Hacksaw - My point is that many plants in the "ornamental" garden are just as edible and nutricious as plants in the vegetable garden. Don't forget the forage possibilities of the front yard and lawn area!

Edible plants to consider.

Amaranth. Big flowers, the seeds from which pop like popcorn, with some edible leaves.

Chufa. Looks like grass, grows a tuber that looks like a small potato. Turkey love this stuff. Won't survive your winter, but should be fine in summer.

Alium: Onion family.

Hi Hacksaw,

Please let me know how your experience was buying/shipping from Bens Backwoods, I have been eyeing some of his stuff and thinking about placing an order.

Thanks,

Mike

So far so good. Ben contacted me personally to let me know my order was delayed slightly because he was camping with his family...seems like a real genuine guy. It shipped last Monday should be here any day.

Speaking of experiences, I ordered from Ben to get the Puukko & Leuku combo knives I wanted. I first contacted Ragnar at Ragweed Forge to get that and an Aito Puukko but he has yet to get back to me and it's been 3 weeks+. Anybody know if he's out of town or something?

Trip wire stuff... well, good ole eyes work. I've also read that Silly String is quite the rage in Iraq for looking for trip wires. A quick squirt, and it'll drape over wires without setting them off. It helps that it'll spray 8-10 feet.

I hang a large washer with kite string (white) from the tip of my rifle as a trip wire detector when I am going through strange woods.

In my opinion, anyone who thinks that they can "live off the land" has better read "Into the Wild" 4 or 5 times.

A few days? Maybe. A Few weeks? Pretty good. Months? Not likely.

For me, the most important thing to consider for LTS is how well you can form a tribe, a coalition, a community, a village.

Incomplete hypothetical, Martin. LTS after what?

I think training in primitive skills, and use of modern survival gear, can extend survival. How long an extension is part of your planning.

Without a well-thought out and provisioned survival retreat in an area that can sustain some agriculture, some hunting, and some foraging, there is little chance for LTS on your own. Every other scenario leaves you dependent on others by definition.

As social animals most of us aren't going to want to survive in isolation for long anyway. After whatever survival scenario, we are going to seek connections and try to start some version of community.

What can we do if we lose the trappings of what we consider normal society, except live off the land directly or through mutual effort with our fellows?

Edit: this is way beyond what a BOB is all about.

I think I need to clarify one thing. My original post said nothing about living out of this pack for ever. The term I used was indeterminate meaning you can never be sure just how long you're going to have to fend for yourself in such a situation.

I'm not a 'survival property'/stockpile/etc (that's borderline crazy to me...no offense intended) type but I like to be prepared for the unexpected and planning like this helps me to be prepared for events I can plan for.

Hacksaw,

Here are a few ideas for sustainability in your BoB.

For a stove, consider the Bushbuddy. It's a wood gasification stove (no fan or batteries needed) that is pretty efficient. A bit pricy IMO but possibly worth the money ($95Cad to $105.45Cad, depending on where you live.) when it comes to durability and fuel sustainability. If you understand the principles involved and you are a bit "crafty", you can make your own out of a couple cans, a couple pieces of hardware cloth and some JB Weld.

Bushbuddy compact wood burning stove.

YouTube Video of the Bushbuddy

For water purification consider a Millbank type filter bag. Combined with boiling, chemical purifiers or a jury rigged solar shower and activated charcoal filter (Water from the Millbank drips into the solar shower and through a charcoal filter cartridge for a refrigerator’s water dispenser/ice maker attached to the output hose for the shower, the purified water then drips into your pot, canteen or hydration pouch.) a Millbank would give you all the potable water you’ll need in above freezing temperatures or if used inside a heated shelter. Add an MSR Miox or a SteriPEN for final treatment (if you’re not boiling, treating with chemicals or shower/filter rig) or water sources free of chemical/heavy metal pollution and you’re good to go.

For a dietary fat source consider a bottle of extra virgin olive oil. It doesn't need refrigeration even after being opened as long as it's kept shaded and relatively cool (Think bottle cozy with evaporation cooling attached to the outside of your pack in warm weather.). A tablespoon, maybe as little as a teaspoon in your food every couple-three days should stave off "rabbit starvation" for quite awhile so a quart would last for at least a few months, more than long enough to find additional sources of dietary fat. Nuts are a good source of fats, if you have edible nuts in your area. Raccoon, skunk, woodchucks and other middle-sized critters get pretty fat in late fall but nothing beats beaver tails for a high fat tasty treat, unless you can trap or shoot a bear.