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#289705 - 06/30/18 02:43 PM Surviving Civil Unrest
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5357
Loc: SOCAL
There is an interesting article at: How To Survive The Civil Unrest That's Coming To America
It would be easy to post comments that will drag the topic into a political realm; please temper those demons and keep the topic on preparedness & avoidance, and not on the triggers.

During the 1991 LA riots I ended up with temporary neighbors in the condo next to mine. I was living in a condo in a rather isolated community; a family from LA who knew the owner of the unoccupied condo next to mine (owned as temp residence for the local football team so new players had a place to live while they bought their own), so they moved in to get out of harm’s way; they chose the get-out-of-Dodge option.

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#289706 - 06/30/18 03:37 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
Jeanette_Isabelle Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/13/06
Posts: 2954
Loc: Nacogdoches, Texas
I've been giving a lot of thought to this subject recently. To me, the most obvious is be the grey man. Don't express your political views in any outward way such as talking about them (unless you are in an organized meeting for that purpose such as a gun club), wearing anything that labels you, use any sign on your property or stickers on your car.

Jeanette Isabelle
_________________________
I'm not sure whose twisted idea it was to put hundreds of adolescents in underfunded schools run by people whose dreams were crushed years ago, but I admire the sadism. -- Wednesday Adams, Wednesday

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#289707 - 06/30/18 04:09 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
bws48 Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/18/07
Posts: 831
Loc: Anne Arundel County, Maryland
Originally Posted By: Russ
There is an interesting article at: How To Survive The Civil Unrest That's Coming To America
It would be easy to post comments that will drag the topic into a political realm; please temper those demons and keep the topic on preparedness & avoidance, and not on the triggers.

During the 1991 LA riots I ended up with temporary neighbors in the condo next to mine. I was living in a condo in a rather isolated community; a family from LA who knew the owner of the unoccupied condo next to mine (owned as temp residence for the local football team so new players had a place to live while they bought their own), so they moved in to get out of harm’s way; they chose the get-out-of-Dodge option.


If I remember correctly, several years ago there were a number of threads on this and related topics. It may have been around the time the "Urban Preparedness" section was started---possibly just before. There were excellent suggestions regarding surviving riots, bug outs, bug ins, etc.

I can't manage to find these threads, but if anyone else can and post links, they would be useful to go back to, review and update. Hate to see all that wisdom get lost. . .when it seems so potentially useful again.
_________________________
"Better is the enemy of good enough."

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#289708 - 06/30/18 06:24 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal
From a local headline: "Be uncivil......But Don't Go Crazy"

The last time I specifically checked my weaponry was the occasion of the Rodney King riots (early 90's).

We had a mammoth disruption with the Thomas Fire last December. I and many others left in a hurry, but civil order was maintained. Manned barricades in the evac areas were quickly placed. Looters (there were some attempts, probably inevitable) were apprehended and none of us went crazy. In fact, there was a lot of help and mutual support, but that doesn't make the news as readily....

In an emergency, take care of family members and close friends, and then assist the community at large, as bet I can.
_________________________
Geezer in Chief

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#289709 - 06/30/18 06:39 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
gonewiththewind Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/14/08
Posts: 1517
Maintain a low profile, be prepared to protect what is yours, not just property but family. When people form mobs, they do not behave rationally. Be prepared for irrational behavior. It also provides cover for criminals, be the hard target so they want to go somewhere else. Be aware, but do not enter their awareness if you can help it.

The rest is much like weathering a hurricane, batten the hatches and have what you need for a few days. Communications may still be working, so stay in touch with somebody outside the emergency area.

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#289710 - 06/30/18 07:22 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
M_a_x Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/16/02
Posts: 1204
Loc: Germany
Some riots are predictable and some even scheduled. So it can be avoided to be caught in them.
Berlin has traditional riots on 1st of May.
Some cities in Germany have riots when certain soccer teams play. I try to stay well clear of the arena and the train stations there.
_________________________
If it isn´t broken, it doesn´t have enough features yet.

