A few quick notes on Fire Safes.

Fire safes like you buy at Staples or another office supply store are able to protect PAPER - and only paper - not CD's or other electronic media. It actually gets quite hot in a fire safe in a fire.

We worked a fire about a month ago, a HUGE fire in a house that was designed to look like a barn, and when they located the fire safe, the papers inside were hot, but intact, but the CD's had fused into a mass of plastic. I don't know how well magnetic media would hold up, but I've heard stories of hard drives surviving incredible heat and still working. YMMV.

If you want a fireproof box for CD's you need a "MEDIA RATED" fire safe and they are much more expensive.

Hadn't thought of that. Thanks for the warning!

-Blast

Just to add my $.02, since collecting safes are a hobby of mine. You are correct, there is a HUGE difference between fire-resistant safes, and media safes, in the way they protect the contents, the quality of construction, ratings, and most of all, price. Either way, I would STRONGLY recommend everyone to get some sort of safe, even if it's not optimal, it's still better than nothing.

Most all retail fire safes use some sort of gypsum or drywall lining, which releases moisture to raise the humidity level inside the safe during a fire. This effectively keeps the interior temperature down below the 350 degree rating for a certain length of time. And most everyone that's read Ray Bradbury knows the ignition temperature of paper is 451 Farenheit. The problem is as you mentioned, media is destroyed way below that temperature. Also, there doesn't seem to be consistant standards for fire ratings, some rate up to 1700 degrees, some more, some less. I'm not sure how hot a normal house fire gets, so who knows how accurate the ratings are.

Media safes are much, much more expensive for the size, but are rated to keep contents below 125 degrees. They do it by using massive amounts of insulation, which makes the safe much larger and more expenisve for the same interior space. Also, neither one of these are really rated for theft resistance, they do a pretty good job, but for that you'll also have to look for a TL rating.

I'm guessing placement of the safe is also an issue, I've heard certain areas stay much cooler during a fire, such as next to an interior brick wall where it won't be exposed as much. I haven't been able to find any studies to support this, just ancedotal evidence.

The other things you need to look for are a good seal. Not only will it expand to seal it during a fire, but it also keeps water out. Having gone through a house fire before, it's not just the fire that will do damage, but the fireman also. When are trying to put it out, they can cause just as much, if not more damage than the actual fire. I actually take the layered approach, and keep a smaller safe within a larger safe. I can't say for sure how well it works, but if it protects the contents against the heat for just a few minutes more, that might make all the difference between saving it and losing it.

Just a thought on paper in fires. Paper will indeed ignite at 451F. But papers pressed together with a non-metal or burnable weight will probably just get crispy around the edges. I've seen the aftermath of a house fire where the books were still readable. They stank, and were charred at the edges, but the information was still there.

Sue

I think staples DOES sell some media rated fire safes

I've also heard of people storing containers of water on top of their safes. The theory behind this was, in a fire the plastic will melt causing water to spill all over the safe to keep it cool. It seems plausible, but I don't know if it's ever been tested. I just mentioned it because there are a lot of other other factors that can influence the outcome, other than just the type of safe.

Borg-like? Haha. Before the internet, I just thought I had some strange fetishes (flashlights, lighters, locks), but now i realize there are millions of people who are even worse than me. I almost consider myself normal. Check out this kid I saw on TV the other day

http://www.glumbert.com/media/vacuum

My parents put up with a lot of junk, but I think even they would've drawn the line at this.

Also, consider off site back-up. Either on-line or by leaving cd's at your brothers house. Either is a fine way to preserve your docs.

Teacher

Media safes are a very good idea. The differences compared to most commercial safes isn't just a mater of internal temperature. most commercially available safes use gypsum cement as insulation. This is the same stuff as the inside of drywall. It is a very good fire barrier. In part because gypsum contains, even when dry to the touch, a large quantity of water trapped in its crystal structure. For a fire to get through drywall it has to boil off all the water before the temperature can rise past 212F. Even after the water is gone the dehydrated gypsum is both non-flammable and a poor conductor.

While in most cases drywall releasing water vapor during a fire is not a problem in the case of a safe it depends on what is inside. Paper, and many other materials, can stand a considerable amount of vapor and steam. Computer media, particularly the older 4.25 and 7.5 (remember the old floppies? Way back when a fast CPU operated at 50Khz, memory was measured in KB and a large HD was 100MB. LOL) discs. CDs and DVDs can melt, warp, or corrode. The clear side isn't as sensitive as the thin layer of aluminum under the painted label. That delicate layer of aluminum can corrode. You can see it when it has happened. The disc turns grey and black.

Media safes are designed to keep the insides cooler and, because they don't use water containing gypsum as insulation, drier. So they don't warp or fuse and they don't corrode.

There are media rated safes out there. Be prepared to pay through the nose for a media safe. A cheaper alternative is a media rated box. This is essentially a smallish water-tight insulated box that is designed to go inside a fire safe and make up the difference between what a regular fire safe does and what the media needs. These are a lot more affordable than a complete safe designed around the media standard.

These are available at many office suppliers. If they don't have them on hand they have them in their catalog and can order them.

Buy a media safe ( small one -just larger than a shoebox)and put this inside a fire safe. Even Wal Mart has cheap ones. The best way to buy a firesafe is to go to a used safe store. The prices are usually a fraction of the cost of a new safe. Basement temperatures in a fire are often very low and this is usually the best place for the safe. Be sure to have the safe off of the floor by 6" or so-More if basement flooding an issue. You can also put water sensitive articles in a waterproof container. Very large safes are often very cheap as most people have no use for them. If you ever do a room addition with a basement have a giant safe dropped in just after the floor is poured and before the 1st floor joists are put down. My 7ftH x4'W x 3'D two door safe cost me $1000 including curbside delivery and the cost of a crane to stop by and hoist it into the basement. Best idea I ever had for secure storage.