Hmmm ... thread not locked ... good sign.

Originally Posted By: Pete


[...] And why does it require ten deputies to subdue one man who is shot and lying motionless on the ground?

The police have a very difficult job to do. But there needs to be a better balance in their response to incidents like this.

There is a phobia about knives in this country. It's weird - almost some sort of deep primeval fear. Maybe it comes from the ridiculous number of Hollywood horror shows that show people getting carved up.

Anyway - the takeaway is to be careful how you carry a knife in public. And perhaps avoid doing it near civic centers.

Pete #2


I think you nailed a big part of the story there Pete.

Some of this might come down to rote learning of police academy classes where an instructor might repeatedly drill the students that you tell a knife holder to drop the knife three times and 'then you shoot them'. Police Academy 101 taken too literally. Fact, under stress people revert to lower levels of understanding and loose the nuances in their training. Was Birk under inordinate stress?

The other thing that pops up related to police training is the nuget of conventional wisdom that 'A man with a knife can kill you faster than you can use a gun'. This is sometimes stated as 'within 25' a knife is faster than a gun'.

Like most such bromides there is a grain of truth. In a situation where the knife man can use concealment a highly trained or talented person with a knife, a cross between a ninja and 'Mack the knife', can cover ground so fast, and inflict so much damage, that they might, conceivably, get the drop on an inattentive person carrying a gun and kill them before they can shoot.

Thing is that Williams, half drunk or better, doesn't strike me as being ninja material. A street corner in broad daylight limits opportunity for sneaking up on a person unaware. Birk seemed much more aware, alert, and prepared than Williams.

The one thing that sticks out in this is just how frightened the police seem to be. The initial shooting seems to be a combination of reversion to simpler levels of understanding, rote learning, and fear. But after that it is all fear. IMHO irrational fear. Holding gun/s on prostrate victims when they are pretty clearly no longer a credible threat. it is likely policy. But what were they thinking? Maybe he had a bomb vest? That the knife was a super weapon? That he might pop up and slash them all to pieces?

Waiting until you have ten officers present and forming a tactical stack seems to point toward irrational fear and deep need for reassurance and support. That it was the police feeling small and weak when confronted with a half-drunk guy with a knife using a cross walk. He even crossed with the light. Clearly a well mannered and traffic aware slasher ... the best kind.

One thing is clear; people who carry knives need to be aware that much of the public, and some police, see a knife, no matter how small and innocently carried as an immediate deadly threat. As people move toward electronics and away from hands-on use of tools this inordinate fear is only likely to grow.