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#131768 - 05/01/08 05:43 PM Fossett widow to be billed for search
harstad Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 03/04/04
Posts: 71
Quote:



CARSON CITY, Nev. (AP) - Gov. Jim Gibbons intends to bill the widow of missing multimillionaire adventurer Steve Fossett for $687,000 the state spent in searching for the famed aviator last fall, a spokesman said.

Gibbons spokesman Ben Kieckhefer told the Las Vegas Review-Journal it was his understanding that the governor will bill Peggy Fossett for costs of the unsuccessful search.

Fossett, 63, took off Sept. 3 from Barron Hilton's Flying M Ranch, south of Yerington, in a small plane on what was supposed to be a short pleasure flight.

During a monthlong search, ground crews, the Nevada National Guard and the Civil Air Patrol scoured a 20,000 square-mile area, but turned up no sign of Fossett or his plane.

Hilton, the hotel magnate, later voluntarily sent the state a check $200,000 to cover some of the search costs.

Fossett was declared legally dead Feb. 15 by an Illinois judge. In making that determination, Cook County Circuit Court Judge Jeffery Malak said Fossett left a "vast," eight-figure estate.

Billing someone for the costs of a search is unusual.

On Tuesday, before Kieckhefer revealed the governor's plans, state Emergency Management Director Frank Siracusa said state and local government search and rescue workers have a long-standing tradition of not charging when they hunt for missing persons, even for multimillionaires such as Steve Fossett.

"We do not charge the rich or the poor," Siracusa said. "There is no precedent where government will go after people for costs just because they have money to pay for it. You get lost, and we look for you. It is a service your taxpayer dollars pay for."

But Siracusa added that the final decision on whether Peggy Fossett would be billed rested with the governor, who since January has cut state spending to deal with a budget shortfall projected to top $900 million by mid-2009.

The Fossetts lived part time in Beaver Creek.

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#131774 - 05/01/08 06:00 PM Re: Fossett widow to be billed for search [Re: ]
BobS Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 02/08/08
Posts: 924
Loc: Toledo Ohio
Yea it looks like they are doing this only because they have money. I hope they fight it and win. This could lead down the wrong road and cause real problems in the future for a wide range of people.
_________________________



You can run, but you'll only die tired.


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#131777 - 05/01/08 06:31 PM Re: Fossett widow to be billed for search [Re: BobS]
haertig Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/13/05
Posts: 2322
Loc: Colorado
It might be one thing if the widow requested additional searches above and beyond the norm. But if not, and they normally don't charge people for this, then I'd probably just ignore the bill. If the states wants to pursue that non-payment into court, so be it. You'd think they'd have to show why one person should be billed and not another.

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#131778 - 05/01/08 06:38 PM Re: Fossett widow to be billed for search [Re: BobS]
Hacksaw
Unregistered


Yup. Once the precident is set it could become that famous american stereotype come true:

"You'd like us to look for your lost husband ma'am? Please make the deposit check out to..."

"I'm afraid we had to use the helicopter to bring in catering for the searchers...that'll be an additional charge."


I know how tight money can be for a volunteer organization but as a SAR responder I'd feel bad enough about not finding anything let alone knowing that the guys widow got billed for the trouble.

Makes me wonder if maybe the effort was a bit of a SNAFU and now they're trying to cover their mistakes with cash. He's a high profile millionaire and I'd bet that there were so many chef's in the kitchen during the search that they couldn't have found his plane if it had crashed into them. I'd also bet they kept going long after they knew they should have quit because of the publicity of failing. Most searches in these parts are done in 4 hours. Gone are the days of multi-week and month long searches...the organization and management techniques are too good and the technology has improved a great deal.

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#131780 - 05/01/08 07:29 PM Re: Fossett widow to be billed for search [Re: ]
weldon Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 09/09/05
Posts: 64
I'm going to go out on a limb here... and probably get a lot of people upset with me, but I don't see paying for someone to come and look for you as such a bad thing. I'm not saying this trolling or anything like that. I know accidents happen but it takes resources to rescue people. Why should taxpayers foot the entiere bill. Especially if there is negligence involved on the individuals part.

I have been part of several S&R operations, 3 people I've been out in a group with, 1 person I was in the vicinity and have spent time looking for people on 2 different occasions. On all 6 of those occasions some negligence contributed to the injury of the individual or in the individual getting lost. Perhaps if there was a monetary incentive people would be a little more prepared and careful when out and playing around.

