbs. Any slight bounce could snap it.

It might be worth trying as a tow rope though.


So you see TeacherRO, cord is funny stuff.

When you really need it you need a lot of it,
and when you don't really need it you still need a bit.

I usually carry 40' in my bag, and since I saw this Paracord Bracelet posted here, 9' on my wrist.

I don't carry paracord... For the past several years, I carry a type of nylon rope that works good for my needs and it is cheap, 50' for 1.99. Besides quality paracord is tough to find here and I no longer support Ebay.

I have at least 100 foot in each family member's BOB. I was in the army too long to not have 100 MPH tape (GOOD duct tape) and 550 cord around most of the time.

However I have rejected the 550 cord "jewelry" and sweaters.

I carry 100' in my bag. 50' of it is just carried in the little bag it came packed in. The other 50' is wrapped around the handle of my Buck camp axe.

I just bought 100 feet of blaze orange 550 for my car kit.

Always have mil spec 550 cord along in the daypack, min 50ft. Have 2 100' lengths in the vehicle kit. It's just so strong and useful for so many things.

I won't hang from it though. Someone was talking about multiple runs of 550, but, you run into a bunch of other problems, like how to belay, abrasion on small diameters, blah blah blah. If we're hiking in the mountains, even if we don't expect any technical climbing, but, are exposed to areas where someone injured might need assist, or we could "fall into a bad situation" then at least 2 members in the group will carry a 70M length of 10mm dynamic dry climbing rope, locking 'biner, a figure 8, and harness, maybe an idiot proof belay like a Gri-Gri too. Obviously we'd have more if we were planning a technical climb, this is for the, oh %$#@ we are in trouble situations.

Cordage is cool stuff, 550 is awesome for so many things that I always carry some. Just wanted to make the point that it's not a good choice for supporting humans.

50' in the daypack, 4 - 50' rolls in the frame pack, over 1000' at home to use at anytime.
Color - Orange.

i don't have a BOB just gear in my PFD i case i get washed overboard and lose my canoe and packs.i expect that i would make a shelter from a foil blanket and branches.i found with some test lashings--i'm a "old scout" and i know how to make simple lashings--that the nylon line that block layers use is strong enought for a simple shelter.a 50 foot hank of this line takes up little space and no real weight.it's easy to cut,you could run it over a sharp rock if you needed too and it comes in bright colors. para cord is good stuff but it sort of got a name as a all purpose cord from it's military days and there is other stuff out there. the only thing i use para cord for is a clothes line...ok--i'm on a roll here...i would skip the para cord in a BOB and take mason's line and real rope,para cord is too "in between"--too heavy for lashing and too light for rescue work or heavy hauling and pulling...

Plus 1 on mil-spec paracord. Usually 45', sometimes 100'. It's too versatile and useful not to have.

I too carry quite a lot of 550 cord. I've got four lengths of 25 feet each and another roll that was probably 100 feet long until I started chopping bits off of it. No such thing as too much.

- Dave

I carry lots of it. *laughs* Then again, I carry a lot of cordage in general. "A rope that is light and is strong and is long" is the the Tolkien quote, IIRC. I can make, don't want to trust my life to cordage of my own making though. 25' lengths of p-cord with the bed roll, 50' and a couple of 12's in the ditch kit, and a 100' and a couple of smaller lengths in my main pack itself. If I have my old ALICE frame, that probably has another who knows how much whipped around it it and acting as ladder rungs across it's width. My EDC has a 30' length, and in my car I've got another 100' and a assorted smaller pieces. In my winter jacket, I always carry a pair of 6' ones, just for playing with when I'm bored. And I've got it in my boots, and black p-cord in my sneakers. More wrapped around each walking stick.

And that doesn't touch my tinder/don't care if it gets left behind jute, my specta fishline, 100# accessory cord, dental floss, webbing in various widths, and real rope I've got hanging around. Or the wire I have in every kit.

Yeah, I like my cordage.



Let me make that easy for you.

http://countycomm.com/550cord.htm all of it 550 cord (7 core lines)

http://vtarmynavy.com/paracord-100-foot.htm 550 and 450 (4 core lines) cord in many, many colors, and many lengths, and they even have the 1000 pound stuff

The later is where I get most of mine, but then again, he's half way between were I am and my folks, so I'm going within a mile of them once a month or so. Good crew, family owned and operated, I've tried to talk the owner into joining a few times.

