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#131506 - 04/29/08 07:26 PM Mantracking /Sign cutting lights
Hacksaw
Unregistered


Recently I've taken a strong interest in tracking and signcutting with my SAR organization. The head tracking instructor swears by tracking in low light using colored lights to highlight features differently in the terrain.

This got me to thinking about buying some colored lights to practice with. I'm hesitant to spend the money because I'm color blind and don't see reds, yellows, and greens like everybody else does.

This gives me advantages and disadvantages. While I don't see the same color everybody else sees...because I see them differently, I'm prone to picking up details others miss...it's well documented that many color blind people are better at seeing through the natural camo of animals for example.

Because of my color deficient eyes, I wonder how the different lights could benefit me in different ways than a normal person, or hinder me. They could help me overcome any deficiencies that my disability brings into the mix. Unfortunately there's not a lot of solid research done on this and I'm slowly coming to the conclusion that the only option is to try it all out and see what works for me...the typical approach for color blind people since there are so many different types of color blindness...and in differing severities.

Okay, I'm getting off topic. Do any of you SAR types know of any good, inexpensive colored LED flashlights which are good for mantracking or signcutting?

Right now I'm looking at the following:


Any of you have any other options or opinions?

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#131512 - 04/29/08 07:52 PM Re: Mantracking /Sign cutting lights [Re: ]
Taurus Offline
Addict

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 458
Loc: Northern Canada
I have only tracked actual people with NVGs which is a whole different story, but I track game constantly.

I would recommend a Browning Black ice multi-colour LED headlamp used WITH a high lumen output white LED handheld.
The black ice gives good hands free operation, which I like when tracking through thick brush and trying to protect my face and keep my balance.

You get white LEDs x 3(fairly bright)
green- good for map reading and shows up depressions in the ground well(footprints)

red-mostly to preserve night vision and as a good light to use when trying not to spook game(deer don't see well in this spectrum)

blue- this is what I mostly use to track, as blood jumps out at you when viewed under blue light. Shadows fall more noticeably as well allowing you to see trails etc more clearly.

They are not terribly expensive lights, and you can find them all over Edmonton.

But... hunting is different than SAR. Unless the guy is bleeding..... eek

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#131516 - 04/29/08 08:06 PM Re: Mantracking /Sign cutting lights [Re: ]
wildman800 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 2851
Loc: La-USA
For experimental purposes, try a US Army or Navy surplus flashlight. They come with different colored lenses.
_________________________
QMC, USCG (Ret)
The best luck is what you make yourself!

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#131517 - 04/29/08 08:10 PM Re: Mantracking /Sign cutting lights [Re: ]
haertig Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/13/05
Posts: 2322
Loc: Colorado
Do you have a "normal" flashlight - a MagLight perhaps - and some B/W photographic filters? Or know someone who does (or did) B/W film photography and has a few filters you could borrow? Reds, yellows, greens, blues, there are tons of B/W colored filters available - just hold the filter over the flashlight lens and test to see what you can or cannot see using that color.

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#131519 - 04/29/08 08:13 PM Re: Mantracking /Sign cutting lights [Re: haertig]
Nishnabotna Offline
Icon of Sin
Addict

Registered: 12/31/07
Posts: 512
Loc: Nebraska
Walmart or Target will have some inexpensive flashlights that come with colored filters. Not great, but would get you the general idea.

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#131522 - 04/29/08 08:28 PM Re: Mantracking /Sign cutting lights [Re: Nishnabotna]
Hacksaw
Unregistered


Thanks for the feedback Taurus. I'm not a hunter (not yet anyhow) but mantracking is very similar in principal...and even easier many times. Animals are careful...people are clumsy.

I'll check out those brownings. now that you mention it, I'd heard they made animal tracking lights but it didn't come to mind this time. I think Gerber has some too but they're UV blood lights only. The one light on my list (the 10 color one) I found on eBay ultra cheap just now so I may get it just to try since it wouldn't cost me much more than buying some cheapies. Plus in my case, I may benefit from using colors that are of no benefit to the average person...and this will help me discover that (if I order them).

