WHat you guys think? I like the idea of Spot and lower initital investment with coolness factor (tracking, ok signal, etc). But ACR equipment seems like it's more of the pro-rescue type thing.

I ocean kayak, backcountry ski, hike, scuba and climb. I never been in the situation when I needed it but you never know. I got stuck few times kayaking where it would have been nice to have a piece of mind just in case.

Polak187,

Take a close look at Doug's review of both items. It may help you more clearly define your needs and what each product can/cannot do for you.

My 2 cents

I read them mate. I just still cant decide. Story of my life. Was looking for more of the actual field, prolonged use feedback.

No field experience here. Wasn't sure if you had had the time to look it up. By the looks of your photo I'm guessing that long days are the norm for you.

As a side: Thanks for your public service.

I like the fact that the Spot has functions which are 1/2 way. You can call for help, call home and let your wife know you made it OK, show your progress on Google maps, or call in the cavalry if things are really bad. An ACR is all or nothing and always pulls out all the stops.

I have been swamped, so have still not written the update. It is high on the list... But, in summary, I would not yet bet my life on SPOT. SPOT offers a lot of nifty features, and commercial distress alerting with these many features, in generic terms, has the potential for offering advantages to many, but in terms of robustness and reliability in my testing and that associates who have tried it, it has not proven itself to be as good as a 406 MHz beacon. We've numerous instances when it should have gotten though in tracking mode, but didn't and for long periods of time. We have numerous instances where in alerting mode it did not go through. Difficult, but not terrible situations, and ones I am confident a 406 M<Hz signal would have been picked up. The reliance on GPS for position is another significant downside. If you know the GPS will not be challenged where you travel, this may not be a factor.

Moreover, their GEOS call center is still not integrated adequately into the SAR system, IMO. I will be attending a SPOT press day at GEOS early next month and will perhaps have a better feel for this after attending.

This is not to say that SPOT won't likely work in most distress instances within its design range. It will save lives (has already) and with a low price point for initial purchase is bound to get better market penetration, which will also result in lives saved. This is all good. It may well be adequate for many people. However, I'm not yet willing to bet lives on "may be adequate for most" at this point. So, for the present time, my recommendation continues to be for a 406 MHz PLB unless you are confident that your use won't be very challenging to SPOT. In that case, SPOT may be a more affordable (at least in the short term) answer and/or the tracking and other features SPOT offers may be worthwhile in and of themselves.

I am not convinced that the HELP feature (a call to friends instead of SAR) has all that much real world utility as currently implemented. In many situations, you cannot go out, get into some sort of undefined trouble, then hit HELP, and expect it to solve the problem. May work OK on a road trip, but perhaps not so well on a backpacking trip. It will take some significant planning on your part to make that a practical option. And, the Check OK thing can be handy, BUT what happens when your mom doesn't get the expected OK signal from you because SPOT didn't do its thing? Because it is one way comm only, this has the potential to create unintended consequences.

I was in your situation and elected to get the ACR Microfix for many of the reasons stated by Doug above. The deciding factor for me was my frequent trips to the canyonlands of Utah where getting a GPS fix is extremely difficult.

I'm also waiting for what I call "Spot 2.0" which should include text messaging capability. The technology is already in place and should not be expensive to implement. When they do that, I will get one and carry it beside my Microfix.

+1 for the PLB with the on-board GPS.

As I'm sure you know, the two cost almost exactly the same, so cost isn't an issue.

When I carry my PLB (the older, slightly fatter ACR AeroFix with the TerraFix connector - long story) I carry it for its rescue capability.

I don't feel a need to check-in or be tracked. As a matter of fact I don't like that thought at all. As long as I'm carrying the PLB my family and friends know I'll bet help when/if I need it.

From a design perspective I like knowing that the PLB is designed to be tough as nails and that it treats battery life as if it were gold ... as if my life depended on it (and it would, if needed).

Ken K.

ACR Microfix it is than. Thanks Guys.

I'll second the vote for the ACR. I'm part of a team that did an evaluation of the SPOT for another publication (just out this week) and our consensus was that it had serious shortcomings, and none of us would trust our life to it at this point.

Issues included poor GPS reception and performance, erratic transmission of requests, and a very poor UI (that is, blinking LEDs that require memorization or carrying a reference card, and even then aren't particularly clear or useful, combined with less-than-ideal buttons and command sequences).

I have a ACR Microfix on order from REI so this is a done deal...


