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#105282 - 09/11/07 02:19 PM New method for CPR proposed
thseng Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 900
Loc: NW NJ
This is still in the early stages, but it sounds promising:
http://news.uns.purdue.edu/x/2007b/070905GeddesCPR.html

I hope they can reproduce the results. No mention of possible drawbacks, though...
_________________________
- Tom S.

"Never trust and engineer who doesn't carry a pocketknife."

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#105285 - 09/11/07 02:28 PM Re: New method for CPR proposed [Re: thseng]
CBTENGR Offline
Member

Registered: 06/13/07
Posts: 99
This is very interesting and seems to be a manual way of doing what the body does on its own during stressful situations. Push blood from the abdomen and extremities into the heart. I wonder if this has been tested or would work as well for infants and pedes.
_________________________
Spemque metumque inter dubiis - Hover between hope and fear. (Vergil)

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#105310 - 09/11/07 06:16 PM Re: New method for CPR proposed [Re: CBTENGR]
Susan Offline
Geezer

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 5163
Loc: W. WA
The drawbacks aren't likely to be as bad as with current methods of CPR:

1) Even a responder in good physical shape tends to lose strength/pressure after just one minute of chest compressions.

2) The success rate is low even if properly performed.

3) The success rate is even lower when there is only one responder.

4) Vomiting during CPR is common, and can result in the victim inhaling the vomit and choking. At the very least, it interrupts the chest compressions.

5) Broken ribs during regular CPR can splinter and perforate the heart, lungs, etc.

6) Most people don't carry CPR masks and won't give MTM resusitation because they're afraid of getting a disease. (This despite the fact that most of these same people would pick up, kiss and have unprotected sex with any available party.)

If this is a truly viable method, I hope the word gets out. Looking at the wooden "pressure applicator", the design/pattern for it could be put on the internet and made by almost anyone, and could be carried in a car, briefcase or backpack.

Sue

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#105368 - 09/12/07 02:49 AM Re: New method for CPR proposed [Re: Susan]
OldBaldGuy Offline
Geezer

Registered: 09/30/01
Posts: 5695
Loc: Former AFB in CA, recouping fr...
Interesting figures.

I have never considered myself to be in super shape, yet I have performed CPR for over 15 minutes without pooping out (I was ready to be releaved tho), I never had a victim vomit during the procedure, but have seen it happen. That is usually caused by blowing air into the stomach instead of lungs, caused by inproper head positioning. I batted a thousand in my CPR, lost every one of them (but then all were found to have massive closed head injuries, non-survivable). I never performed CPR "bareback" either, always used a pocket mask...
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OBG

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#105371 - 09/12/07 02:58 AM Re: New method for CPR proposed [Re: ]
OldBaldGuy Offline
Geezer

Registered: 09/30/01
Posts: 5695
Loc: Former AFB in CA, recouping fr...
In my experience, CPR will/can work if started soon enough in the case of heart attack, drowing, etc, but in the case of severe trauma (as in being thrown out of an overturning vehicle and landing on the head), the success rate is zip...
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OBG

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#105378 - 09/12/07 05:17 AM Re: New method for CPR proposed [Re: ]
CBTENGR Offline
Member

Registered: 06/13/07
Posts: 99
CPR for heart attack victims started in less than about 2 min. is 20% effective. In the state of WA where they are ahead of the edge in training everyday people in CPR it's about 33%. I think the last time I took my CPR training (about 2 mos ago) the figure for trauma (car accidents) was less than 7%. If you are not a first responder than these figure may seem pesimistic, but if you can give someone even a 1% chance of living for a few minutes of your time than I hope it would be worth the try.
_________________________
Spemque metumque inter dubiis - Hover between hope and fear. (Vergil)

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#105384 - 09/12/07 12:36 PM Re: New method for CPR proposed [Re: CBTENGR]
thseng Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 900
Loc: NW NJ
Well, there are lies, damned lies... and statistics.

I would question whether the "low success rate" for CPR is mostly due to its ineffectiveness of helping people that CAN be saved or if it is used very often on people who are already good and dead.

As OBG said, if the brain is guacamole, or he's bled out, or its been too long, NOTHING is going to be effective. That doesn't mean you shouldn't try.
_________________________
- Tom S.

"Never trust and engineer who doesn't carry a pocketknife."

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#105387 - 09/12/07 12:59 PM Re: New method for CPR proposed [Re: thseng]
Ors Offline
Namu (Giant Tree)
Addict

Registered: 09/16/05
Posts: 664
Loc: Florida, USA
Maybe the statistics have to do with the fact that so many people don't care anymore. I work with kids a lot and it seems the narcissism runs deep these days. Maybe it's due to the fact that some people find it more interesting to watch another living being die rather than try to intervene...or maybe they're just lazy. Rather grim view of things I know, but it seems in some ways that's how society in this country is.
_________________________
Ors, MAE, MT-BC
Memento mori
Vulnerant omnes, ultima necat (They all wound, the last kills)

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#105414 - 09/12/07 02:40 PM Re: New method for CPR proposed [Re: OldBaldGuy]
CBTENGR Offline
Member

Registered: 06/13/07
Posts: 99
The only one I've had that was successful was on a 2yo. My partner and I got there before the medics and I started chest compressions while the mother administered MTM. She did the right thing and started CPR before calling 911. I think that was the only thing that saved her daughter. CPR is really all about training and a whole lot of luck.
_________________________
Spemque metumque inter dubiis - Hover between hope and fear. (Vergil)

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#105427 - 09/12/07 04:41 PM Re: New method for CPR proposed [Re: thseng]
clearwater Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/19/05
Posts: 1185
Loc: Channeled Scablands
The rate of success is higher in electrocution and drowning,
especially young folks and cold water drowning (success at
up to an hour later). For those instances I would much more likely
give it a try and try longer.

Above all, at least clear the airway and position the head, that
alone can restart breathing in some.

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