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#284166 - 04/05/17 12:26 PM Re: Optimum Fire Starting Rig [Re: wildman800]
NAro Online   content
Addict

Registered: 03/15/01
Posts: 486
OK OK.... I give! You all make sense. Back to the firesteel. I will still carry lifeboat matches, 2 bic's, and a Zippo or Peanut flint/wick/fluid lighter (yes... I understand the fuel volatility problem - but I have a reserve tank that's lasted years). I agree that tinder is the real issue: I carry tinderquick and several petroleum jelly/cotton "straws."
BTY, I've made fire in sub-zero weather at high elevations with all of these methods. I HAVE had to warm the bic, but not the Zippo.

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#284167 - 04/05/17 11:08 PM Re: Optimum Fire Starting Rig [Re: hikermor]
boatman Offline
Addict

Registered: 03/10/03
Posts: 424
Loc: Michigan
I've seen some comment on how strike anywhere matches are not the same as before.They are not,at least the Diamond brand Greenlights to be specific.The UCO brand makes a strike any where that is FANTASTIC.They are even better than my old favorite OHIO BLUE TIPS.Struck them on an old glass counter top and they came to light.Also note most all storm proof matches will only light on a striker strip.If they get wet you are out of luck.You will have to wait for it to dry and hope it may work. I carry a BIC in an Exotac case,LMF firesteel,UCO TITAN matches and a Fresnel lens. My tinder is a big hunk of fatwood and PCB's

BOATMAN
John

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#284168 - 04/06/17 12:56 AM Re: Optimum Fire Starting Rig [Re: Treeseeker]
EMPnotImplyNuclear Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/10/08
Posts: 330
Hi everybody

You dont really need an excuse to carry a ferro rod,
but most arguments against butane lighters are silly
this is a good read about that
Wood Trekker: Ferro Rod vs. BIC Lighter

I carry my ferro rod inside my butane lighter smile

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#284169 - 04/06/17 03:45 AM Re: Optimum Fire Starting Rig [Re: EMPnotImplyNuclear]
haertig Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/13/05
Posts: 2047
Loc: Colorado
Originally Posted By: EMPnotImplyNuclear
...but most arguments against butane lighters are silly this is a good read about that...

I don't think anybody has argued AGAINST a butane lighter. The article you linked to uses that as its premise. People here have been arguing FOR a firesteel, not AGAINST a butane lighter. Big difference.

A butane lighter is easier to use than a firesteel. Check. A butane lighter is quicker to use than a firesteel. Check. More people know how to use a butane lighter than know how to use a firesteel. Check. All the points made in the article (at least all the ones I read). Check.

I did not read the entire article, because it was arguing a stupid point. The point is not that a firesteel is A REPLACEMENT, the point is that a firesteel is A BACKUP. The writer of that article didn't seem to grasp that simple point. For a small number of tasks, a firesteel might be a better primary than a butane lighter, but for the most part, it's a secondary.

Nobody said anyone should throw away their butane lighter and carry only a firesteel. But that's what the article's author was arguing. Silly.

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#284170 - 04/06/17 08:05 AM Re: Optimum Fire Starting Rig [Re: haertig]
EMPnotImplyNuclear Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/10/08
Posts: 330
Originally Posted By: haertig
Originally Posted By: EMPnotImplyNuclear
...but most arguments against butane lighters are silly this is a good read about that...

I don't think anybody has argued AGAINST a butane lighter. The article you linked to uses that as its premise. People here have been arguing FOR a firesteel, not AGAINST a butane lighter. Big difference.

A butane lighter is easier to use than a firesteel. Check. A butane lighter is quicker to use than a firesteel. Check. More people know how to use a butane lighter than know how to use a firesteel. Check. All the points made in the article (at least all the ones I read). Check.

I did not read the entire article, because it was arguing a stupid point. The point is not that a firesteel is A REPLACEMENT, the point is that a firesteel is A BACKUP. The writer of that article didn't seem to grasp that simple point. For a small number of tasks, a firesteel might be a better primary than a butane lighter, but for the most part, it's a secondary.

