One of my jobs in the summer is that of a motorcycle rider training instructor. I was working our annual local motorcycle show today and I think I've found my next (3rd) motorcycle. Being the survival geek that I am I couldn't help but think of the many applications for one of these bad boys:

http://www.imz-ural.com/patrol/

Yes. That is a new motorcycle.

It's the only motorcycle I've ever seen which comes with a sidecar (that means lots of cargo) and is 2 wheel drive (the sidecar wheel is driven). At the bike show they had a video of a guy who'd retrofit a plow blade and was clearing snow from his driveway with one.

The design hasn't changed in WWII and because it's ultra basic (carbs instead of fuel injections, kick starter standard, etc) anybody with any mechanical know how, some gum, and some twine can make repairs.

This motorcycle has been discussed a few times here on ETS. Even five years ago they had a bad reputation for quality control. Someone on this board said that they've been greatly improved and are now much more reliable.

The ability to run it as 2-wheeled drive is good and supposedly they can handle some pretty rough/slippery/muddy terrain. Plus, they look damn cool.

Personally I say if you have the cash get one and report back to us. Better yet, pass it around to a few of us with motorcycyle licenses and we'll all report on it.

-Blast

Remember the adage, you get what you pay for...

A guy in my old neighborhood bought one of these bikes new less then 2 years ago and had nothing but complaints about the quality and durability of the bike.

More then once we seen that bike on the flatdeck being taken back to the dealer for work.

Hi,

I have no experience with motorcycles but remember some WWII news-reels and war movies (e.g. Where Eagles Dare) where motorcycles with sidecars went through some pretty bad terrain/road conditions.

Looks like an interesting vehicle.

Mike

Thanks Blast. I was so excited about this discovery I didn't even think of the search feature.

I'm definitely going to get one but since my Jeep was nearly written off on Wednesday it might not be until spring now.

I found these sweet YouTube videos. The first is snow testing and the other is a funny military promotional video. for a bike that weighs close to 800 lbs they beat on it pretty good.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pq9gBNlgkpw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dN5PAwc1ns8

Previous Ural Motorcycles thread

-Blast

Although more expensive, the three wheeled Piaggio MP3 looks like an interesting BOM. Saw one in traffic yesterday and that think moves. Of course, if money is no obstacle, the BMW 1200GS is also a nice way to go.


http://www.piaggiousa.com/pScooters/MP3500.cfm

I've ridden both of those bikes. I'd say the Piaggio is only a good BOV if you're 100% sure you're going to be on clear paved roads the entire time...remember that the twin front wheels aren't driven...which means they're going to drag in mud like a mofo.

The 1200GS is a great machine if you have the money...but...it's very tall and very heavy (I'm not 100% sure but I think you can get a 36L tank for it! you could for the 1150GS)...also very hard to manage in true off road conditions. Watch the Long Way 'Round with Ewan McGreggor and you'll see just how much they fight with the bikes. I think Charlie separates some chest muscles later in the trip pulling the bike out of muck for the millionth time. I used to work in a BMW motorcycle dealership and being the closest dealership to Alaska, I heard a lot of stories from guys making the round trip from the US...some of them were pretty bad. The guys on the 650GSs always fared better as the bike is way more manageable.

In that same TV series the camera mans bike breaks down so they replace it with a cheap Russian machine and he is super happy because it never breaks down and deals with the local terrain WAY better than the BMWs do...if I recall at one point he laughs at them as he rides past their stuck bikes.

Lucky you! Looking at the specs, the 1200 is over 100lbs. heavier (and the seat 5in. higher) than the 650. I also imagine the 8.7gal (32+L) of fuel sloshing around could make things unpredictable. Beautiful bikes but real world experience is what counts.

I can see that a motorcycle may have some merit as a BOV, but if you want something that can get through most terrain, why would you not pick two-wheels that can just about do that and add some bags to it. Why wouldn't a motocross bike with bags be better?

I like the Ural and for a bov the light machine gun could come in handy. :-)

Dave

I think I just solved the bugging out under martial law problem!! Get one of the ones with teh huge machine guns on it!!!

There's no way you'd fit 225 lbs of gear on a motocross bike. The Ural does that just in the side car. Motocross bikes aren't designed to carry cargo.

I'd say maybe an enduro style bike like the aforementioned 1200GS though I'd go with something cheaper like a KLR650. There's no doubt that a 2 wheeled machine is going to be more 'all terrain' than a bike with a side car...but I need to think about BOBs and a wife who doesn't ride. It's all about compromise.

