#124758 - 02/22/08 12:45 AM
Re: Shot fired and a hit on the satellite according to
[Re: Art_in_FL]
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Old Hand
Registered: 11/27/06
Posts: 707
Loc: Alamogordo, NM
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LOL.
Fairly recently the Chinese shot one of their satellites. And a mighty gasp was heard within the US about how the Chinese were going to stage a 'Pearl Harbor on the Hight Frontier'. What got missed was the many developments and tests the US had been doing along the same lines.
The unwritten logic was: US developments are 'good' and in the service of peace' but the Chinese efforts are a 'threat to world peace and US security'. Silly.
Now this administration has, at considerable cost (one estimate was $1 Billion), deigned to shoot at one of our satellites. The experts on such things pointed out that the whole 'hydrazine risk' story was canard. The odds of a hydrazine tank surviving reentry are slim to none. Assuming it made it down at least partly intact the risk was minimal, contamination of an estimated two football fields.
Which means that for purely symbolic reasons, demonstrating we can, we have spent most of a Billion dollars for no practical effect.
Maybe it is just me but this smacks of the psychology of insecure adolescent boys. A need to 'prove themselves' and an immature inability to restrain themselves that drives them to do outlandish inappropriate acts simply because 'they can'. Regardless of the consequences.
Again, maybe it is just me but I keep getting the feeling this administration needs adult supervision. I'd say the adolescence in these statements is glaring. Isn't it alarming to anyone how, if we're honest, we know so little yet pretend to know so much? A billion dollars (a wild guess by ANY standards) for technology advancement that goes so much farther than just military use, and "we" whine (like adolescents), yet we'll vote for 10's if not 100's of billions of dollars for PHRASECENSOREDPOSTERSHOULDKNOWBETTER. causes? I have a hard time thinking outside the box when I know so little about what's inside the box already. I know it's "free" outside the box, and nirvana abounds, but I just can;t bring myself to such self-imposed blissful ignorance. But........Maybe it's just me. I happen to like this country and any administration that attempts to keep us on track with what historical and empirical evidence (all found where? Inside the box!) tells us brought us to some argueable level of greatness. I won;t be disliking my country enough yet to be voting for "hope" this November....but....maybe that's just me.
Edited by Stretch (02/22/08 12:52 AM)
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DON'T BE SCARED
-Stretch
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#124770 - 02/22/08 02:10 AM
Re: Shot fired and a hit on the satellite according to
[Re: Stretch]
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Old Hand
Registered: 11/27/06
Posts: 707
Loc: Alamogordo, NM
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One more thing: the damage to an "estimated" area the sioze of two football fields wouldn;t be nice if those football fields were populated.....
We did a good thing. We shot down a satellite that was earthbound. Who did it first is irrelevant. Because China did it last year, doesn;t mean we couldn;t have, just that we didn;t.
IF it were me, that thing would've had an explosive device in it before it went up in the first place. Now....did we shoot it down or does this "adolescent" administration have a trick or two up its sleeve? Who knows. We do know that there will be no damage to any football fields.
_________________________
DON'T BE SCARED
-Stretch
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#124782 - 02/22/08 03:18 AM
Re: Shot fired and a hit on the satellite accordin
[Re: Art_in_FL]
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Old Hand
Registered: 02/08/08
Posts: 924
Loc: Toledo Ohio
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LOL.
Fairly recently the Chinese shot one of their satellites. And a mighty gasp was heard within the US about how the Chinese were going to stage a 'Pearl Harbor on the Hight Frontier'. What got missed was the many developments and tests the US had been doing along the same lines.
The unwritten logic was: US developments are 'good' and in the service of peace' but the Chinese efforts are a 'threat to world peace and US security'. Silly.
Now this administration has, at considerable cost (one estimate was $1 Billion), deigned to shoot at one of our satellites. The experts on such things pointed out that the whole 'hydrazine risk' story was canard. The odds of a hydrazine tank surviving reentry are slim to none. Assuming it made it down at least partly intact the risk was minimal, contamination of an estimated two football fields.
Which means that for purely symbolic reasons, demonstrating we can, we have spent most of a Billion dollars for no practical effect.
Maybe it is just me but this smacks of the psychology of insecure adolescent boys. A need to 'prove themselves' and an immature inability to restrain themselves that drives them to do outlandish inappropriate acts simply because 'they can'. Regardless of the consequences.
Again, maybe it is just me but I keep getting the feeling this administration needs adult supervision. I see nothing wrong with sending a message to others. I see nothing wrong with sending a message to others. You argue its 1 Billion dollars, but if the message was received it would not only save money, it could save lives. Just like a shotgun shell cost money, but if someone were to try to open your door in the middle of the night and you turn the outside lights on and fire a shell off in the front yard to let the thief know you have a gun and to move on. You are arguing about the cost of electricity for the light and the cost of a shotgun shell. Let go the hate for Bush and look at the bigger picture. I could care less what party is in office, and what President orders it, when we show the world we are strong it’s good.
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You can run, but you'll only die tired.