I don't live in the US and by time I factor in dollar exchange, shipping fees, duty / brokerage fees, it is not worth the ROI...

I once (long before I ever knew of paracord) had about 10 feet of nylon string in my kit and it was enough to tie the two inner tubes together that I had decided on a whim I would float down a river on, and to have a drag handle, and also to make a new bootlace when one broke. I didn't need any other corgade to last me those few days;
But if I had planned to be using a tarp or something that requires it, I would have carried more. I hadn't packed it because I knew I'd use it, but it made the inner tubing possible, so I'm glad it was there.

Sometimes you don't know when you will need some string; and if its versatility is the number one reason why you carry it, carry some in your "what-if" kit, I suggest 50 feet of paracord...This amount does not include the amounts and lengths that you already can account for using specifically, and should be more than enough for any whimsy or ingenuity or bootlace mishap.

Only take more than a reasonable amount of "what-if" cordage if you anticipate actually using it. It makes no sense to waste valuable kit space carrying something that will never be of any use to you.

If you think you might need cordage longer than about 50 feet, you might want to ask yourself specifically why. You might actually need to sign up for a rappeling class. Never try to rappel with paracord.

Also, proficiency with cordage includes a multitute of knots for different purposes, and your proficiency with cordage should be able to clearly enable you to know how much of what kinds of cordage you might need for any specific purpose.

Paracord is never included in a kit for its intended purpose, so any more than 50 or 100 feet (expeditionary kits) in addition to how much you know you will use, is absolute nonsense.

I carry 100' cut into 2 50' segements. Like NigthHiker I use it for hanging bear bags; I also carry it for the express purpose of rigging a tarp should I need to spend the night while hiking. I found a poncho/tarp shelter combo I have been very happy with.

I carry cord of some type in my backpack all the time.
I have started to use type 3 para-cord for quite a few applications (tents, tarps, dummy-cords). For simple day trips I may only have 15-25' of type 3 cord, but for over night trips and wildland firefighting/SAR I usually keep 25-50' of type 1 cord in addition to the type 3 paracord or spectra cord in my PSK.

In my truck I have probably 500-1000' of type 1 paracord almost all the time. It seems that I can find uses for the stuff on an almost daily basis. Usually have a spool that I pull off of as needed in my truck... at a recent training event I used all but about 100' of a new spool for various applications (and handing out to under-prepared students).

If you are responding to my comment it is fine.
I was trying to explain how fast cord gets used up and how short a 100 foot length of cord really is.
If you look at the diameter of paracord or climber's utility cord you could never hold it. It would slice through your flesh long before you reach its safe load.

However your and Troglodyte's comments pointing out that it is not climbing rope are good.
I can see now that there might be people who misunderstood my explaining about breaking strength and using multiple strands by using my weight as an example.

I thought just maybe the 10 foot possible lowering might have been a clue, along with pointing out that 100 feet is only 10 pieces 10 feet long.
Edit
(or my weight as 400lbs)

I guess if there is any way to possibly misunderstand something there will be some people who succeed in misunderstanding it in just that way.

scafool wrote:
"It might be worth trying as a tow rope though"

climbers won't trust their ropes after it's being used for towing so don't trust paracord either. non vital uses only. (which would suggest it's not suitable for a survival kit).

QJS

100 feet minimum plus 100 feet 2.5mm cord

Seems that I am not alone in my quantity of choice!

Since I'm not carrying a tent when I'm on a day hike, the 100' would definitely get used in shelter construction, esp. if I am making something robust. Lots of different lashing that you can do and with the inner core, you can extend the amount of lashing material if needed. I also carry some zipties to expedite any shelter building.

Even when I'm camping with a tent, the 100' comes with me. Useful, as many have pointed out, for hanging bear bags. Also for emergency repairs on whatever may have failed. Additional fishing line. Etc... Really limited by your imagination.

I keep about 30' in my pack, a bracelet made of about 10' or so of it, and a necklace with a few must keep on me items with about another 10'.
One thing I learned over the years; its much easier to carry cordage than it is to make it.

