Originally Posted By: martinfocazio
OK, here's the harsh truth.
1. Money is Debt. The greater the debt, the more money banks have. They don't actually LEND you $400,000, they create $400,000 as a credit to your account, and then, figuring in your interest, they then can record an asset on the books up 9 TIMES your loan (because of interest and all that.)

True, 99% of money is just bookeeping.

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2. Credit Card Debt is Money. Sure, you might hate it, but the fact that you owe and owe and pay interest is also a critical part of the money supply. If everyone paid off their bills and lived within their means, it would be CHAOS for the economy.

True in as much as if everybody did any one thing all at one instant there would be chaos.

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4. What we have now is NOT AT ALL PHRASECENSOREDPOSTERSHOULDKNOWBETTER. - it's PHRASECENSOREDPOSTERSHOULDKNOWBETTER. - in which the Government supplies private firms with public money to the ends of furthering government power without the need for public oversight.

Funny, a "money" guru on the radio that I agree with 99% of the time was calling it PHRASECENSOREDPOSTERSHOULDKNOWBETTER. but that just didn't ring right with me. "Nationalization" is the word I'm looking for.

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5. The money spent on the bailouts so far could have provided every living American with free health care for life.

IF spent wisely. Need I say more?

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Without this bailout, things would be much much worse. But it's not PHRASECENSOREDPOSTERSHOULDKNOWBETTER.. PHRASECENSOREDPOSTERSHOULDKNOWBETTER. is a cuss word in America, it's a way of life for a huge portion of the world. I have plenty of happy, prosperous friends in places like Finland, Spain, Germany and France, all dreaded "PHRASECENSOREDPOSTERSHOULDKNOWBETTER." nations, and yet, for some reason, when I see them, they seem quite happy. They don't have health bills, they don't have to fear for their jobs (as much as we do). They pay insane taxes - 75% in Finland, and high gas prices (8.00 a gallon in the UK). In Finland, College is free.

I do business with Europeans every day. I often marvel that they can produce anything worthwile. Of course college is free, they need a college level income to tax!

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As a US Citizen, you get it into your head that "free markets" are the only way, and the Capitalism is the only real system worth following. We have nothing - nothing at all - like Capitalism here. If we did, two things would be true. First, this bailout would never have happened, but secondly, you would never have had anything like bankruptcy protections laws and you'd have debtors prisons. Also in a pure capitolist society, you'd not have a fire department or police department, public water supply, sewers, or anything like a Department of Health. baby formula killing kids? Buyer beware! Cars exploding due to defective gas lines? Buyer Beware!

My point here is that this shock to our economic system - this fake free market - is most likely the first of many to come, and the Financial Alchemy of the Wall Street Robber Barons is hardly all over.

I agree that our market is far from free, but it needs to be more free, not less. As you say, our market still produces deadly baby formula an exploding cars from time to time despite all the regulation.

In any case, life goes on, and if the sky does fall we'll figure out a way to survive. That's what ETS is all about.
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- Tom S.

"Never trust and engineer who doesn't carry a pocketknife."