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#70193 - 07/30/06 01:53 PM Re: Another survival kit link
Stu Offline
I am not a P.P.o.W.
Old Hand

Registered: 05/16/05
Posts: 1058
Loc: Finger Lakes of NY State
Think of the poor souls who buy it, never open it or check out the gear in it, and think they are covered.
_________________________
Our most important survival tool is our brain, and for many, that tool is way underused! SBRaider
Head Cat Herder

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#70194 - 07/30/06 03:17 PM a deck of cards...?
teacher Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 12/14/05
Posts: 988
In the photo, it looks like a deck of cards is included....

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#70195 - 07/30/06 03:24 PM Re: a deck of cards...?
Simon Offline


Registered: 04/24/06
Posts: 398
Loc: Tennessee
I guess something in the kit to fight boredom....play solitaire. I saw waterproof cards being sold in the boating section at Wal-mart now too..... <img src="/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />
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Me, a vegetarian? My set of teeth came with canines.

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#70196 - 07/30/06 05:16 PM Re: a deck of cards...?
Stu Offline
I am not a P.P.o.W.
Old Hand

Registered: 05/16/05
Posts: 1058
Loc: Finger Lakes of NY State
Why no t use the playing cards printed with survival info?? At least 1 company, maybe more, make them. Boredom killer, with info on them.Survival Cards
_________________________
Our most important survival tool is our brain, and for many, that tool is way underused! SBRaider
Head Cat Herder

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#70197 - 07/30/06 06:30 PM Re: Another survival kit link
bigreddog Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 07/02/06
Posts: 253
True.

On the other hand, if it means more people are carrying even simple basics (such as a poncho, knife and matches) then it's a good thing. Never mind the quality, it's still better than relying on fingernails and a credit card during teotwawki!

Better tools are great, but every year lives are lost where a whistle and a space blanket might have saved them

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#70198 - 07/30/06 09:23 PM Re: Another survival kit link
duckear Offline
Addict

Registered: 03/01/04
Posts: 478
Of course you can assemble a better kit.....but would you do it for free? After factoring in the costs of say Leatherman vs Winchester AND a profit, who would be able to buy it?

I would dare say that 99% of the commercial kits available don't contain "THE BEST" of every single item in a kit. For the sake of affordability, compromises have to be made. While I wouldn't personally buy a Winchester multi-tool, I would imagine that it would suffice for most cases for the 24 or 48 hours until rescue.

If it is that easy, go start a company, make kits and get rich. Anybody see Doug Ritter's new Jag?? <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

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#70199 - 07/30/06 10:34 PM Re: Another survival kit link
Leigh_Ratcliffe Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/06
Posts: 1355
Loc: United Kingdom.
If your marketing a mass produced item, then economy of scale comes into play. I was working on the basis of one bespoke, own use kit. At retail prices. <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
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I don't do dumb & helpless.

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#70200 - 07/31/06 08:05 AM Re: Another survival kit link
Burncycle Offline
Addict

Registered: 09/16/04
Posts: 577
Actually I have a winchester that's held up, thusfar, through quite a bit of use. That may be the exception rather than the rule though.

Curiously, I cannot find a picture of the model I have online...

Frustratingly enough, I also have a gerber and I can't find a picture of that either. It doesn't have those black tabs on the handles you see on all their models now...

*EDIT* Found a picture of the Gerber on Ebay

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#70201 - 07/31/06 04:40 PM Re: Another survival kit link
harrkev Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/05/01
Posts: 384
Loc: Colorado Springs, CO
Simon: please note that this post is not directed spcifically at you, but partially to you and partially to others who have posted on this thread.

I would just like to point out that there is a definate cost of doing business.

My wife started her own web-based business for "Christian marriage enrichment" (shameless plug: http://www.covenantspice.com - some parts may be very slightly not-safe-for-work). You would be surprised about the costs of staying in business.