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#131783 - 05/01/08 07:34 PM Re: Fossett widow to be billed for search [Re: weldon]
frediver Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 215
Loc: N.Cal.
I think they would have better luck in the billing process IF they had found remains or the crash site.
How can they bill for a job they did not finish or complete?

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#131784 - 05/01/08 07:34 PM Re: Fossett widow to be billed for search [Re: weldon]
Nishnabotna Offline
Icon of Sin
Addict

Registered: 12/31/07
Posts: 512
Loc: Nebraska
I wouldn't pay the plumber if he didn't fix my pipes, so I wouldn't pay the SAR if they don't find my lost husband.

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#131791 - 05/01/08 08:02 PM Re: Fossett widow to be billed for search [Re: weldon]
paramedicpete Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 04/09/02
Posts: 1920
Loc: Frederick, Maryland
First, is the tradition by which we, as a nation provide for emergency response, it is a public service. Generally, we do not charge for fire, police and rescue services, except through taxes. Until recently, most communities did not even charge for EMS services, although this has changed, when health insurance plans and Medicaid/Medicare started to provide payment for EMS services. The rich should not get one level of public service and the poor another, so we disperse the cost for these services though taxes.

In many cases, the recipients of SAR services are not the ones to have asked for the service. I am not sure of legal issues surrounding the request by a third party for services and then charging for that service to an individual or group of individuals who never requested the service. Even if I am the one to request SAR services and have to pay for the service, do I not then have the right to select the organization I want to provide the service, perhaps one with greater resources and success, as well as the level of response? It is not realistic or practical to start designating whom you want to provide the service, so cost recovery then becomes a monopoly. Unless we have previously contracted with private provides of emergency protective/provider services (which does exist), there should be no exclusivity of provider services.

Pete

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#131792 - 05/01/08 08:17 PM Re: Fossett widow to be billed for search [Re: weldon]
raydarkhorse Offline
Addict

Registered: 01/27/07
Posts: 510
Loc: on the road 10-11 months out o...
Originally Posted By: weldon
I'm going to go out on a limb here... and probably get a lot of people upset with me, but I don't see paying for someone to come and look for you as such a bad thing. I'm not saying this trolling or anything like that. I know accidents happen but it takes resources to rescue people. Why should taxpayers foot the entiere bill. Especially if there is negligence involved on the individuals part.

I have been part of several S&R operations, 3 people I've been out in a group with, 1 person I was in the vicinity and have spent time looking for people on 2 different occasions. On all 6 of those occasions some negligence contributed to the injury of the individual or in the individual getting lost. Perhaps if there was a monetary incentive people would be a little more prepared and careful when out and playing around.

So we only send SAR out for those that can afford it? Or do we charge every one foe the SAR teams that search for people? What happens if the person lost dosen't have the resources to pay for a SAR team does he/she just get left where they are?

My main problem with this is no one has been charged before why is she being charged. There was a larger search put on for Fossett than for any ole Joe Blow the Ragman off the street. If she requested searches and/or teams above the ordinary then yes she should cover those cost but not the entire search.
_________________________
Depend on yourself, help those who are not able, and teach those that are.

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#131794 - 05/01/08 08:31 PM Re: Fossett widow to be billed for search [Re: weldon]
harstad Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 03/04/04
Posts: 71
Originally Posted By: weldon
I'm going to go out on a limb here... and probably get a lot of people upset with me, but I don't see paying for someone to come and look for you as such a bad thing. I'm not saying this trolling or anything like that. I know accidents happen but it takes resources to rescue people. Why should taxpayers foot the entiere bill. Especially if there is negligence involved on the individuals part.

I have been part of several S&R operations, 3 people I've been out in a group with, 1 person I was in the vicinity and have spent time looking for people on 2 different occasions. On all 6 of those occasions some negligence contributed to the injury of the individual or in the individual getting lost. Perhaps if there was a monetary incentive people would be a little more prepared and careful when out and playing around.


While I appreciate the notion that the taxpayers should not pay for searches, it is just short sighted and misguided. Searches are costly and charging for them would mean only people who could afford it are going to be rescued. Rescuing someone and saving them is more important than money most of the time. Also, in this case where was the negligence? Because he flew in an experimental plane? What about the Cessna that goes down? "Well, they decided to fly over the mountains". Charging is the wrong thing to do.

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