Aha, thanks for info.

Here is one of the new 5.11 Tactical knives I have been carrying.

The "First Responder" spearpoint model.

BLADE: 3 7/16th inches long s30v stainless and G-10 scales over full steel liners that are just under 1/8th inch thick.
(shaves hair even in the serrated part)



The blade is just under 3/16th inches THICK!



5.11 Tactical refers to it as a framelock, but some quibble with that since the lock is under the scale, but with a liner lock that thick, it comes close!



The lock is dead solid, with no trace of play and hasn't budged under testing.

On the end is a "striker plate", that I guess could be used for blunt non-lethal impact, or as a glass breaker.



This is one heavy duty folder!

How about less lethal? At least less lethal than the blade end. You bring that down on someone's skull and it might well be lethal.

Yep, that's a better term. I was more thinking of pressure point style stuff, but your right, a shot to the skull with that thing could seriously ruin someones day.

Here is another 5.11 Tactical I have, it's a smaller (3 inch blade) lockback called the "Investigator" with 154CM steel.

Smaller and a bit easier to EDC, but very strongly built.

I just wish those 5.11 knives came with plain edges instead of combo's...

A frame lock, by design, would be one of the most secure locks out there. The lockbar is further stabilized by gripping and applying pressure to the handle while cutting - no other lock has that capability.

Benchmade's Axis Lock and Spyderco's Compression Lock are both very strong, and extremely reliable.

You should be able to trust any lock type as long as you're buying from a quality manufacturer (and using the knife within it's parameters).

+1 These knives are designed by Steve Tarani, and other than Karambits, I don't think I have seen one that he designed that wasn't a combo edge.

In the State of Texas, you will not believe the fine for that knife. It would be considered a butterfly knife. Class B Misdemeanor if I remember correctly.

I think that starts at $500.00 and a short stay in the slant bar motel.

Most likely it will be strider gb... It is a big knife and after opening it up it looks like a pretty decent sized fixed blade. Solid lockup, no bs knife. Used it as a pry bar, anchors, hammer anything... Only drawback? Expensive.

Your definition includes two separate things and they are not necessarily related.

Lock strength is one thing, the "safe, solid lock" part We generally use that term to denote resistance to the lock unlatching or failing when in normal use and perhaps when abused. After all, that's the whole point of having a locking blade. Of course, any lock will eventually fail and all have various failure modes. Like all things in knife design, they represent a compromise. Properly designed, and all other things being equal, there's little question that a butterfly (balisong) style design is the inherently strongest folding blade design. It has other issues that make it less than desirable in many cases, including legal concerns in some areas.

Strength while prying is a different thing entirely and not necessarily related to lock strength. This is where thicker blade steel, and the type and treatment of the steel, along with perhaps heavier and perhaps stiffer frame pieces and the pivot design all have much more influence.

That added prying strength will necessarily work against other useful attributes, such as slicing capability, what most use a knife for primarily. Thicker either requires use of a hollow grind to gain back some slicing ease or you are stuck with a geometry that is not optimized for slicing and cutting.

Just a few thoughts on the subject.

"...It would be considered a butterfly knife..."

Maybe, maybe not. If it takes both hands and four movements to open the silly looking thing, it might slide by...


"...Second, the Black Rock Hunter requires the use of both hands to make the four distinct movements required to rotate both handles 180 degrees from closed to open. The Black Rock Hunter is not a butterfly knife, gravity knife, flick knife or switchblade. It can’t be opened by a wrist snap, or any single-handed opening technique. It offers a significant margin of safety and, because of the way it’s opened, it’s legal to possess in most countries, states or jurisdictions that unreasonably ban the sale of even the most innocent one-handed openers..."