In this line of work, those products usually wholesale for about 50% of the retail cost. We buy an item at $10 and sell it for $20. You might be thinking that this is fantastic (and at first, so did I), but it is a lot more complicated than that. Let me explain...

Business licenses & such will run between $100 and $200 per year, depending upon where you live. Secondly, you have to factor in such things as the cost of web servers, cost of advertising, amortize the cost of your "equipment" such as fax machine, accounting software, books on web authoring, ink cartridges for printers/faxes, reams of paper, etc. We also have to pay to get our products shipped to us, which is usually from Kalifornia to Florda - a pretty far distance. Also, we use a shopping cart service, and they process the credit card info for us, and they charge us a several-percent fee for the use of their service. But if we didn't use their service, then we would need to set our own encryption certificate and credit card gateway, which would cost more money. We run this business our of our own home (no extra rent, electricity, etc.) and have no employees (no workman's comp, etc.).

After all of this is done, what is left is profit, and what does not get re-invested back into growing inventory is subject to income tax. So, for a $10 purchase, we may get $3.00 of actual, real, go-on-a-shopping-spree profit. And this assumes that my time and my wife's time is free. If you count the number of hours spent in this business, all my wife did was buy herself a job at less than minimum wage. But, we fill a niche market that we believe strongly in, and my wife has a pride of ownership an accomplishment that you can't find at any minimum-wage job.

My wife's business is not actually making a product. All we do is run a web store and pack-n-ship orders. If you then think about making a commercial BOB, you can see that a lot more work has to go into that. Unless you are going to do this out of the goodness of your heart, you want to make some profit for your time.

My wife uses mainly two distributors for most products, and buys directly from the factory for her chocolate products. For a BOB, if you want to include a knife, matches, poncho, water treatment, compass, signal mirror, whistle, etc., you are likely talking about at least a handfull of different manufacturers and distributors. This increases the amount of work that you have to do just to get the product ordered, and increases the shipping that you will have to pay. And if any companies have minimum purchase quantities, you may find yourself sitting on a hundred whistles or mirrors because that was the least that you could order.

I must admit that I am mightily impressed by what D.R. managed to pull off with offering the PSP for under $30 retail. Part of that is the fact that they make those things by the thousands, which is some thing that D.R. might be able to do, but us mere mortals can only dream of.

With all this being said, I must admit that that original link looks expensive for what you get. My wife may double the wholesale price on a $10 item, but we usually have less markup on the more expensive items. We may sell a $40 item for $65 or $70. So a BOB that costs $250 should, in my opinion, probably have a wholesale value of around $150 to $180. I will not take the time to figure out how much that kit would cost through Wal-Mart. But a person cannot go to far wrong by having that kit (except perhaps for the price). Let me put it this way: if you were in a hard-up survival situation and had nothing, you would be mightily glad if you found that kit hidden under a bush. Nothing there is exceptionally good, but it is a whole lot better than nothing.

That entire kit is actually cheaper than one Sebenza. If you only had $300 to spend, would you have one knife and nothing else (no firestarter, compass, light, etc.), or would you rather have all of the bases covered with items of OK but not exceptional quality? I know which one I would choose. So, it might not be the best quality or the best value, but don't judge it too harshly.
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Darwin was wrong -- I'm still alive

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#70202 - 08/02/06 03:50 PM Re: Another survival kit link
Ron Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/05
Posts: 171
Loc: Georgia, USA
I agree that the price is high. I also agree that the Winchester Multitool is a peice of crap. (However the Winchester is probably about as good as any other $10 multitool, which is what you see in other kits.)

There are some very good items in this kit:
Storm Whistle
Star Flash Signal Mirror
BCB Survival Matches Mk3
Tinder-Quik
Smith's Diamond Pocket Stone
Portable Aqua
The LED light looks like a Garrity ?

I think any of the above would be reasonable choices for the best of kits.

Anyway, while I too think it is overpriced, you could do worse.


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