I don't like murdercycles, sorry...

Same here, I don't know if Cali is the same way, but in NJ it seems like people in cars aim for guys and gals on motorcycles. All my friends that rode have either stopped because they had too many close calls or died. It's really sad.

With that in mind, I think I'd rather have some kind of a quad ATV. I think they would be a bit safer having the stability of four wheels and a bit better off road. I know they can carry a lot of stuff strapped to the back and front as well (plus being able to tow a ~1,000lb trailer). I don't know what their on-road legalities are in your state (some you can get them registered for on-road use, other states you can't), but if you really have to get out of an area fast, I wouldn't really care. Arctic Cat even makes one that will run on diesel/bio-diesel/JP-5/JP-8, though I don't know how it is.

I live in a downtown condo. ATVs aren't an option. Nor are trailers. Nor are a lot of things.

A jeep would be better than a bike, esp. with a wife who doesn't ride. I started riding off road when I was 12, and that was a long, long time ago. I've had 4 road bikes since I got my MC endorsement. Riding on a very wet road is not fun, or safe. For "bugging out" 3 wheels is better than 2, and 4 better than 3 IMHO.

100% on the money there. When it comes down to it my Jeep Compass is going to every bit as well if not better than a Ural will even though the 'off road' ability of a Compass is questionable.

I think Kawasaki probably makes the best bike for this purpose in their KLR 650. If I weren't so old and breakable I'd get one.

http://www.kawasaki.com/products/Detail.aspx?id=161

Otherwise, I think a Jeep or even better, a HumVee might make more sense (as long as you can get gas!).

A HumVee is/was desifned for todays modern military, that alone makes it not the best choice for a personal bug our vehilce. Its designed with military use and a military support structure in mind. Its designed to fit in with tanks and large vehicles and designed with the thought that there will be a fuel supply chain (Diesel not gas). For a personal vehicle a jeep or 4x4 truck/suv is a better choice since they are still intended to be a personal vehilce. To illustrate the purpose specific deisgn a little better, imagine your running a package shipping and delivery company, would you want two seat small cars or box vans, but driving to and from work in a parking garage which would be a better vehicle the two seat small car or the box van? Its all about using the right tool for the job.
This is one of the reasons I went with a basic pickup truck rather than something like a HumVee or even the civi version or H2. A 4x4 truck is designed to carry a few people,tools, supplies, gear which fits a family well. I can carry my family in the extended cab and still have room in the bed for planty of gear and supplies.

Something like a Jeep would be your best bet, the original short wheelbase jeep, they put a bicycle rack on the back. Those won't look too out of place, I do some side consulting for a small start up company who has a college girl working for them that drives a jeep and has the bike rack on the back, those are common enough that they bland in.

As for me, I would rather everyone in my BOB group have a KLR650, here. I feel the need to go off-highway. The platform on the back and a backpack is enough room for survival equipment.

I would actually think the long wheelbase wrangler would be a bit better choice. Noticeably more space for storage without sacrificing much off-road ability (it actually has greater approach and departure angles) or fuel mileage. Anyone that has ever owned a regular wrangler knows there isn't much storage space, especially without the rear seats folded up if you squeeze more than two people in. The new version with the two extra doors, while not as sporty as the two door, is much easier for entry and exit (for packages and bags as well as people). The LWB can also tow more, which is nice to have the ability, even if you don't own a trailer.

If they ever made a 4-door LWB Rubicon with the diesel they put in the Grand Cherokee, it would be my perfect suv.

Reason I said the short wheelbase one was for the in condo/parking lot/parking garage manuverability.

Didn't the grand cherokee have one of the Mercedes Diesels, or was it a good one? They really need to bging back the 4b series cummins.

I've been driving a Jeep Grand Cherokee for less than a week (rental while my Compass gets de-accordian-ed) and I'm taking it back tonight for something else...I hate it.

Hard on gas (and it's only the V6), hard suspension, rough ride. Sure it's bigger inside but in all the wrong ways. Worst of all it barely fits in my parking spot.

If I'm going to drop 40k on a vehicle (or more) I'm going to judge it by more than just it's post-apocalyptic merits like some people (you know who you are ).

[quote=Eugene A 4x4 truck is designed to carry a few people,tools, supplies, gear which fits a family well. I can carry my family in the extended cab and still have room in the bed for planty of gear and supplies. [/quote]

+ 1 on this one Eugene. My wife has the SUV (Dodge Nitro) and I have the truck. It is the best possible vehicle to have in an emergency for the reasons you mentioned and more IMHO(great off road capability as well). The problem is the gas mileage (or lack thereof) I drive a Dodge Ram 4 x 4 Quad cab with 5.7L HEMI. (fastest truck between two gas stations) fuel storage for an emergency or bug out situ is critical for me. This is the down side to all the other benefits.