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#124807 - 02/22/08 01:09 PM
Re: Shot fired and a hit on the satellite accordin
[Re: BobS]
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Geezer
Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5357
Loc: SOCAL
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Now the US can talk to the Chinese about the PRC's ASAT system from a better negotiating position.
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Better is the Enemy of Good Enough.
Okay, what’s your point??
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#124867 - 02/22/08 07:30 PM
Re: Shot fired and a hit on the satellite accordin
[Re: Russ]
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Addict
Registered: 03/20/05
Posts: 410
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Actually, the odds of the fuel making back down was pretty good. Hydrazine is incredibly dangerous and carcinogenic. Not to mention that fuel is hypergolic.
Back in the olds days, drag racers tried adding it to their fuel, and in a 1% solution, it would boost horsepower something like 100%. Many engines didn't make it 100 ft. before coming apart at the seams. It was quickly banned by the NHRA (and rightfully so).
Missiles were my specialty in the Army. All I can say, is nice shot, very impressive! Wish I could have been in on it!
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#124877 - 02/22/08 09:11 PM
Re: Shot fired and a hit on the satellite accordin
[Re: Russ]
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Veteran
Registered: 09/01/05
Posts: 1474
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Now the US can talk to the Chinese about the PRC's ASAT system from a better negotiating position.
If hypocricy is the enemy of credibility I may be missing the logic here. And I'm pretty sure it goes without saying, but your creditor always has the superior negotiating position.
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#124913 - 02/23/08 01:35 AM
Re: Shot fired and a hit on the satellite accordin
[Re: sodak]
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Gear Junkie
Addict
Registered: 08/23/07
Posts: 535
Loc: MA
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Missiles were my specialty in the Army. All I can say, is nice shot, very impressive! Wish I could have been in on it!
+1 to you Sodak that was my point to begin with. Thanks. Blitz
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#125005 - 02/24/08 02:32 AM
Re: Shot fired and a hit on the satellite accordin
[Re: Art_in_FL]
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Old Hand
Registered: 09/12/01
Posts: 960
Loc: Saskatchewan, Canada
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LOL.
Fairly recently the Chinese shot one of their satellites. And a mighty gasp was heard within the US about how the Chinese were going to stage a 'Pearl Harbor on the Hight Frontier'. What got missed was the many developments and tests the US had been doing along the same lines.
The unwritten logic was: US developments are 'good' and in the service of peace' but the Chinese efforts are a 'threat to world peace and US security'. Silly.
Now this administration has, at considerable cost (one estimate was $1 Billion), deigned to shoot at one of our satellites. The experts on such things pointed out that the whole 'hydrazine risk' story was canard. The odds of a hydrazine tank surviving reentry are slim to none. Assuming it made it down at least partly intact the risk was minimal, contamination of an estimated two football fields.
Which means that for purely symbolic reasons, demonstrating we can, we have spent most of a Billion dollars for no practical effect.
Maybe it is just me but this smacks of the psychology of insecure adolescent boys. A need to 'prove themselves' and an immature inability to restrain themselves that drives them to do outlandish inappropriate acts simply because 'they can'. Regardless of the consequences.
Again, maybe it is just me but I keep getting the feeling this administration needs adult supervision. I've doubted the story from day one from what I've heard. The "spy satellite" was apparently one of the newer breed that was sent up and then stopped working shortly after achieving orbit. I know - call me paranoid but I think the chances of hydrazine container not burning up is just an excuse. Some have suggested that it was really the secret capabilities of the satellite that the government wanted to protect. However, I will go one better and say that this whole farce was probably planned from the start. What proof we have that it really was a top-secret satellite instead of a lump of junk? I think this was purposely put up in space to act as a target under the guise of "we have to protect earth from the hydrazine container". This gave the government and the military the perfect target to practise their space age technology in shooting down the satellite. 'Know what - for once I think the Chinese have hit it on the head in their claim about the American governmemt.
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#125025 - 02/24/08 05:11 AM
Re: Shot fired and a hit on the satellite accordin
[Re: Roarmeister]
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INTERCEPTOR
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 07/15/02
Posts: 3760
Loc: TX
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Some have suggested that it was really the secret capabilities of the satellite that the government wanted to protect. Left intact, large parts of the satellite probably would have made it to the ground. A lot of other countries would love to get their hands on a US spy satellite optics so it makes strategic sense to destroy the satellite. Don't we destroy downed US helicopters in Iraq for the same reason? The fact that we get to show off our capablities is just icing on the cake. What I'm wondering is what capabilities is the US government still hiding from the bad guys. 
However, I will go one better and say that this whole farce was probably planned from the start. What proof we have that it really was a top-secret satellite instead of a lump of junk? I think this was purposely put up in space to act as a target under the guise of "we have to protect earth from the hydrazine container".
I doubt it. There's a paper/person trail involved in making such a satellite. You'd have to make everyone involved kept silent and as all the CIA leaks to the New York Times show, they are blabbing secrets left and right. I think they saw a valid oppertunity and took it. -Blast
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