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#287987 - 01/23/18 07:08 PM Re: New knife [Re: Russ]
M_a_x Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/16/02
Posts: 1105
Loc: Germany
If a person is not confident wielding the axe or hachet, it still can be used in the style of an ulu knife. So if it is there, it can be put to use relatively safely.
Someone who is not used to wielding an axe or hachet probably should not pack it anyway.
I probably might have a hachet with me as part of my camping equipment but not as a part of a dedicated survival kit. The points Doug made convinced me a long time ago.
I once received a minor cut when I carried an axe with the flat side of the blade resting on my forearm to gain some manouverability.
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If it isn´t broken, it doesn´t have enough features yet.

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#287988 - 01/23/18 07:22 PM Re: New knife [Re: M_a_x]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5338
Loc: SOCAL
The big problem as I see it is that a wound from an axe can be catastrophic, and in a survival situation could be deadly — fingers and toes, deep lacerations with no medical facility available. Not further injuring yourself is big in a survival situation. As Doug said, there are ways to get the same result more safely with other tools. An axe carries a lot of momentum.

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#287989 - 01/23/18 07:31 PM Re: New knife [Re: Russ]
gonewiththewind Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/14/08
Posts: 1517
In what he wrote, he said he "tends to avoid them" and prefers a saw. That is far from an absolute recommendation to not use them at all.

As for the hand made knives, it is not about "showing your wealth". In most cases these knives are better, if they are intended for practical use. Some are more of an art object, a piece of excellent craftsmanship. Some people collect vinyl records, some people collect old cars. A choice of a knife is more of a practical one based on experience, need, and preference. It is not an ideological or moral choice.

As I have posted in the past, my preference is for more durable, stronger knives. This is based on more than 40 years of outdoor experience in difficult environments and performing difficult tasks. The old Kabar was not strong enough for me, and I have broken and bent many of them. The hand made knives I own get used in the woods, and sometimes carried in high threat environments. They are tools, and they get abused.

I only have a couple that sit on a shelf and look pretty!

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#287996 - 01/23/18 08:49 PM Re: New knife [Re: Russ]
Pete Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/20/09
Posts: 1372
Gee Montanero, maybe I should mail my extra knives to you.

I generally agree with the opinion that a good machete will do a lot in a survival situation. It's a good compromise. I have used axes, and for a while I was a proponent on a lightweight Tomahawk that was made by CRKT. But after quite a bit of experience with the hawk last year, it is just too light to do general purpose chopping of wood. You need something more robust, and a bit more weight in the swing. Otherwise, the only thing you can do is split small kindling, which is not satisfactory.

My suggestion, whatever you choose, be it machete, tomahawk or large knife, USE it a lot. Split a lot of wood. Cut down some saplings. You'll find out pretty quickly if the tool is doing the job or not.

Something along the lines of a kukri works pretty well. But just remember where the striking point will be located. For example, if the kukri is 15 inches, the actual location for the best chopping action of the blade will be several inches down from the tip. So your real striking radius for chopping is not 15 inches. Again, try it out.

I spend time in Brazil every year. I am constantly chopping down big growths of bamboo, as well as a variety of other saplings. Partly for farm work, but I also make furniture with the bamboo. A kukri will cut through all of this stuff nicely, BUT the radius of the swing is less than you might expect. I also carry a large-size Filipino barong which will chop massively through anything. But I keep the barong away from the locals, because I am afraid they will cut off an arm or a leg.

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#287997 - 01/23/18 09:05 PM Re: New knife [Re: gonewiththewind]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7343
Loc: southern Cal
Originally Posted By: Montanero
As I have posted in the past, my preference is for more durable, stronger knives. This is based on more than 40 years of outdoor experience in difficult environments and performing difficult tasks. The old Kabar was not strong enough for me, and I have broken and bent many of them. The hand made knives I own get used in the woods, and sometimes carried in high threat environments. They are tools, and they get abused.


We should get together sometime and swap yarns because with fairly long times in the outdoors (between you and me we have logged more than a century of healthy outdoor living), but our tool preferences are quite different, quite possibly representing civilian vs. military situations.

I like small knives, SAKs, multitools, or Moras. My most arduous and potentially "dangerous" assignments were responding to wild land fires. Then I carried a good sharp shovel and an ax variant, a Pulaski (ax blade married with a grub hoe - quite versatile). I still have all my appendages. Recreationally, I have been a backpacker and climber (often on technical routes) and in those environments when one uses a knife, it is used with great care, mostly to open a can of beans. From time to time doing SAR, I carried an Estwing hatchet, used primarily to clean out a helispot or swamp brush from a trail in advance of a stretcher party. I think the biggest knife any of us carried was a Buck 110.

It is good that there are different tools for different situations. It is interesting to learn that a Kabar is not all that strong....
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#288001 - 01/23/18 09:39 PM Re: New knife [Re: Pete]
chaosmagnet Offline
Sheriff
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/03/09
Posts: 3424
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Pete
Gee Montanero, maybe I should mail my extra knives to you.


No. PM me for my address.

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#288002 - 01/23/18 10:18 PM Re: New knife [Re: Russ]
gonewiththewind Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/14/08
Posts: 1517
I am not sure about the new ones from the Kabar company, I have not used them. The old ones were made by Camillus and had a very narrow tang. Mine broke at the hilt. I had a bit of bending as well. These experiences were indeed during military training or operations. I began a quest to find the indestructible knife. The ones I found then (1980s) were a Gerber BMF and a Cold Steel Recon Tanto. The Tanto was not a good design for field work, but it was very tough. I actually tried to break these knives and put them through hell. Other than some nicks and wear, they held up to serious abuse.

The knife industry is very different now. In the 1980s, if you wanted something really good, you bought a Randall. I could not afford that. Now there are many choices, and more demand for quality, at least in the social environment I am in. There is a greater understanding of what to look for in a knife, at least for me.

When you are out for a long time, don't have many choices, can't get additional tools when the mission changes, you carry one good one that will not break, no matter what you do with it.

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#288003 - 01/23/18 10:21 PM Re: New knife [Re: Russ]
gonewiththewind Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/14/08
Posts: 1517
Chaos, I have been working in the outdoors longer than 40 years actually if you count my time before the Army. As a kid I spent most of my time in the woods or on the water, and have always relied on good tools.

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#288004 - 01/24/18 12:53 AM Re: New knife [Re: Russ]
LesSnyder Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 1636
Loc: New Port Richey, Fla
Montanero... I shot my first North Carolina Tactical 3 gun match in Fayetteville in 1995... a Randall #1 was on the prize table..a young SF (Delta) kid had shot well and was looking at the "high military" prizes.. I had to explain to him what a Randall #1 was valued at....

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#288006 - 01/24/18 04:11 AM Re: New knife [Re: Russ]
chaosmagnet Offline
Sheriff
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/03/09
Posts: 3424
Loc: USA
I’ve never served in the military, my parents wouldn’t let me join the Boy Scouts (!) and I’m a rank amateur in this crowd for fieldcraft.

Montanero, if you really want Pete’s extra knives I wasn’t going to give up my real name and address anyway laugh.


Edited by chaosmagnet (01/24/18 04:12 AM)

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