Yea, the current one has a 3.0L Mercedes diesel. It's an excellent engine, though a bit underpowered in the Grand Cherokee. It would be great in a lighter Wrangler though.



The Compass is basically a wagon (car based), while the Wrangler and Grand Cherokee are, for the most part, truck based SUVs. The ride is going to be much different between them. Most people who aren't used to "trucks" don't like driving them, at least not right away. Personally, I've been driving various types of trucks and heavy equipment around since I was a kid, so I'm used to driving both and neither bother me in the least. The Grand Cherokee is a Cadillac compared to half the stuff I've driven (most of which costing well over $40,000).

With that in mind, you can't expect a compass to have the durability and utility of a true truck or good truck based SUV. It's a trade off. If you want to try driving something in between the compass and the grand Cherokee, try the Patriot (must be version with Freedom Drive II). It's still a car based chassis setup, like the Compass, but with low range gearing and some other touches; like skid plates and all-terrain tires.

It won't be as heavy duty as the truck based guys, but better than the compass, at least for simple off-road stuff. The next step up would be the Liberty (which is right smack in the middle of Jeeps car/truck spectrum), followed by the Grand Cherokee, and lastly the Wrangler (which is more "truck based" than most modern trucks). Remember that not all SUVs are equal, they have different abilities and purposes.

My cousin/friend had been a mechanic for years and is now the shop foreman at a Dodge dealership, he would kick you out very fast if he ever heard anyone say the Mer4cedes diesel was even a decent engine, they have been nothing but problems for them.

Hacksaw,

What happened to your jeep? Did I miss something? I have an FJ cruiser myself which I love but I know some of the jeepers out there don't like them. I do love jeeps though, CJ's the best.

Blitz

He's probably talking about the Mercedes diesel used in the dodge sprinter. It's a fine engine as long as you don't treat it like an old low pressure injection diesel (which most guys who buy them probably do).

For years guys with diesel engines would add all kinds of oils and lubricants to their diesel fuel because in the early 90's, when they went to low sulfur fuel, they didn't get the formula right and it would kill the fuel pumps.

Guys think the same thing will happen now (since they lowered the sulfur content again last year), so they add oil, power steering fluid, and all kinds of other stuff to their fuel. This kills the injectors, the fuel pump, the cats, the exhaust filters, and just about every other component except the shortblock and the turbo.

Mercedes makes solid diesel engines, but a lot of guys don't understand the differences between the new clean diesels and older diesels. Very different in quite a few ways, both in the way they operate and the way they are maintained.

(I've worked as a diesel mechanic as well, so I've played with most of them. Though, usually the stuff I work on is bigger.)

He works on all the diesels for their garage and they have a lot of warranty problems with the one in the JGC and Liberty. When my mother wanted a liberty he talked her out of getting the Diesel.

My jeep was the bologna in an SUV sandwich.

Paul810 is completely right. It's not even a wagon. The Compass (and the Patriot) under the skin and the 4x4 are just Dodge Calibers with bigger interior space. It's no vehicle for rock crawling but for 'drive through the ditch' type off road duties it's served me just fine. And for on road use there isn't a finer SUV IMHO. It gets better fuel mileage than anything I'm aware of, rides great, is super quiet, takes a pothole like a champ, and it uses space very efficiently. I can fit a ton of stuff in (all the seats but the drivers fold flat), and still parallel park it in a smaller space than I could my wifes old Escort ZX2.

I'd say that the only small SUV that rivals it for urban use is a Subaru Forester with a turbo...but the Compass is way cheaper than one of those.

Sure it was with the engine itself and not the transmission? The Libertys had a ton of problems with the transmission and PCM (which caused EGR problems), but I haven't heard or seen really any bad things about the engine itself. Mercedes uses the same engine with a different transmission/PCM in their E-class and SUVs and I've never heard an ill word about it.

I can't understand why anyone would choose anything other than a dual-purpose motorcycle with a large gas tank for a bug-out vehicle, unless there are small children or pets involved, but even so.
Although it is true that my idea of bugging out includes potential TEOTWAWKI stuff like traffic jams and the possible need to travel via forest trails.

I never thought about pets. Another point for the Ural?