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#289712 - 06/30/18 09:21 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
bws48 Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/18/07
Posts: 831
Loc: Anne Arundel County, Maryland
My observations on riots, having been caught up in one unexpectedly, and later as an MP trying to suppress one, is that they are highly intense, but very local, and vary greatly in their intensity over a few hours. A city block or two can make the difference between being in the thick of it, or, nothing happening. So, my primary advice is to suppress curiosity and walk away from where all the commotion is, and if you can't walk away, take shelter somewhere, but get off the street; then only when it is safe, get out.

The worst widespread effect I saw was the near total breakdown of the (then landline) telephone system; it was totally overloaded. This was in the days before cellphones (the late 60's/early 70's). I doubt that our cell phone system is any more robust, perhaps even less so.

Locally, in Baltimore, a short while back, there was an episode of serious civil disturbance. I watched it on TV. Different details, but the above thoughts still apply.
_________________________
"Better is the enemy of good enough."

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#289722 - 07/02/18 02:08 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
chaosmagnet Offline
Sheriff
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/03/09
Posts: 3821
Loc: USA
I may be misquoting, but I remember Mr. Miyagi saying something like "Best block for punch, no be there," in the movie Karate Kid.

My Number One plan for riots is to not be around crowds and to get out of built-up areas as quickly as possible, if conditions appear to be degrading. If that cannot work, my main backup plan is to find the most inconspicuous and most secure place to hide, and wait it out.

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#289723 - 07/02/18 03:40 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
Teslinhiker Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/14/09
Posts: 1418
Loc: Nothern Ontario
In today's world of the 24/7 news cycle, social media like Twitter, Facebook, most civil unrest and riots are quickly reported on and can easily be avoided - unless you live in right in the middle of said unrest and riot locations.

In that case, there should still be enough warning to allow one to either prepare to stay and tough it out at your home or workplace or move to another location until it is safe to return. That is, assuming your home or workplace has not been damaged or burned to the ground due to the unrest.
_________________________
Earth and sky, woods and fields, lakes and rivers, the mountain and the sea, are excellent schoolmasters, and teach some of us more than we can ever learn from books.

John Lubbock

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#289724 - 07/02/18 03:56 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
Ian Offline
Member

Registered: 05/15/07
Posts: 198
Loc: Scotland
How about being 'Kettled'?

Kettling


Edited by Ian (07/02/18 04:00 PM)

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#289725 - 07/02/18 04:47 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Ian]
M_a_x Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/16/02
Posts: 1204
Loc: Germany
Kettling or corralling usually is a tactic used by law enforcement to prevent riots. It often is predictable where and when it will be done. Around here it´ll be rallies for very controversial topics, certain soccer games (if you see police in riot gear in Dresden, stay clear of the main train station and the way to the arena) and the traditional 1st of May events.
The rules for not getting caught in a riot apply here as well. Best strategy is to not be there when it happens.
The good news is that news channels often announce those events. The phrase "the police prepares for [insert event of your choice]" is a give away.
_________________________
If it isn´t broken, it doesn´t have enough features yet.

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#289726 - 07/02/18 04:59 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
gonewiththewind Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/14/08
Posts: 1517
If you are not following the feeds of the people organizing the unrest, it may come as a surprise and you may not have the opportunity to depart. Avoidance would be best, but if you can't avoid, stay low and do not attract attention. Do not be an inviting target of opportunity. Crowds do not behave like rational and logical people. Yes there is almost always someone instigating or even directing, but the majority of the people are like cattle, angry and violent cows. They will follow the leaders. Especially when they believe they will remain anonymous. Anonymity changes the way people behave. A large crowd provides anonymity by itself, but when they are hiding their faces be ready for violence. Know what your priorities are for security (family, self, property), and find an escape route if you are targeted. The first thing a sniper does before he establishes a shooting position is to plan his escape route. If you are hunkering down, know how to get out and away from the threat.