At $60 a pop, the Inova's are nice lights but to buy 4 wouldn't be practical or anywhere's close to my price range.

Putting a filter on my mag light is an option but the problem with most of my lights is that they are all LED and have bad hot spots in the center of the beam...which is super bad for mantracking. I've seen the beam pattern of all the lights I referenced in the original post and while some aren't very powerful, all are very well dispersed.

I just hope the theory that color blind people have better night vision is true...I've never really put that to the test but now I have a reason to.

If anybody has any other suggestions I'm game to hear them...even if I order these lights I'd still like to try a few brands even if I have to beg or borrow to do so.

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#131529 - 04/29/08 09:20 PM Re: Mantracking /Sign cutting lights [Re: ]
Taurus Offline
Addict

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 458
Loc: Northern Canada
Quote:
I just hope the theory that color blind people have better night vision is true...I've never really put that to the test but now I have a reason to.



you have a unique situation there dude. How well do you see from NVGs if you are colorblind? any difference looking at things tinted green?

The Gerber tracking light is called a carnivore. I think its o.k but I can do just as well with blue LED. Sometimes people get too focused on trying to find blood when tracking game when they are missing other obvious signs. Thats why I like the ability to switch colors. sometimes what you see under blue is totally different when you look at it under red light. (like a map)

good luck with the searching. Just another bit of gear to go nuts over trying to decide on smile

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#131532 - 04/29/08 09:51 PM Re: Mantracking /Sign cutting lights [Re: Taurus]
Hacksaw
Unregistered


I did a lot of reading on color blindness last night. I have since I was first diagnosed but never in this context until yesterday.

Turns out that color blind people can be better hunters because we look more for shape than color which helps us defeat camo and natural cover...likely how the genetic trait survived all these years.

It also turns out that during WWII it was pretty much unheard of to have arial photo's viewed/analysed without a color blind person on the team also examining the photos...for pretty much the same reason...we just pick up different things.

The nightvision thing is a bit more sketchy. The idea is that with with one part of the retina weakened, the other parts step up (like a blind person hearing better)...not sure how true that is though.

Makes me wonder. I hope it makes me some kind of tracking savant though I know that's highly unlikely wink

I've never used NVGs but I may get the chance soon. I've been told they're not very good for mantracking and are only really useful for military use where you can't use flashlights to pick up sign. For my use I can have as many lights as I want so NVG isn't really practical...especially if I'm using a pair and somebody flashes me with their flashlight...I've heard that's not fun.

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#131540 - 04/29/08 10:48 PM Re: Mantracking /Sign cutting lights [Re: ]
Mogg Offline
Stranger

Registered: 01/23/08
Posts: 12
You might want to consider the coast four color recon:

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index....rentPage=search

Mogg
_________________________
If you can keep your head
When others around you are
losing theirs, then you
must be the one
with the axe.

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#131541 - 04/29/08 10:55 PM Re: Mantracking /Sign cutting lights [Re: ]
dweste Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 02/16/08
Posts: 2463
Loc: Central California
Not sure if this is significant for this discussion.

An eye doctor, I belive his name is Kyama?, wrote a book called What Fish See. In it he describes the use of color filters to duplicate various underwater conditions to anayze how fishing lures look underwater.

BUT one point he makes in passing is that to get true colors you cannot just use any filters over a flashlight. Just because you have a a filter that looks red or yellow to you, the light it produces when light passes through it may not be what you think, especially if the light itself is not pure white.

I heard him give a lecture in which he described how hard it was for him to find the right filters, pure white lights, etc. - most being either a bit blue or yellow. Of course he was being ultra scientific and mesuring wave lengths, etc.

Important? A nitpick? Dunno.

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