I want to carry a compass but want to get as much out of pockets as I can.

I came across a cell phone compass program. I thought that this would be a great solution.... but ...

Unfortunately, I have Verizon which uses BREW rather than J2ME.

If you need a free compass download for your cell phone (if it is J2ME compatible). You can take a look at the one I ran across here:
http://qcontinuum.org/compass/

As another possibility I was also exploring watches that have compass's. But I was having a hard time locating one that might look good for a night on the town. I would rather not have one that looked like a calculator watch if you catch my drift.

For example the Timex Titanium E-compass Watch looked pretty decent (I thought).

I admit that even a watch seems to be unnecessary as most of us have cell phones these days, but it would still get items out of my pockets!

Also I'm looking for something that doesn't require a monthly subscription! Yes, my cell (LG VX8600) supports GPS if I want to pay for it too.

The Marbles liquid filled compass that I currently have on my key chain needs to be phased out.

Any ideas? Thanks

Look at this site http://www.survivalkeychain.com/compass.asp

Take one of the teeny-tiny button compasses and super glue it to an aluminum dog tag or something like that. Even turn/adapt the keychain compass into a necklace.

Just a thought

Avoid single point of failure to multiple systems;
Single item,i.e. cell phone fails,now commo fails,compass fails gps fails etc.
A simple button compass was used as a escape compass by the army in WWII can be concealed anywhere. You just can't improve on it.
The dry type NATO from PSI are great.
Electronics fail from time to time.
Remember that old adage that a tool that does many things does none of them well.
Blue Skys

Definitely always carry a regular compass as a backup since electronic ones can be unreliable and there is always the issue of batteries running out.
Bill

Unless you are going to have something based in a computerized electronic device, such as a cell phone or gps unit, or you are going to carry something large, or a magntic compass. You can get a magnetic compass in various sizes, but you seem to want something small that will not take up space in a pocket.

It's not the most accurate compass in the world, but maybe you should think of one for a zipper like: http://www.campingsurvival.com/rozipuco.html.

I'm not big on carrying a compass, I experience about one time a year when I feel like I want one on land, and that soon passes. Generally, I figure out direction without much thought at all, kind of an innate skill. However, I do have a couple of these, just in case, and because of the ease in carrying them.

Your cell supports aGPS which is not the same as GPS. A better name would have been simulated GPS because. It is dependent on the cell phone service which is why the subscription. Go out in the woods and loose the cell signal and you have no GPS, subscription or not.

Welcome to the board.

I use a small Suunto compass that clips to my watchband kind of like this. Except the one I purchased has a glow in the dark dial and pointer.

Welcome! It's not clear how accurate you need the compass to be. But like GarlyDog, I have used a little compass that slipped over my watchband in the past. Can't remember if it was Sunnto or some other brand. Unobtrusive but as easy to check as looking at the time.

Hi duckbill,

Thanks for the link for the mobile phone compass download. Have you tried the Silva SERE 40 Luminous compass. Its about 17 mm diameter and 4 mm thick (about the size of a medium sized button), so its really small fast and weighs less than a gram.



Silva SERE 40

I have this one by Cammenga, who make the compasses the US army uses. Pricy at $40 bucks, but the Tritium Lumination is nice comming out of the woods at night.

http://cammenga.com/cammenga-products.php?category=2

Simplicity and its loyal companion reliability beat unnecessary complexity any time.

Why depend on something that needs battery power, functioning electronics, a signal, and possibly a subscription merely to act as a compass. Besides that, how much space does a key chain style compass actually consume? The small size and weight of this type of compass also promote having a backup system.

From my experience, Sun makes good small compasses, as does Tru-Nord.

Here's a useful test to perform: Submerge in water for a couple of minutes the Marble compass and the appropriately setup cell phone and then report back which one works better as a compass. Works is the operative word.

I'm not enthusiast about putting so much faith in a single device. particularly when it is a device that is dependent on batteries and one that is relatively delicate. Count on a cell phone for communications, timekeeping and compass and you lose the who;e shooting match if the cell phone falls into a mud puddle.

My preference is a small, and very durable, button compass. The best of them have survived being swallowed and retrieved at the other end. A testimate to durability but otherwise a pretty useless bit of information unless you anticipate a prison camp and strip search in your future.

The real deal: http://www.bestglide.com/FB1605_Info.html

It is pricy at $36 but as long as you don't lose it one should last a lifetime.


