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#44598 - 07/24/05 12:39 PM Re: NYC subway and those random bag searches
Anonymous
Unregistered


Terrorism isn't about religion. Maybe to the dumb grunts, but it isn't. And to them, the use of a heathen to deploy a weapon would seem like a great practical joke. "HAHAHAH!!! We pay them to die, and they do it!"

At least Ii'd find it funnier than anything in thier possition.

(Sorry, Chris, I slipped, bad mouth, going to wash out now)


Edited by ironsraven (07/24/05 01:00 PM)

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#44599 - 07/24/05 12:42 PM Re: NYC subway and those random bag searches
frenchy Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/18/02
Posts: 1320
Loc: France
Quote:
HAHAHAH!!! We pay them to die, and they do it!"

you mean : "we don't even have to pay them for...." <img src="/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
Alain

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#44600 - 07/24/05 12:44 PM Re: NYC subway and those random bag searches
Rick Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 11/26/04
Posts: 54
Loc: Baltmore MD
Those who would sacrifice a little liberty for safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
Thomas Jefferson

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#44601 - 07/24/05 01:41 PM Re: NYC subway and those random bag searches
Rick Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 11/26/04
Posts: 54
Loc: Baltmore MD
Mat we are told to obey the laws of the land, but the people enforcing these laws distort ands pervert them in the name of safety; at the cost of Liberty. You can take our liberties and yes Mat you may have less body parts to pick up; (which by the way is a job you get paid for and you signed on for.) but by taking this liberty you have taken one more piece of America freedom.

One day you can tell your grand kids how you remember a time before America was a police state, and people had freedom and rights guarantee by our constitution. So sleep well; and remember hind sight is 20/20.

Those who would sacrifice a little liberty for safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
Thomas Jefferson

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#44602 - 07/24/05 01:45 PM Re: NYC subway and those random bag searches
Anonymous
Unregistered


That's what Helen and I were talking about above -- Kelo is going to have very broad implications.

I have litigated against the government in one form or another for my entire career, and of all the trends I've watched, this has the greatest potential for abuse.

[And by the way, our local ACLU chapter did a 2nd amendment case a while back -- we couldn't get suit approval from the national, so the lawyer that originated it carried it along himself until they litigated it to a draw.]

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#44603 - 07/24/05 02:16 PM Re: NYC subway and those random bag searches
benjammin Offline
Rapscallion
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 4018
Loc: Anchorage AK
I've been biding my time on this thread, but now I will cut loose.

Dogs will not stop the bombs from coming. If they did, there wouldn't be any more suicide bombers going off in Iraq now.

The people responsible for sending bombs to kill innocents aren't the people actually using the bombs. The responsible parties have power and control. What is it that people with power want? That is the motivation. It has little or nothing to do with hate.

I am an Ex-Pat living and working in the occupied zone of Baghdad with four different US Government badges driving a US government registered vehicle. Every day I am stopped and searched and the car I drive is searched at least three times. If you search everyone, then it doesn't really matter much anymore. Getting searched is better than getting dead. You do what you gotta.

Iraqi men and women who enter the green zone every day to come to work for us have to raise their shirts at the checkpoint as they walk by. Yes, even the women. Islamic culture finds this quite repugnant, but they do what they have to do to survive, and getting paid American dollars is survival. Again, you do what you gotta do.

I am searched at least once every time I come and go from Baghdad at the airports. So is anyone else that goes through the metal detector and sets off the alarm. I'd rather be searched than be in a fireball at 30,000 feet. It is a long walk home from here.

Random searches will be a lousy deterrant. They've already tried that here. It didn't work. Now they search everyone's everything. That stopped the car bombs and the strap on bombs from coming in the green zone, at least for now. The people who get searched don't like it, but they keep coming and going because this is where they get money.

I don't pack a firearm because it is against the rules, but I am allowed to pack the biggest, nastiest blade I can carry, concealed or otherwise. Like I said before, I have two SRKs and a couple 4 foot wooden impalers. Admittedly, they are no match for even a beat up AK-47, but you do what you can.

No TSA agent has taken anything of mine yet while travelling, and I've done my share. I have lost some things to customs agents in other countries. Like someone else said, you learn to expect this. You are not going to argue for long with a guy with a Baretta and a badge in Turkey, or Kuwait, or Yemen....

Does that work?
_________________________
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer, English Philosopher (1820-1903)

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#44604 - 07/24/05 03:15 PM Re: NYC subway and those random bag searches
wolf Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 12/01/04
Posts: 329
Loc: Michigan
First we get searched to go on airplanes. It might save a life - everyone agrees - saving lives is Good. Then we get searched to go onto a subway - it might save a life. Everyone agrees - saving lives is Good. Then we get searched going on Trains - It might save a life - everyone agrees - saving lives is Good. Then we get searched going on busses. Then we get searched entering shopping malls. Then we get searched on the street, or wherever we may be. I don't think it's possible to effectively defend against terrorism without living in what amounts to a prison. Are we willing to do this? I'm not. Aren't we supposed to be free from unlawful searches? Is any search lawful now because it's in the interest of national security? That seems mighty broad in scope to me.
_________________________
"2+2=4 is not life, but the beginning of death." Dostoyevsky

Bona Na Croin

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#44605 - 07/24/05 03:29 PM Re: NYC subway and those random bag searches
Craig Offline


Registered: 11/13/01
Posts: 1784
Loc: Collegeville, PA, USA
Quote:
But what are you carrying in your backpack that you donít want to disclose?


Overall, I agree with you. But my bag is just that. MY bag. I like my stuff to be touched my me (or my wife), and that's it. That's personal privacy and freedom. All I carry is first aid items and flashlights. No big scary knives. But it's my stuff.

Unfortunately, such concepts are being trod underfoot by the "greater good" idea. That which benefits (or is perceived to benefit) the greater number of people is more important than that which benefits the few or the one. I can see how that would apply here.

The NYC police are doing it all wrong, though. "Random" is never random, and random won't do any good, anyway. If you want to screen everyone, then profile everyone. Work up a racial profile on everyone and go from there. It'll never happen, but it would be interesting to see someone try.

-- Craig

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#44606 - 07/24/05 03:30 PM Re: NYC subway and those random bag searches
Anonymous
Unregistered


What would Jefferson say now? That was then, this is........ Jefferson was a very wise person, as were many of his "rebel friends." I am of the opinion he would have advanced his thinking with the tmes, needs, threats, etc. Weapons of mass distruction on those days were more likely microbes, and not even known to the world.
There are plenty of places you can move to in order to escape these terrible violations of our rights.
Me, I will continue to fly and work in a schedule for the TSA time delays and prepare myself by having common sense enough to know what not to take with me in order to stay out of trouble.

"GOD Bless America, still the best place to live!"

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#44607 - 07/24/05 03:36 PM Re: NYC subway and those random bag searches
wolf Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 12/01/04
Posts: 329
Loc: Michigan
Quote:
such concepts are being trod underfoot by the "greater good" idea.


The "Greater Good"... That sounds like something the Soviet Union would have applauded. The individual must sublimate him/herself for the Greater Good. Ochen Khorosho! My delaem vse dlya khorosho naroda!

I feel so cynical.
_________________________
"2+2=4 is not life, but the beginning of death." Dostoyevsky

Bona Na Croin

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