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#117341 - 12/24/07 01:25 AM Re: pack of wolfs attack female joggers [Re: picard120]
LED Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/01/05
Posts: 1474
I'm pretty sure a marine air horn (the small ones) would have done the trick. Something you could easily carry when jogging.

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#117343 - 12/24/07 01:31 AM Re: pack of wolfs attack female joggers [Re: ponder]
Blitz Offline
Gear Junkie
Addict

Registered: 08/23/07
Posts: 535
Loc: MA
Simple fact is, they were in area they knew was not safe. On top of that they went in with animals that would be prey in the natural environment. That to me is just stupid.


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#117347 - 12/24/07 01:50 AM Re: pack of wolfs attack female joggers [Re: NightHiker]
raydarkhorse Offline
Addict

Registered: 01/27/07
Posts: 510
Loc: on the road 10-11 months out o...
Originally Posted By: NightHiker
Originally Posted By: ponder
Originally Posted By: Blitz
There were warnings posted about the wolves in the area.

I wish they would post some public jogging areas in Idaho. It is damn hard to find a quality trail like that!


I've got mixed feelings on that, I can't decide whether I'm more anxious to get rid of wolves or joggers. laugh

Joggers with out a doubt!!!!!!
_________________________
Depend on yourself, help those who are not able, and teach those that are.

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#117351 - 12/24/07 02:18 AM Re: pack of wolfs attack female joggers [Re: raydarkhorse]
big_al Offline
Addict

Registered: 01/04/06
Posts: 586
Loc: 20mi east of San Diego

You people have it all wrong, Walk with A female Wolf in heat, No problems. smile

_________________________
Some people try to turn back their odometers.
Not me, I want people to know "why" I look this way
I've traveled a long way and some of the roads weren't paved

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#117352 - 12/24/07 02:19 AM Re: pack of wolfs attack female joggers [Re: Blitz]
ponder Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 12/18/06
Posts: 367
Loc: American Redoubt
Originally Posted By: Blitz
...On top of that they went in with animals that would be prey.... That to me is just stupid.


That to me is just bait!
_________________________
Cliff Harrison
PonderosaSports.com
Horseshoe Bend, ID
American Redoubt
N43.9668 W116.1888

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#117776 - 12/28/07 06:11 AM Re: pack of wolfs attack female joggers [Re: ponder]
Art_in_FL Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/01/07
Posts: 2432
Exactly how much of an 'attack' was this?

Due to my slow connection I couldn't view the video. I have read about what might be the same, or a similar, incident. If so the women were not killed. More 'threatened' and afraid than anything else.

Wolves are intelligent and curious. Might be the wolves were just sniffing around and playing. Being wild animals and predators they are rough and easily draw blood from us thin skinned humans.

IMHO if the pack had intended to seriously maim or kill they would have. The outcome largely defines the intent. The joggers get away because the wolves let them.

The joggers also showed a great deal of disrespect and a lack of caution running when they knew wolves were present. Instinct of both cats and dogs is to chase and nip at any running animal.

Confronted with wolves or large cats you face them and back off slowly. The worse thing you can do is turn and run.

IMHO anyone who can't observe simple common sense rules for sharing territory with wolves needs to stay out of their territory. Stay indoors, run on your treadmill and when you do go outside stay in your SUV.

I see no harm in carrying a can of bear spray. Heavy hands with a bite. But this shouldn't be seen as an alternative to common sense steps like staying away from known wolf areas when running and stopping and backing out slowly if you see them.

IMO firearms are overkill on anything less than a wolf that has clearly demonstrated hostile intent. Chasing and scaring runners too stupid to respect the wolves and act appropriately doesn't qualify.

If and when wolves clearly demonstrate hostility a shotgun would be my choice. I think your going to find a #2 and #4 buck shot to be optimal. Double ought, and especially triple ought, are way too large. Your going to have massive holes in your pattern and end up either missing or maiming the wolves.

Kill if you must to end a clear and immediate threat but kill cleanly. No need to be cruel.

An interesting site with useful information:
http://www.wildsentry.org/WolfAttack.html

It points out that the overall risk of wolf attack is quite low. I'm far more likely to slip in my tub and drown than to be harmed by a wolf.