Very good: http://www.bestglide.com/marbles_brass_compass.html

Perfectly usable and almost as tough for less than half the price.


A bit larger:http://www.bestglide.com/brunton_compass.html

Dirt cheap but rugged enough and small enough to stuff into any kit or hide until needed in a jacket pocket. A selection of small workhorse compasses for cheap.

What's in your pockets now? Is it a matter of pocket organization, weight or is it the sheer number of items that has you reassessing your EDC?

I have a TAD Lifecapsule that I carry to keeps things tidy, waterproof, crushproof and it could serve a number of other purposes.

One end of the capsule unscrews to reveal a button compass (it can hold one of those excellent NATO compasses Art_In_FL was linking to) in a small compartment and the opposite end has a compartment that can hold quite a bit (matches & tinder, or sparklight & tinder-quik, water purification tablets, emergency money, etc.). A short paracord lanyard in a snakeknot configuration (only the length of the capsule itself) with a Photon on the end completes a nice little bit of kit.

try here I have it. It only has time, date and compass. If you look at the picture the top button is compass, the middle button (if you push it) is a light and you pull it to change date and time. Then the bottom button is compass again. If you push the compass button the compass is on for about 20 seconds. The only thing I dont like about it si if you have the compass and the light on the back light blinks. Over all I love the compass, a great choice of watchbands and pretty cheap.

Both of my trekking poles have button compasses on the wrist strap. I also have a Suunto mini compass/thermometer zipper pull on my lanyard. Then I have my regular compass. THEN I usually stash a magnet compass around somewhere (a little oblong neodymium magnet which will always point north/south on a flat surface).

And all that is generally backup for my GPS (both my Garmin and the one in my blackberry).

Sure it's redundant but until button compasses weigh 3 lbs a piece, I'm just fine with so much overkill.

My Casio Triplesensor watch give me a compass, and more...

If you're looking for a nice watch with a pretty good compass check out the Tissot T-Touch. I'm so impressed with that watch I now own two.

I have the a Highgear watch. It's a bit big but has all the same features for a fraction of the price of a Suunto or the Tissot.

Where do you live? If you wear a jacket regularly, you could get a button compass zipper pull. I have a cheap one on one of my jackets thats lasted for about two years and is almost completely unnoticeable to carry.

I carry a small key wallet in another pocket separate from my normal wallet. It looks like a normal wallet but when you open it it has a row of clips to hand keys on and keeps them all laying flat and compact and quiet. It has a small zipper change pocket and in there I keep a couple quarters and a p38 and a watchband compass. So thats kind of my psk and the compass is about the size of a nickel and was encased in a rubber coating that had a slot to slide a watch band through. I don't wear a watch but thats an option as well. I just peeled the rubber off the outside and slid the little compass into the change pocket. I bought it for like $5 from a store called Galyans which is now Dicks sporting goods and its been in that little pocket for years rubbing against a couple quarters and the p38 and still works fine. I pulled it out and it matched my new GPS. Its actually outlasted the key wallet because I've replaced the wallet once.

IMHO, all of these electronic compasses in the wrist watches are not good for navigation simply because the sensor used in them have something like 50 positions, i.o.w. its like ~7 deg. precision. You can tell where the North is, but I doubt it's good for any serious navigation by azimuth bearing in the field. Also take a closer look at those "cool" bezels on them. Marks every 30 deg.? Almost any analog compass is better.

The cool bezel on mine broke off years ago...

Agree.

Redundancy, Redundancy, Redundancy.


Small button compasses (on key chain, in pocket, etc) and a flat navigation compass in the glove box of car, and in the car's BOB wouldn't hurt.

I got a little LED light/compass combo for my wife, child, and aunt to put on their key chains for stocking stuffers this year(now to go get one for myself now that I've taken care of my loved ones).

My Highgear gives direction in degrees, not with marks around the bezel.

The way I see it, you either need a good compass, or you don't need a compass much at all. If you need a compass, you'd be wanting to triangulate your position on maps, site bearings, etc. You won't be doing that with a cellphone program, or even with a button compass. I think putting all your eggs in one basket with a cellphone, or ANY electronic device, to save pocket space is terribly foolish.

I can see a button compass useful in some situations, none of which generally apply to my routine hiking areas (in the mountains). If you were in deep woods (flat land), or maybe in a desert it would be nice to not go in circles and a semi-accurate button compass may assist in that. In the mountains your heading is determined more by the terrain you can navigate than by a specific bearing.