Nobody said anyone should throw away their butane lighter and carry only a firesteel. But that's what the article's author was arguing. Silly.

smile
I backup my butane lighter with my backup butane lighter

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#284171 - 04/06/17 12:17 PM Re: Optimum Fire Starting Rig [Re: hikermor]
bacpacjac Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/05/07
Posts: 3600
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Izzy convinced me years ago, to get a Ronson butane lighter. Since then, I've always had one in my EDC bag/purse. I don't like them when I'm in the woods, but they work great indoors, so perfect for my day to day EDC. That's what a Canadian girl gets for listening to a Florida boy about making fire in the cold wet North. LOL!
_________________________
Mom & Adventurer

You can find me on YouTube here:
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#284172 - 04/06/17 03:51 PM Re: Optimum Fire Starting Rig [Re: hikermor]
bacpacjac Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/05/07
Posts: 3600
Loc: Ontario, Canada
It's pouring rain here again today, and it's got me thinking about this thread and making one of those fires in tough conditions.

One thing I try to always include in my fire kit is a piece of aluminum foil. Finding a dry piece of ground can be really difficult sometimes. I always make a platform out of branches for my campfires, but when it's wet like this they can suck the life out of your tinder. A little something to get it off the ground can really help, and aluminum is one of those tiny and light items that can easily be added to a fire kit. It can also make a great windscreen. I've never tried it, but an Altoids tin type container should work just as well, I suppose.

Shout-out to Wetfire cubes for an emergency fire in these conditions also. They cost more than Esbit, they REALLY stink and they'll put a lot of soot on your cook pots, but they're the most water resistant fuel tab I've tried. Excellent emergency tinder, IMO.
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You can find me on YouTube here:
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#284173 - 04/06/17 03:52 PM Re: Optimum Fire Starting Rig [Re: haertig]
M_a_x Online   happy
Old Hand

Registered: 08/16/02
Posts: 1038
Loc: Germany
Originally Posted By: haertig
the point is that a firesteel is A BACKUP


The firesteel is not only a backup. Itīs a bit of redundancy as it has different points of failure.
The two major modes of failure for butane lighters that I experienced were leakage (maybe due to inadvertantly opening the valve during storage) and clogging (mainly in rarely used lighters). The firesteel will not suffer either of those. I never had butane lighter that actually stopped working because of used up fuel.
I still carry one or two butane lighters anyway.
_________________________
If it isnīt broken, it doesnīt have enough features yet.

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#284174 - 04/06/17 04:14 PM Re: Optimum Fire Starting Rig [Re: M_a_x]
hikermor Online   content
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 6740
Loc: southern Cal
Most of us seem to prefer to have several options available for starting fires. This is a good thing, because circumstances may render one or another technique more or less feasible than others. What is really important is that one should become proficient with all the tools available. No one technique is absolutely foolproof.

Just as significant is the proper use and deployment of tinder and flammable material in building a nice cheery blaze. The more fires you build, the better you will be when the chips are down. Just make sure those chips are properly arranged, in a nice spot properly sheltered from the wind.
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Geezer in Chief

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#284175 - 04/06/17 11:48 PM Re: Optimum Fire Starting Rig [Re: hikermor]
Russ Online   content
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5029
Loc: SOCAL
Concur. Having an ignition source is only one part of the equation, be it a Bic, match(es) or a ferro rod. FWIW, I have a Bic and UCO matches. There's also a nice brass zippo lighter and a couple peanut lighters from CountyComm.com -- they're all good. The Bic is primary. I have one of those large ferro rods here someplace, but I never carry it.

The other part of the equation is tinder and prep. I started building fires in a wood-stove used to heat the home when I was a kid in the 60's - rural PNW. Set the fire right -- tinder, kindling and then fuel (alder/birch/maple) and it only takes one match or one short flame from a lighter. You can have the greatest lighter, matches or sparking ability, but if your tinder is damp it won't catch and if the kindling and fuel is not set to continue that small fire, it's just a wasted match. With everything set right, it treally doesn't matter much how you get it started.

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