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#289730 - 07/03/18 12:49 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
adam2 Offline
Addict

Registered: 05/23/08
Posts: 477
Loc: Somerset UK
Whilst times are normal, I believe in not attracting undue attention.
Dress in a similar style to those around you, don't stand out.
Avoid expressing strong opinions on politics, morals, religion, or even sporting teams.
Democracy is important, but I limit my involvement to voting for the party that I support. And maybe attending small, local, indoor meetings, I would never attend or go near any large scale political rally.

In times of tension or impending riot, stay away from trouble, possibly stay indoors.
Keep an eye on the news for events that could lead to disorder.

Cary a concealed weapon where lawful, but remember that it is better to be in some other place rather than getting into a shoot out.

Make your home as secure as possible without looking like a fortress or being in any way unusual.

Keep supplies of food and water, for emergencies in general and in particular to avoid any need to go the shops for a few days.

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#289732 - 07/03/18 01:27 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: adam2]
Jeanette_Isabelle Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/13/06
Posts: 2954
Loc: Nacogdoches, Texas
Originally Posted By: adam2
Whilst times are normal, I believe in not attracting undue attention.
Dress in a similar style to those around you, don't stand out.
Avoid expressing strong opinions on politics, morals, religion, or even sporting teams.
Democracy is important, but I limit my involvement to voting for the party that I support. And maybe attending small, local, indoor meetings, I would never attend or go near any large scale political rally.

That goes with what I was saying about being the grey man.

Originally Posted By: Jeanette_Isabelle
I've been giving a lot of thought to this subject recently. To me, the most obvious is be the grey man. Don't express your political views in any outward way such as talking about them (unless you are in an organized meeting for that purpose such as a gun club), wearing anything that labels you, use any sign on your property or stickers on your car.

Jeanette Isabelle
_________________________
I'm not sure whose twisted idea it was to put hundreds of adolescents in underfunded schools run by people whose dreams were crushed years ago, but I admire the sadism. -- Wednesday Adams, Wednesday

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#289733 - 07/03/18 01:54 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5357
Loc: SOCAL
Mr. Grey can always get caught up in the stampede when he/she is in the wrong place; being grey only takes you so far. How do you dress grey at a political rally, not wear a red hat? Yeah, that’ll work - not. In the vicinity of a riot the only person who’s grey is the one who isn’t there.

I don’t even watch these rallies on the news, I have no interest.

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#289736 - 07/03/18 02:35 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
gonewiththewind Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/14/08
Posts: 1517
You can do everything perfectly, and it can still go wrong on you. Be prepared for it.

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#289737 - 07/03/18 02:58 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
Jeanette_Isabelle Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/13/06
Posts: 2954
Loc: Nacogdoches, Texas
Originally Posted By: Russ
How do you dress grey at a political rally, not wear a red hat?

I should have bought that "Deplorable Me" T-shirt?

Jeanette Isabelle
_________________________
I'm not sure whose twisted idea it was to put hundreds of adolescents in underfunded schools run by people whose dreams were crushed years ago, but I admire the sadism. -- Wednesday Adams, Wednesday

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#289742 - 07/03/18 05:51 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: adam2]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5357
Loc: SOCAL
Originally Posted By: adam2
Whilst times are normal, I believe in not attracting undue attention.
Dress in a similar style to those around you, don't stand out.
Avoid expressing strong opinions on politics, morals, religion, or even sporting teams.
Democracy is important, but I limit my involvement to voting for the party that I support. And maybe attending small, local, indoor meetings, I would never attend or go near any large scale political rally.

In times of tension or impending riot, stay away from trouble, possibly stay indoors.
Keep an eye on the news for events that could lead to disorder.

Cary a concealed weapon where lawful, but remember that it is better to be in some other place rather than getting into a shoot out.

Make your home as secure as possible without looking like a fortress or being in any way unusual.

Keep supplies of food and water, for emergencies in general and in particular to avoid any need to go the shops for a few days.