Personally, I always carry a good, fullsize compass and topo maps. Every hike finds me triangulating my positions, identifying landmarks using a sited bearing and the maps, etc. Not because I need this for navigation usually, more just to keep my skills tuned up for when an emergency may mandate pre-mastery of these skills.

haertig is dead nuts square on target!

A compass is a powerful tool, but its power only comes when you can use the compass to relate your position to a know landmark - or two. For that you either need a really good map of the area or a GPS with saved key waypoints - or preferably both.

A compass without a baseplate straight-edge is really really tough to work with in conjunction with a map.

The compass is not the place to save weight. Bring a decent baseplate compass (I much prefer one with adjustable declination), a good map of the area (USGS topo map in the US), and, hopefully, even a very simple GPS w/ extra batteries. Save key waypoints often and know how to convert coordinates on a map to a waypoint on a GPS (see http://wwww.maptools.com ).

I'd actually put the good map ahead of the compass in terms of utiliy. Many outdoors folks will tell you that they primarily travel using a map alone, but certainly at times need to use their compass to confirm their location or direction of travel.

I flew out to Charlotte, NC during the last few days and brought along a copy of the book "The Essential Wilderness Navigator: How to Find Your Way in the Great Outdoors, Second Edition" by David Seidman and Paul Cleveland. Its the second time I've read through it and I have to say I'm pretty darn impressed. Its one of the few books on the topic that explains BOTH how to use compasses with adjusted magnetic declination AND how to use compasses that are not adjustable for declination. I think its now my favorite book on the topic.

Ken K.

Even in deserts, you rarely need a compass, because you are surrounded by obvious landmarks, at least in the continental US. You will need a compass for navigation when your visibility is restricted (fog, typically) and if you are at sea. I can count on one hand the times I have seriously used a compass in the mountains, and both times we were in the clouds.

But if you are going to carry a compass, carry one that is marked in at least two degree increments and that has a sighting (signal) mirror. Plenty are around that weigh maybe an ounce. Very easy to carry. If you use it much, you will want it on a neck lanyard., and not in your pockets.

I wouldn't trust to landmarks for any forested area. Around here people get lost in the woods all the time...usually the ones who don't have a compass or GPS. You can walk a LONG time and never see power lines, cut line, trail, road, etc in Alberta. If you're disoriented it's even worse. I've heard of people getting lost within a km of their truck or ATV and wandering for hours going in circles.

At least with a button compass you'll keep walking in the same direction.

I agree with you Dave about a compass being mandatory in thick forested areas, it has saved me from a night in the bush many times. I often use the sun as a direction indicator when I am just cruising around during the day but when darkness is closing in and I need to get to where I am going, I flip out the Silva Ranger to get the job done.

Mike

So many survival situations start with someone getting lost. Going small cheap with your compass is a bad move IMO. YMMV, but you're probably wrong.

In the extreme SE, and up much of the east coast, it is pretty much, as the saying goes, about as flat as '[censored]-on-a-plate'. A lot of this area is thick with brush and trees. Even when it's not overcast it can be hard to get a sighting on the sun or stars and there are few other visual references to guide on.

I learned orienteering in the scrub forests of the SE. Lots of pacing and detailed compass and map work to find small targets. When I later went through an orienteering course in Kentucky It was a whole lot easier. I just about didn't need a compass to orient myself or the map because the mountains were pretty much unique and easy to shoot azimuths on.

Daytime orienteering on the flat with enclosing forest has a lot of resemblance to nighttime orienteering with mountains. Your sight lines are very short. Difference being if you have a topo map around the hills you can tell a lot by keeping track of slopes and relative altitude. Reminds me of using a depth finder and charts near a coast. In the flat SE a elevation increment on the map might be three feet. Generally to small to reliably detect and use.

While a compass was pretty much essential on the flat it seemed far less so with easily identified terrain on the skyline.

That said having even a simple compass is far better than not having one. Generally for survival use, getting out or getting found, you don't need a whole lot of high-precision land navigation. Small and simple compasses are perfectly acceptable. I have used a simple clear baseplate Silva compass for years. I always got to the same place as the guys who were messing about with high-dollar lensatics.

IMHO a simple compass has advantages when your cold, tired, hungry and trying to work with frozen fingers. Sometimes messing about with more detail and 'accuracy' than you need can be like 'straining at gnats'.

Knowing how to deal with the inevitable inaccuracy, and how to work it so it cancels itself out instead of multiplying in one direction, was far more a useful skill than worrying too much about absolute accuracy in shooting azimuths and calculating courses.