+100 *nuff said*

I tried carrying 100' and 50' lengths of paracord, but hated having to unravel it each time I wanted to use it. My father used to carry 15' lengths of cord with him when camping, so I started doing that. Its a VERY handy length for all sorts of camp needs, plus I can alway tie two lengths together when needed.

Now I buy two 100' hanks of the wonderful orange paracord from countycom.com. I cut each of two of those hanks into 6 equal lengths, which works out to about 16+' per length.

That produces twelve 16+' lengths that are each wrapped around my palm and cinched down into nice easy to manage bundles. I usually carry eight of them in my daypack, which is 133' total.

I also try to carry 50'-100' of heavier (3/8") braided nylon rope in my larger camping gear bag - wether a duffel or backpack. The larger rope does better for clothes lines and such.

I carry a little over 70’ of paracord on my pack in the backcountry.
This is actually four separate sections that I knot together with simple square knots in to one long line, or separate when needed for application.

Over the years, I have narrowed it down to this amount as I have found this is sufficient for me to complete my necessary bear-bagging (with two carabiners), guylines for my solo tent, and some extra for emergency repairs I have ran across so far.
It gets a lot of use, as I always hang my food, and spend a great deal of time in the back country for work, and play.

I hear you about weight. I often have to carry at least 20lbs of extra weight in research gear, so try to keep all of my gear to light weight brands/styles and to the necessities. I have just found that it is the most useful cordage for the price/weight.

In addition to the endless things I have used it for myself, I have also used it to repair the gear of others I have bumped into in the backcountry, including one hikers boot gaiters, a snowshoer’s bindings, a cross-country skiers bindings and of course the most common is tying people’s gear onto their packs because they brought more than they can fit in the pack.

I actually should think about replacing my current line, as I have been using this newest piece for about 7 yrs now. It tends to get stretched a bit and gets smaller in diameter, but just takes forever to wear out. Eventually it gets too many pitch patches on it and little frayed spots. I usually retire it to tie-line around the homestead, and still get many more years from it.

I also carry 12’ of tubular blue webbing which I have used for a variety of uses when I needed more strength, including a lead line once for a 2 yr old paint gelding I found 10 miles into the Three Sisters Wilderness.

In my day pack I carry 50’ of less used paracord and keep 100’ hanks of paracord in each of my vehicle emergency preparedness packs.

I will only use the mil spec type paracord which I used to get from my local military surplus store, but now purchase from County Comm, since I can get more color variety for visibility, etc.

IronRaven, is the 450# cord built just like mil-spec 550#? I have some projects where I could use the thinner 450# type if it is made like mil-spec. And it is 4 core lines, not 5? Mil-spec Type II cord is 5 core lines. Thanks in advance.

The thing with cordage is that tasks like shelter building and lashing use up a lot of it. So you need a fair amount.



10-4 on that. One option is to stack (not coil) the cord in a 1 quart or 1 gallon ZipLock bag. When you need some just pull out what you need and cut it off. No tangles, no hassles, and it packs flat. Pre-cut lengths of a useful size, like you mentioned, are a good move too.

OK - I'm convinced. Off to buy 250' of the mil-spec stuff.

TRO

Cordage is one of the most useful things in a TSHTF. And one of the most difficult to improvise/manufacture. At least in the short term. Not having any strikes me as being unwise.


2 x 20' lengths in my back pocket's.
1 x 30' length in my bag or back pack (minimum)
And I might have at least one more 3-6' length stashed somewhere about my person.

So as you see, 100'is not unreasonable.

One thing that I do like about 550 cord is that it is very user friendly. Easy to knot and easy to undo.

I think people make too much of the mil-spec name...
What you want is REAL para-cord.
I sometimes buy mil-spec and sometimes just go to the source and buy from a rigger's store...
They have REAL para-cord in MANY variations.
If you need thinner, they have (I think) down to 4 strand. and I really like the 10 and 12 strand stuff.
That stuff is STRONG!

You do want to be sure that you get the REAL para-cord though...
A lot of what is sold does NOT have the inner strands that are each made up of two even smaller strands.
Some just has the fibers(unstranded) inside of the outer covering. This CAN be strong, but there is no guarantee...

I think its better to carry a few feet of paracord, about 100 feet of 2mm dyneema (which has a 1,000 pound plus rating, I believe) and then about 20 yards of braided spectra 20 pound fishing line.