I sense a mixed message in that post (possibly due my reading), particularly the comment about carrying a concealed weapon. Don’t carry because of the riot, but rather because you always legally carry a concealed weapon. IMO, people who carry a firearm into a riot are either LE, wannabe LE or bad guys. That said, at least for me, carrying forced me into a heightened state of situational awareness. In many cases (again my opinion), that situational awareness is much more useful than the firearm for personal defense if you heed the signals and leave. I’m not a member of LE so I’d much rather avoid, step well away and be prepared with my cell-phone and camera from a safe distance. $.02

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#289751 - 07/03/18 11:45 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
LesSnyder Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 1680
Loc: New Port Richey, Fla
good intelligence is your friend...as a former analyst of military radio communications I worked with the world's best Morse operators and foreign language specialists... unfortunately I don't have that resource today....as commented the social media sources are available, but I would rather go to the action arm of the local law enforcement, or fire rescue... even with encrypted or duplex (transmit on one frequency and receive on another) a few nights of playing with a frequency scanner can produce some clues, even if you are not able to actually understand the conversations

a change in the amount of radio traffic on a certain frequency is a clue... if you can associate actual incidents reported in a paper or on TV to previously observed increase of radio traffic, it may allow you to identify particular geographic areas covered by that frequency

a "broadcast" transmission without any response from other units typically reflects a high command authority... usually on a higher frequency

in the clear air to ground communications between air units and control

increase in local amateur radio communications... CERT communications

an area I am negligent in is not having a small portable AM/FM pocket radio with ear bud when away from the car, though I don't really spend time in large urban areas

don't forget the OODA loop

Observe....
Orient...
Decide....
Act...

a neutral color baseball cap, sunglasses, and if not out of place a hoodie helps you remain grey...


Edited by LesSnyder (07/03/18 11:46 PM)

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#289753 - 07/04/18 01:49 AM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
gonewiththewind Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/14/08
Posts: 1517
The law enforcement and emergency services would give you information once something begins, but these protest groups use text and social media to plan, recruit and coordinate. I am not sure HAM or other radio transmissions will give you advance warning.

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#289754 - 07/04/18 02:24 AM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: gonewiththewind]
Teslinhiker Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/14/09
Posts: 1418
Loc: Nothern Ontario
Originally Posted By: Montanero
The law enforcement and emergency services would give you information once something begins, but these protest groups use text and social media to plan, recruit and coordinate. I am not sure HAM or other radio transmissions will give you advance warning.


Exactly. I think people underestimate the power and reach of activist and protest groups on social media. These groups are very active and send out event notifications, weeks and days in advance.

Just today, I received a notification for an oil line construction protest. Which although is not my interest, is an in area where if I were to be on the day of the event, I would avoid completely due to being held in a very busy and high traffic area. This means the various LEO units are not going to stand around and let the traffic be disrupted for long. And so I would imagine, things will get somewhat tense and ugly for awhile - but not to the point of riots and properties being damaged or burned down.
_________________________
Earth and sky, woods and fields, lakes and rivers, the mountain and the sea, are excellent schoolmasters, and teach some of us more than we can ever learn from books.

John Lubbock

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#289755 - 07/04/18 02:37 AM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: LesSnyder]
Teslinhiker Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/14/09
Posts: 1418
Loc: Nothern Ontario
Originally Posted By: LesSnyder
good As commented the social media sources are available, but I would rather go to the action arm of the local law enforcement, or fire rescue... even with encrypted or duplex (transmit on one frequency and receive on another) a few nights of playing with a frequency scanner can produce some clues, even if you are not able to actually understand the conversation


In my general area First Responder radio coms are now encrypted and there is no way for the general public to listen in.

In my immediate area, only Police and Ambulance are on, what is known as the E-COMM Radio System but I would suspect that will change in the next few years.

_________________________
Earth and sky, woods and fields, lakes and rivers, the mountain and the sea, are excellent schoolmasters, and teach some of us more than we can ever learn from books.

John Lubbock

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#289757 - 07/04/18 06:33 PM Re: Surviving Civil Unrest [Re: Russ]
Dagny Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 1918
Loc: Washington, DC

My plan for civil unrest is to sweep my "Wipe Your Paws" front and rear doormats and settle in for a CNN and Netflix binge.

That assumes I'm home when it happens.



.

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