I have two kids and three cats so no motocycle for me

Ever get hit with a rock or shot at while on a motorcycle? Or have someone stopped in traffic open their door on you while you're flying along splitting lanes? Or even run over a large pothole? Think about it. A motorcycle offers no protection at all from people (possibly rioters), animals, and from the environment. I would take one with me if I could (say strapped to the back of my truck/suv), but I would want to start out with a more substantial vehicle and see how far it gets me. At least then I'm starting out carrying more gear and I'm much better protected. It's easy to get rid of something you don't need, but not necessarily easy to get something back (or find something) you do need.

The other thing too is, in my SUV/Truck I can travel nearly 1,000 highway miles before I need to put any fuel back in the tank. Most dual-purpose motorcycles only get half that, with little room to carry more fuel. Even the militaries diesel bikes (designed for overall fuel mileage) get 600 miles at the most. I wouldn't want to ride one for 600 miles though, my back and legs would become useless.

I have a 2005 KLR650 that I've put over 11,000 miles on so far. This is the 4th Dual Purpose bike that I've owned. As you can see from the picture(not my bike by the way), you can load a fair amount of gear onto one of these beasts.

Your points about rocks, rioters, etc. are all well taken, but the same hazards hold true for "caged" vehicles as well. If you recall from the most recent South Central L.A. riots, Reginald Denny was pulled from a semi-truck cab and nearly beaten to death. Personally (and when you get right down to it, this is really all about personal preference), I feel the advantages of a bike like this far outweigh the disadvantages. After all, we are talking about a Bug Out Motorcycle which implies a bad enough situation that I have to assume most roads will quickly become parking lots. These bikes can go through/over/around obstacles that would foil any 4 wheeled vehicle.

I get just under 300 miles from a full tank, add a spare tank and 500 miles is easily attained. Don't get me wrong, I miss the heater, air conditioner, radio, trunk, etc., but when TSHTF, I'll be sure to wave at all those fully loaded SUV's sitting parked in traffic as I cruise past.

Ah Ha ha ha ha ha !! ROFL !! Priceless!!

Yeah, but my motorcycle would have dual rocket launchers and mini-machine guns on the hanldebars just like Chuck Norris did in the movie Delta Force.

One could argue that you can defend yourself on a bike while in a car you're trapped and can only run.

I know guys who ride with telescopic batons just in case somebody tries to jack their bike.

And I think if you clotheslined a guy riding a bike, you'd be the one hurting...especially if he had a chance to get your arm with his helmet by ducking a bit. That has broken bones written all over it.

Indeed, someone will...if you let them. Not to hijack this thread but if TSHTF bad enough to where I end up buggin' out on the bike, my mindset will be in "shoot first, ask questions later" mode. We can go back and forth all day with, "Yeah, but what if I..." comments but when the SHTF, all talk will be cheap and if anyone catches me slipping (or sleeping), you're right, they get my bike and my stuff.

Aren't we lucky we can just speculate on and imagine these scenarios instead of living out the reality of fighting for our lives and perhaps living with the baggage of taking another persons life, or having to make the tough call to leave behind loved pets for the sake of loved ones.

Austin,Texas and Pasadena,California are both major cities. Let's pray we never find ourselves in a bad enough situation to where we have to make these decisions.

I see advantages and disadvantages of each. Some states where we get snow/ice/rain I don't think I would want to try bugging out on a bike, probably wouldn't get very far, but on the other hand you could run that bike along the berm in a traffic jam. It goes to show there is not one perfect vehicle for every situation.
The best idea I have is to scale down your gear as much as possibe, choose the smallest and lightest you can so you can fit as much as you can in/on whatever vehicle you have.

You're right Eugene, each has it's own selling points. But I think any snow/ice that would stop a Dual Purpose bike would also stop an SUV. As for rain, that's just a comfort issue, I've ridden quite a bit in the rain and with the right gear it's not all that bad, you just give yourself a little more distance from the vehicle in front of you in case you have to come to a quick stop.

If I really had to bug out, I'm thinking my D8 dozer would be the way to go. Weld some steel plating on it and the thing is basically a tank. Off-road, on-road, trees, cars, trucks....very little stands in my way. I don't know what kind of fuel mileage it gets, but I know it costs over $500 a tank to fill it.

With that in mind, I think anything is better than nothing. I'd rather have even a bycycle than be stuck walking anyday.

I'm planning on putting over 100L worth of pannier bags on my bike this summer and doing some camping in Jasper National Park. In the right setting a bicycle could be better than anything that uses gasoline.

When the apocalypse comes and the only fuel is controlled by a crazy washed up female recording artist, I'll have it made!