I have that one. It works by showing the positions of sun and moon. If neither are above the horizon, it can't give direction. It's better than nothing, and costs nothing and weighs nothing so I figure I might as well have it.

Another Java astronomy program is http://www.piecafe.co.uk/solun/jsolun.htm. Kinda cool if you like to look at your mobile phone and say, "My god, it's full of stars."

I have one of those, too. It's physically huge, and I think they all are. If that bothers you you are probably out of luck.

I know what you mean. I sometimes find that taking stuff off the keychain, but still in my pocket, it is less obstructive.

You can make a compass by magnetising a sliver of metal and suspending it from thread or floating it on water. Traditionally a needle is used, but you probably don't want something pointy in your pockets. Anything reasonably long and thin and made of the right kind of metal will do. (Of course, a needle is a valuable part of a sewing kit in its own right, so you may already have one.) A home-made compass like this can be hard to use in difficult conditions (eg windy) and isn't much good for taking bearings or following one - but frankly we've not set the bar very high with the phone and watch tools.

It is of course worth knowing how to tell north from the pole star, from the sun, and from the moon. Eg

http://www.edibleplants.com/month/moonorth.htm

http://www.wikihow.com/Find-True-North-Without-a-Compass

You can Use Time as a Compass. Some people think you need a watch but all you need to know is the time and be able to see the sun. Its a rough compass, but it works.

I compass is a "Critical Item" need during many survival situations and a great way to avoid them entirely. If you need to cut weight then take a smaller compass, but don't rely on a button compass when what you really need a is real liquid filled sighting compass to have a chance at following it in a straight line in rough terrain.

I would guess most people who know this method realize they can check the time from another source (like your cell phone or GPS). I like wearing a watch however. The idea is to *point* the hour hand at the sun and draw a line between it and 12 on a watch dial. That line is roughly south. Easy enough to imagine a watch face if you don't have one as long as you know what time it is.

Put a watchband compass on your watch, and if possible put a fullsized compass in your pack/BOB/whatever. The watchband unit is great for quick orientation and as a backup for the fullsize. The watchband unit is also available everyday, even if I'm not on the trail. My favorite watchband compass is the Brunton 9068, mainly because 1) it's easy to read when moving and 2) the mount completely encircles the watchband, unlike the Suunto model.



My favorite source for the 9068 (and lots of other good stuff) is BestGlide who sells it for only $4.

I’ve used these




They are dirt cheap (Usually find ‘em for $1), pretty durable and make maintaining a heading easy as all you have to do is glance down.

I've got a couple small, inexpensive compasses, although in my area, I really do not need one at all. I spend my time in NYC and a suburban area that I had ridden a bicycle all over. The maps for each are etched in my mind, and picking direction is a matter of looking up.

However, if I were going to spend any money at all, I would go for binoculars with the compass in them, for taking bearings. I've used them racing sailboats and really like them. Something like this: http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/sto...classNum=12363. That's an expensive option, but you can find similar products for a little over $100.

I also use one these ball type compasses while I am hunting.

Johnny is right in that it is easy to just look down to get a fix on a general direction with it when you are pushing through heavy bush.

I pin this ball compass on my left shoulder and it also prevents my rifle sling from falling off my shoulder when moving.

I have a Timex Compass Watch but have not found it very reliable (it always seems to need resetting) so I replaced the original watchband with one that has a buttom compass built in to it. I got the plastic replacement band at WalMart for about $4.00.

Mike

D'oh! A day later and I finally get the reference.


-Blast

Hi Am_Fear_Liath_Mor:

I did a quick Google search for this compass (Silva SERE 40 Luminous compass). I couldn't find a US source do you have one?

Burton the US supplier for Silva doesn't carry this model.

Thanks,
duckbill

Hi duckbill,

Unfortunately I don't have a US source for the Silva SERE 40 compass.

I purchased my Silva SERE 40 here in the UK at http://www.springfields.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=24_39_69&products_id=3148

The FB 1605 NATO Survival Compass available at http://www.bestglide.com/FB1605_Info.html

and

http://www.tadgear.com/x-treme%20gear/compasses%20main/sas_compass.htm

although more expensive and almost twice as heavy (almost 2 grams more ) is an excellent model as well.

I usually wear a small compass -- a bit bigger than a button but still small -- on my old dog tag chain. Pretty handy when I travel and am not familiar with an area.