Takes up less space than paracord, is much, much stronger than paracord, and you can use the fishing line with having to take apart your paracord.

If you're serious about survival and bushcraft why not buy a 1000' spool, one in olive drab for winter and one in white for summer. Bright orange seems like a good idea but it just turns brown as it gets dirty. You keep that spool at home or at your camp and when you need emergency cord to pack in your survival kits, you just measure it by arm spans. You need some to practice anyway. Mors Kochanski recommends 7 arm spans but that is according to his settings and predictions, like getting stuck in the boreal forest and having to build Roycroft snowshoes. Nylon paracord is ideal for lashing because of its elasticity, but you should gut it (remove the seven inner strands) in this case.

I have been using 550 cord as boot laces since 1988. I promise it will last wwwaaayyy longer than any lace that comes from the factory.

Try the 4-strand (but sometimes 5-strand; watch your sources) Type II cord, which is constructed the same but is a bit narrower in diameter.

I'm surprised at how long this thread has continued, but it seems that most like their cordage.

What are people's thoughts on using paracord for water rescue in a pinch? Someone fell through a hole in ice type scenario?

I have at least 100" of catfish string on the outside loops of my BOB. It is broken up into 25' lengths. I can't remember how long the roll is but it was a good deal at the Big Blue Retailer. It only cost a few bucks. It is rated at 330lbs. Good enough for me. Caveat: it has a tar-like coating on it. The smell and stickiness wears off in just a little while. I love the stuff.

Paracord for rescue work would be good in a pinch but obviously not the best choice. It's really thin which makes it hard to hold and it cuts into your hands. It would be even harder to use with gloves or mittens but if it's all you've got...If you're gonna be around ice a lot it would probably be a good idea to have thicker, stronger rope. Of course you also have the problem of getting the rope to the victim.

JohnE

I would use whatever I had available in a pinch!

Just like to know the limitations of some of the equipment that I carry with me.

I know that paracord doesn't like sharp jerks/bounces and tend to fail under those conditions with too much stress applied.

Any store that sells true mil-spec paracord should be able to provide a certification letter from the mill that manufactured it. A great deal of what's sold is commercial grade paracord. It's usually less expensive and available in many colors, but is not subject to the rigorous manufacturing standards and testing of mil-spec 550 cord.

OK, this is going to be a bit long winded, mostly because I am bored and not much is happening here right now.

With cordage they tell you its breaking strength. From there you start applying your safety factors.
Safety factors are simply how much stronger you need to make things for safety, they are not like gambling odds where you say it might break one out of so many times.

A safety factor of one is no safety factor at all.

If your cord says it is good for 550 lbs them a safety factor of two says only try 275 lbs.
As the cord degrades from use you might want to increase the safety factor. If what you are doing with it is more critical you increase the safety factor again.

Scaffolders built scaffold with a safety factor of 4, so everything is built at least 4 times as strong as it needs to be according to the ultimate material strengths.

Safety rigging where MY life might depend on it gets a safety factor of 10.
( ie. Massive overbuild)

So if the cord is a bit shabby, factor 2, if it matters add that, maybe not so important if it fails, so safety factor 3, jerky load, safety factor 5.
So your paracord might be trustworthy for a 110 pound load under those conditions.
If you figure a safety factor of ten because what you want it to hold matters more to you, then you are saying you trust holding 55lbs on a brand new piece of 550lbs line.

(Usually safety factor 4 is good.)

Shock loading?
You need to calculate how hard you are hitting the end of the line.
You need to understand that the Kinetic energy of a moving load can be very high and increases at the square of the speed, but only directly with the weight.
The equation, if you want it is 1/2(Mass* Velocity^2)
So the weight times the square of the speed and then divide by 2 to get how much energy needs to be absorbed when it hits the end of the rope.
The way to balance Kinetic Energy is through Force times Distance. (fp Foot Pounds energy, foot pounds torque is a different measure)
In other words; shock absorbers.

