I agree with the "protective coloration" idea - if security people are willing to consider a nail file as a viable weapon, imagine what they'ed make of something that looked purpose-built. I can see it now ... "OK, buddy, up against the wall and spread 'em. We've got you pegged as a terrorist because that little item that YOU called a survival kit has all these deadly weapons it it - fish hooks to put someone's eye out; a razor blade; fishing line you could strangle someone with; matches for bomb making; Portable Aqua, God knows what evil thing you were going to do with that ..."

Fish hooks and fishing line? That's nothing - what about the 86-year old retired WWII pilot who was delayed 45 minutes while the security guards tried to decide whether his Congressional Medal of Honor was a prohibited weapon? (It *does* look kind of like a Japanese throwing star, I suppose. But so what?) <img src="images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Oy veh!... Don't get me started!

Personally, I think if the guy has earned a CMoH, he's earned the right to carry any dang thing he wants on a plane or anywhere else.

He's certainly earned the right NOT to be searched/interrogated by airport rent-a-cops (even now that they're federal employees) infatuated with taking knitting needles from grandmothers and toy guns from childen.

That's an outrage!

Maybe later, when I've got more time, I'll tell you how I really feel about it.

Haha Benman here we go again LMAO.

Tell us what those so called rent a cops should check for and confiscate?

Is not so much what they are confiscating but the fact they are very strict now vs then.

I have no problem with grandma's needles being taken if it means they will catch a similarly shaped ice pick. An xacto knife blade from an altoids tin SK can be duct taped to a spoon handle and you now have a deadly weapon; its not hard to do this stuff.

Not only that the aiports provide a parcel courier service right at security so you can ship your knitting needles home to yourself if you would like. Like everything else the media takes it all out of proportion. You never hear from the media about the 1000's of real weapons found and taken every day at security STILL.

Remeber they killed thousands on 911 with $2 box cutters.

Granny will have to deal.

Mike

Oh man,

He we go again is right. I don't think we really want to get into this conversation... at least not in this forum.

The way I see it, there's two extremes... we can all get on the plane naked (that is after the full body cavity search, of course) OR we can all bring our own guns so that we can take action against anybody who tries to hijack the plane.

Guess which extreme I lean towards. (Hint: I'm pretty ugly and I don't figure anyone wants to see me naked!) <img src="images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

HAHA,

Full cavity search LMAO.

Of course there is limits. Actually there is new x-ray's close to production that goes through your clothes and into the muscle layer of your body scanning for stuff. No strip needed.

I hardly think you can equate taking knitting needles to a body cavity search. BTW customs do strip searches and cavity searches all the time.

I agree tho there should be limits too.

Mike

Actually I wasn't trying to equate the two... I was simply kidding about what happens if you take this security thing to its logical conclusion. I've often found that you can assess the merit of one idea vs. the other by looking at the extreme cases of each and asking which you're more comfortable with. I was just trying to keep it light and fun.

BTW, in my mind, the x-ray thing is still just a high tech way of looking at me naked and probing me. So the question becomes how much of your personal privacy are you willing to give up in the name of "security"?

I certainly hope that we can agree that taking a 2" toy rifle from a kids G.I. Joe doll because it "resembles" a firearm in nothing less than ludicrous. It's the total loss of common sense in this country that disturbs me more than anything.

And it is costing us our freedoms, just to tie in the survival angle here, how many times has it been discussed what part of our survival kits, FAK's, leatherman tools, card tools, etc. have to be left behind just because we're getting on a plane? This is stuff that people on this board choose to carry every day to feel a little safer, and we're being told by our government that we're not allowed to do it under certain conditions.

It IS a problem, and its going to be a bigger problem before people start using a little common sense.

Dang it! I said I wasn't gonna let you get me on my soap box and now I've started spewing again... why do you keep doing this to me, Mike? <img src="images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

You crack me up Ben. <img src="images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Yes the GI joe thng is a little much.

The thought of you getting probed is a little much too LMAO.

I would draw the line at anything knife like sharp that could be used as a weapon. As far as x-ray under my clothes, I couldn't give a rats ass to be honest. If it gets me to Vegas quicker on vacation I'm all for it. Trust me, whats under my clothes is truely forgetable anyway haha.

I like you on your soapbox, you look all regal and such haha.

Mike

Boys, boys!

Certainly the airport security process catches and removes many true weapons daily and it always has. It may be catching more now because it is stricter - That much may be a good thing. There are other items that are not safe on an airplane simply due to the airpressure changes that occur. Cans of aresol can break and make a pretty mess of your luggage etc.

Certainly with any security process you will have specified, standards and guidelines combined with the personal judgement of the individual on the spot. Officers occasionally shoot the wrong persons, such as a kid pointing at them with a water pistol at the wrong time and place. Airport security "rent-a-cops" become overzealous occasionally and the current guidelines may be too strict. Flying remains the safest way to get from point A to point B even with terrorism (which isn't new BTW).

If someone gets in my car for a ride accross town I won't put it in gear without everyone putting on their seatbelt. My choice, My vehicle - You can put on the seatbelt or walk. The airliners don't want armed individuals on their planes and never have. Leave your weapons or walk your choice. The government doesn't want airliners turned into WMD either so they will help the airlines disarm their passengers.

Many things are good in small doses that are not good in the extreme. Policy and medicine share this. It is good to have armed officers with the authorization to shoot bad-guys. It is good to be able to change the definition of who the bad-guys are as society changes. It is not right to take that to the extreme of having the Jack-Booted SS arrive at your door at 5:00 am and drag you off because someone declared you to be a bad-guy without informing you.

RANT ON<img src="images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> Just as we expect the security beauracracy to be capable of being flexible enough to work with citizens in changing the definition of bad-guys we must be flexible enough to work with their attempts to support the mandate given them by the people that they represent (which in the US is the citizenry - after all you voted didn't you? Well, so did your neighbors and if you disagree with the majority of your neighbors, take it up with them, change their minds, inform them of the consequences of their choices, print a newspaper, run a public access TV show, run for office, print pamphlets, run a website or simpley get out a real soap-box and stand in town center but don't blame the officers that are enforcing the orders given them by the people who were voted in to represent the majority of the voting citizens.) RANT OFF

Sadly, General Joe Foss died in January, 2003. At one time he was America's leading air Ace in the pacific : 26 confirmed kills and in a F4F Wildcat that was hopelessly inferior to the Zero. He also served as Governor of one of the western states. Perhaps his membership on the board of governors of the NRA recognized him as a terrorist threat, particularly as he was carrying that "throwing star", er Congressional Medal of Honor.