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#117783 - 12/28/07 09:40 AM Re: pack of wolfs attack female joggers [Re: Art_in_FL]
KG2V Offline

Veteran

Registered: 08/19/03
Posts: 1371
Loc: Queens, New York City
Originally Posted By: Art_in_FL
...snip...The joggers also showed a great deal of disrespect and a lack of caution running when they knew wolves were present. Instinct of both cats and dogs is to chase and nip at any running animal.

...snip...
IMHO anyone who can't observe simple common sense rules for sharing territory with wolves needs to stay out of their territory. Stay indoors, run on your treadmill and when you do go outside stay in your SUV.

...snip...
Chasing and scaring runners too stupid to respect the wolves and act appropriately doesn't qualify.

...snip...


Now, just to play devils advocate here:

The Wolfs showed a "great deal of disrespect and a lack of caution" when dealing with humans. Instinct of humans is to remove threats to themselves.

...snip...

"IMHO any animal that can't observe simple common sense rules for sharing territory with Humans needs to stay out of their territory."

...snip...

"Chasing and scaring runners is too stupid for Humans to respect the wolves "

Humans are the top of the preditor chain, both because we DO know when to back off (most of the time), OR we pre-plan and eliminate threats. 50-60 years ago, we would not even be having this discussion - that pack of wolves would already be dead, and their pelts on the way to market
_________________________
73 de KG2V
You are what you do when it counts - The Masso
Homepage: http://www.thegallos.com
Blog: http://kg2v.blogspot.com

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#117796 - 12/28/07 01:25 PM Re: pack of wolfs attack female joggers [Re: KG2V]
benjammin Offline
Rapscallion
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 4020
Loc: Anchorage AK
Such may be the case again. Wolves are just as easy to kill today as they were a hundred years ago when they were all but eradicated. Their survival, as with any other critters roaming our lands, is at our will and pleasure. When we tire of their nostalgic appeal and our sense of guilt returns to where it should, they then may also go the way of the Dodo. Perhaps we may be magnanimous enough to keep a few as pets or in zoos, like most of the other wild beasts that someday will be gone from the wild places.

Species come and species go. That's the way it's always been, and there are no exceptions. Our number will come up sooner or later, but for now, we can enjoy being A#1, the dominant species of the globe, masters of all we survey. I doubt seriously we will ever get smart enough to prevent our own demise. Therein also, I already believe our days here are numbered as a matter of faith, but that's a good thing (well, for some of us anyways).
_________________________
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer, English Philosopher (1820-1903)

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#117804 - 12/28/07 01:51 PM Re: pack of wolfs attack female joggers [Re: benjammin]
KG2V Offline

Veteran

Registered: 08/19/03
Posts: 1371
Loc: Queens, New York City
Yeah - I've actually gotten to see an Alpha wolf up close and personal, and NOT in a cage (was brought on a tour to the local environmantal center)

The handler actually believed "there are no documented cases of wolves attacking humans" - I had to supress the laughter on THAT comment.

I will say he was an AMAZING animal - and his handlers had him under amazing control. That said I felt a lot better that he was in a spot that there was NO way he was getting to me OR my children. Picture a really really fit husky - and about 75% larger, and a LOT more muscles
_________________________
73 de KG2V
You are what you do when it counts - The Masso
Homepage: http://www.thegallos.com
Blog: http://kg2v.blogspot.com

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#117814 - 12/28/07 02:34 PM Re: pack of wolfs DID NOT attack female joggers [Re: picard120]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5357
Loc: SOCAL
The wolves attacked Buddy, the American Bull Terrier who incidentally fought back and survived. If the wolves had attacked the female joggers they would have had video from a hospital instead of the veterinarian. The first part of the video is all about the women being surrounded, THEN they mention that the wolves were after the dog as food. The women were slower, weaker and easier targets, but still the wolves went after the ABT instead of the women.

Next time they should go jogging without the ABT and see if the wolves are still interested. If they attack the women without the dog there we'll have a scientific data point indicating that wolves do attack people wink All we know now is that these wolves attacked a dog -- no big deal, we knew they attack and eat dogs.
_________________________
Better is the Enemy of Good Enough.
Okay, what’s your point??

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