Nylon is stretchy (10% strain is normal) so it actually absorbs shock loads pretty well, but it needs to have enough length of nylon to stretch and absorb the shock.
I have seen bungee cords used as shock absorbers (think of bungee jumpers).
Climber's safety harnesses sometimes use shock absorbing links that are flat webbing folded over itself and sewn with stitches meant to tear out. It is meant to reduce the shock loads to the point a human body can withstand them.
In the pictures in this link http://www.safetysupplies.co.uk/trolleyed/21/ you can see the shock absorber in the fall arrest lanyards. It is the white block on the yellow webbing, notice it is missing from the restraint harnesses. (screamer is the slang term for the shock absorbing lanyard, the fall that stretches it and the the person that ends up dangling from it. You have about 15 minutes to get him down after he stretches his harness. After 20 minutes he might be dead from compartment syndrome.)

Oh yes, all load ratings are for new material so keep that in mind.

Then come all the rigging points, knot weaknesses and angular loads.
It can get pretty complicated if you are not careful so with rigging KISS is important.

Safety factor 2,000?

(fishing line is different. because competition test weight ratings means it is guaranteed to break at the stated test weight instead of carrying at least that weight when new.
Eight pound test fish line is supposed to break before it has eight pounds of load on it.)

Edit:
Note what paracord was designed for. You don't get much more bounce than a parachute opening with a fully equipped footsoldier hanging below it.

I carry a little, and I've never needed to use what I carry. It's the same with duct tape; I've been carrying some every day for years and never had a need for it.

I expect it depends on your lifestyle. The area I live in is populated quite densely; why build a shelter when there are so many buildings around?

The stuff I was talking about as REAL para-cord, is the stuff you get from a parachute rigging supply house...
I would imagine that is is BETTER tested than the mil-spec stuff, because: ONE, it is not 'lowest bidder' and TWO, the liability.

I think it is four strand, might have been five. I don't have any here other than some that was gutted for a braiding project. I've got a lot of core lines in a ziplock that have turned into a snarl, I might sort it out some day. *laughs*

Best bet is to call or email them.

For water work, given my druthers, I'd go with something other than nylon- it is heavier than water. :P I've got some marine utility cord, braided, about as thick as p-cord. It floats, I think it is polypro but I'm not sure. I got it for a lanyard project, but it is at my folks in my braiding box.

Get a soldering iron with a really fat tip to cut the 550 cord with. It lets you shape the ends without shaping the ends of your fingers.

I like this one.

Was more of a what-if thought as opposed to an actual need.

Ahhh... real world usage. I love it.

Not sure if you've heard about using a straw to help thread paracord. Take a short length of plastic drinking straw with one end cut at an angle (to make it pointy), and then slit all the way down the length of the straw on the side opposite the point.

Lay the end of the paracord inside the straw, overlap the long edges to make the straw thinner, and use it like the aglet on the end of a shoe lace (the plastic end that helps threading). It works well.

It might even be worth stuffing a length of straw into a kit. It can be used to thread paracord OR to suck up small amounts of water from crevases.

Ken K.

I carry 25' if just Hunting, I also carry another 20' ultilty rope to pull my gun/bow into a tree stand.

If I am hiking or camping I will carry 75-100' of cord.

I keep 100' of BlueWater 4mm accessory cord in the car. When I'm hiking or backpacking I usually carry, at least, a couple of pieces of AirCore. It's good for lowering packs and other misc tasks.

I should probably pick up some 550 just so I don't get kicked out of the club.

If there is no other choice, I'll toss anything to you. Even chain.

Maybe with the anchor on it. Be easier to bring you in that way, you don't have to grab. *evil grin*

I EDC about 40 ft. of paracord in my belt-pack and have been very glad to have it when needed.

I suppose I'm in the minority, but I have mixed feelings about paracord. It is a bit limp and squishes somewhat flat when wrapped around an object. It forms rock-hard knots that are hard to untie. I prefer a high-end braided cord of similar diameter, from the folks who make climbing gear (e.g. Mammut accessory cord). It just handles better.

I know I'm giving up the versatility of individually using the inner strands, but for that I'd rather carry a separate small spool of small-diameter line.

Steve

Always carry 50 feet of 550 cord in the daypack or the overnight backpack. Use it for rigging a poncho as a lean-to shelter and numerous other uses. Like someone said, $7 for 100 feet, cut that in half and 50 feet goes in each pack. Weight is 4 ounces on my postal scale, I think I can handle the weight.