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#112382 - 11/13/07 05:50 PM Re: How do you guys find happiness in life? [Re: benjammin]
MartinFocazio Offline

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 01/21/03
Posts: 2203
Loc: Bucks County PA
Originally Posted By: benjammin

Other rules, such as transporting dairy or produce, or slaughtering animals out in the back yard, ought to be done in a prescribed, proven method to reduce the inherent health risks associated with such activity.
[/quote=benjammin]

Balderdash. The rules of commercial poultry raising are created to facilitate an environment in which cows are dragging their swollen udders in a vast pile of their own contaminated feces, where chickens are fed their own excrement, and where milk is pasteurized to compensate for the filthy facilities in which the cows are milked. I know all of this by direct experience having worked on a farm in my youth. The "inherent risks" you speak of are a direct result of the dire hygenic conditions precipitated by the massive application of antibiotics.

[quote=benjammin]
Perhaps you exercise all the hygenic effort necessary to prevent the spread of disease, contamination, or pests. However, rules such as these are in effect because at some point, some bozo decided to slaughter his chickens in the back yard, and he was not too careful about how he went about it, and maybe some kid or woman saw him doing it and took offense, or the blood and guts entered the public domain or some such and now you've got a public nuisance issue, and possibly a health concern, and so those activities have to be regulated somehow.
[/quote=benjammin]

As, yes, the "it happened once" so we all must pay arguments. Classic of a governmental agency - it's easier to criminalize everyone and everything, rather than take on the hard work of living in a free society.

[quote=benjammin]
I bet no one's ever come to your home to check and see if you are in fact sitting inside the house drinking beer, unless someone saw you do it and for some reason took offense and called the authorities. Likely if you are prudent about your actions, that would not be possible. It is the careless that get popped for this sort of thing.


Self censorship? Fearing the authorities? The neighbors? Last I heard beer was legal to drink anywhere I damn well please in my own home. When you start thinking that "getting careless" could "get you popped" when all you're doing is what you want and nobody else is involved at all, yeah, I have a big problem with that. To get back On Topic - that makes me unhappy.


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#112388 - 11/13/07 06:22 PM Re: How do you guys find happiness in life? [Re: MartinFocazio]
thseng Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 900
Loc: NW NJ
Frankly, Martin, based on your confession, I think you have a bigger beef with your town council than with religious zealots.

_________________________
- Tom S.

"Never trust and engineer who doesn't carry a pocketknife."

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#112472 - 11/14/07 12:48 PM Re: How do you guys find happiness in life? [Re: MartinFocazio]
benjammin Offline
Rapscallion
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 4020
Loc: Anchorage AK
I understand what you're saying, and this is just not the place in which to elaborate effectively about the subject. Drinking beer in and of itself is not the point of contention, it is more specifically what some people do after they drink the beer that is the problem leading to regulation. I can't imagine anyone who might take offense at seeing you consume a beer in your own home calling the cops to complain. What I see as a more likely event would be someone hearing a stereo system wailing away at 11:00 pm, looking in a window of the house where the noise is coming from, finding those inside drinking and making merry, and then calling the cops, who cite the homeowner/occupant of the house causing the ruckus with disturbing the peace, etc...

It isn't necessarily the act itself that gave cause to the regulation, but the outcome that effected others that promulgated it.

As for the slaughtering/dairy issue, I agree that the realities of government allow for abuses such that the little guy gets stepped on while the industry gets away with murder. I've fought the good fight at city hall to try and correct some of that a long time ago, with mixed results. The bottom line was I was allowed to slaughter goats privately so long as it was not on public land or within the city limits. I found that accomodating enough for the amount of effort it took, and while it was a compromise, it did give me at least the option. That was smalltown, USA back then, though. I doubt you'd have any hope for success changing the regs in somewhere like Milwaukee, Chicago, or Knoxville. The industry lobbies are far too strong there. I worked at a slaughterhouse and was amazed at what they could get away with and what they absolutely could not.

Still, there is much that could be said to continue this discussion, but not here. I wish we could sit over a few beers somewhere, either your place or mine, and hash this out; I bet we could both learn something.

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#112494 - 11/14/07 04:34 PM Re: How do you guys find happiness in life? [Re: benjammin]
Misanthrope Offline
Member

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 156
Loc: Chicago burbs
First off, Martin should be arrested for his prior heinous acts and sentenced to watching Bear Grylls repeatedly for the next 2 weeks.

And let's be honest, that which makes us happy is a drink before and a cigarette after.
_________________________
I hear voices....And they don't like you.

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#112498 - 11/14/07 04:44 PM Re: How do you guys find happiness in life? [Re: Misanthrope]
Kris Offline
Addict

Registered: 04/13/07
Posts: 627
Loc: A Canadian Back in Canada
Originally Posted By: Misanthrope

And let's be honest, that which makes us happy is a drink before and a cigarette after.


replace 'cigarette' with 'cigar', and your right on the money!
_________________________
"One should not increase, beyond what is necessary, the number of entities required to explain anything"
William of Ockham (1285-1349)

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