But have you heard of Spot 2.0? There was a rumor on some other forum about it with capability of sending specific text like messages and better GPS. I mean I go away to get away so dont care for much communication portion but I still like updated tracking and gps functions... I mean I get tracking with my GPS anyway but that'sa fter the fact. I would like the supercool where is Matt now feature.

They have been working on "SPOT 2.0" since they started delivering SPOT. As with any version 1.0, SPOT has plenty of room for improvement and they are expected to address many of the concerns. Some will take longer to address or are impossible. Better GPS is good, but it doesn't mean you will always get a GPS location. Better interface is good. Text messages, either canned or otherwise will help a lot. This is simply the natural progression of the technology. Look to GPS itself for an expectation of how things will go. Look also for other options from other providers as well in the not too distant future.

All will have their pros and cons. The key is educating the consumer, a very difficult job.

Since REI has a long estimated shipping date and I was by few camping stores I decided to spend some extra money and grab it from them therfore supporting local economy and blowing my tax return. First store had a display model to play with but no stock. Second store... Well that deserves a write up:

Me: Hi you guys have the ACR Mircofix in stock?
Guy: What's that?
Me: You know the Personal Locator type of the thing.
Guy: Like GPS?
Me: Sort of.
Guy: Hold on. Raul!!!!!!
(Story gets repeated 3 times until a mole comes out of the basement office)
Mole:I'm an expert of special orders and know it all. Can I help you?
Me: Yes looking for ACR Microfix.
Mole: Not in stock. We ordered them from the company and they never came. Obviously they have problems with them.
Me: Really which model?
Mole: They have a high-end one and low-end one. Both are crap.
Me: Really how so?
Mole: We had it in the store and tried it few times and it wasnt that accurate.
Me. Really you activated emergency mode in the store?
Mole: Yeah and it didn't work.
Me: I thought you couldn't do test emergency transmitions since there is a test button for battery only but not emergency "check-in" test.
Mole: Oh no it's all good but it didn't work. Company is having problems and they don't ship the units out so it's not safe.
Me: Well I read articles about it and it seems pretty good.
Mole: Have you used it?
Me: No but...
Mole: Well it doesn't work plus batteries die fast.

(so this goes on and on for about 5 min when guy tells me that it doesn't work and software is bad (windows based) and batteries are bad and it is not good for scuba diving and that it is heavy and so on)

Me: Wow I didn't know that so I guess the bottom line is can you order one for me and how much is it?
Mole: Expensive man and takes a long time. But what you want is a good gps and a sat phone.
Me: It's more expensive than good gps and a sat phone?
Mole: Yup.
Me: Wow I didn't know that I thought they were in $600 range.
Mole: No they are thousands of dollars that's why we dont stock them but they don't work I told you.
Me: Well thank you sir it's been the most educational experience ever I cant wait to tell my friends about it.
Mole: Ok need anything else?
Me: All good just making sure we are talking about ACR Microfix PLB, right?
Mole: Yup the same one...

WOW!

That pretty much sums up every experience I have had when asking for more than the obvious in REI!

I really prefer going to Sportsmens Warehouse, Cabelas, and Bass Pro to get more informed purchases.

I was looking at the SPOT more for helping on local elk hunts. It would be a nice way to get the rest of the hauling crew out to exactly where the harvested elk and I are - without me having to hike out to an area that has cell reception. The time could be better spent quartering the elk and getting it ready for hauling out of the mountain forests.

Thats the problem with an 'Emergency Button'. Sounds like 'Mole' was somewhat like Father Dougal McGuire in the Father Ted Episode called Flight into Terror.

http://www.veoh.com/videos/v204207kKgSdjEC?searchId=98810441951791797&rank=2

Seems to me Matt ran into the kind of help available in many stores in NYC, clueless.

That is too funny. I haven't heard such a load of BS since I retired from the Sheriff's Dept. The stuff people will tell you to stay out of jail. I hope you put the store on your "never set foot inside again" list.

Craig.

Wow, all I can say is: ACR MicroFix at Aeromedix

SPOT could be handy for us that snowmobile, atv, and 4x4 in the snow and non-snow.... great if you need a spare part and want to save time from hiking hrs then driving hours. You could use SPOT to alert for 'help' or you rown custom canned txt like 'need parts'. This could come in really handy. Although you could always use a radio for this too.

It will be interesting to see where this technology goes.

You could if it had the capability for text messaging. Unfortunately, SPOT does not.

I think spot has one very useful feature.
From what I understand it can be set to automatically send your position at set intervals. This could be useful if you are overdue and it shows you as not having moved in a while.
If you were unconscious, this would allow someone to determine that you were in trouble and where you were. A normal PLB will not activate when you are unconscious.

Yeah but it only does it for 24hrs and than you have to prompt it to do it again. Still useful.

I don't know man. Every now and than I'm still looking at that Spot. People at Backpackers forum think that this is the best thing since sliced bread and many supporters are actual users and some are retired or still active SAR workers.

I'm all about supporting local moms and pops stores. In todays day and age internet became so convinient that we forget to help out little guys. My local shop has all the gear I need with prices lower than major chains but conversation like the one I had about ACR just proves my old point and that is to know my stuff when I go in there. I've been buying equipment there since 1998 and will for as long as they are open but I just need to be an educated customer.

Bro Aeromedix and Matt don't mix. I stick to Rei and local shops.

Matt -

Our review with extensive field testing is up at backpackinglight.com, in case you want to check it out (subscription required, though).

Doug - feel free to remove this if it's not appropriate to post here.

Bottom line: we didn't feel comfortable recommending the Spot, and none of the four testers were interested in keeping one after the review (even for free).

I paid a visit to my local outfitter and was provided a comparison table (assumed to have been prepared by ACR) that was very helpful. Apparently some ACR rep left it there so take it with a grain of salt:

cost of ownership over 5 yrs
ACR: $499-699
Spot: $644-1517

purchase price
ACR: $499-699
Spot: $149-169

Base fee per year/5years
ACR: na/na
Spot: $99/$495

Fee for realtime tracking
ACR: n/a
Spot: $49

Fee for $100k coverage/yr
ACR: n/a
Spot: $8
note: in the US, a fee is not normally charged to be rescued. 406 PLB owners may purchase it on open market.

Fee for policy for 5 years
ACR: n/a
spot: $608

Satellite system
ACR: COSPAS-SARSAT
Spot: Globalstar

Satellite type
ACR: GEOSAR, LEOSAR
spot: globalstar low orbiting

Antenna
ACR: 1 for GPS, 1 for distress message transm.
spot: 1 for gps reception and distress

Transmission Power
ACR: 5W
spot: 400mW
Note: ACR PLB has a 12.5X more powerful transmitter

Transmission type
ACR: GPS (lat/lon), 406MHz (Doppler), 121.5MHz (homing)
spot: GPS, 911 Alert

Battery Chemistry/life/warranty
ACR: Li+/5 yr off/5 yr
spot: AA 1.5 Li+, or Alkaline/1yr 0n/1 yr

GPS Failur backup
ACR: Doppler
spot: none

Homing freq
ACR: 121.5
spot: none

Emergency routing
ACR: Air Force Rescue Coord Ctr to local SAR
spot: SPOT GEOS call center, then local SAR.if no gps, only emergency contacts will be notified.

Sources: SPOT Website, SPOT data sheet, ACR website, ACR data sheet.

FAILURE RATE?

One interesting issue that is not discussed is the failure rate of each. How often do each fail to provide the communication they promise?

BACKGROUND: I bought the ACR PLB and carry it where ever I go. When the SPOT was released, I studied the data sheets with the intent to resell them in your store. I wasn't sold on what I read.

Then came the real test. We were promised a real live test from SPOT. I posted the results under "SPOT FAILS UNDER PRESSURE on 07/06/08" John Dark from SPOT said "What Problem".

Last weekend was the clincher. A kayaker dripped into our store for a beer. Wet from just running the Payette River from Smiths Ferry to Ponderosa Sports. I was surprised he was still alive. It is one bad stretch of river.

He was playing with my demo ACR PLB and had some questions. He seemed quite involved in the technology. Then he pops up with the fact he has a SPOT. He was quite impressed with it. I thought, with this data, that my interest in the SPOT would be refueled. He had used it quite a bit.

I asked him how it worked. He said it worked quite well if he got a connection! I said what? He stated that on the Payette River that flows straight North to South with NO CANYON WALLS, there was often 20 minutes that he could not get connection! We went out to the parking lot and sure enough it was still on and still searching. Lucky he was drinking a beer instead of requesting a RESCUE OR DEATH call.

Please post your FAILURE EXPERIENCES. Has anyone ever had an ACR PLB fail to request a rescue?

Relative to price, I chose the least expensive route with the most reliable service. I was surprised that the cheapest one also provided the highest potential of rescue.

I chose the ACR PLB. The SPOT was much more expensive and far less reliable.