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#275892 - 07/22/15 03:39 AM Re: Earthquake Kit - recs? [Re: Dagny]
acropolis5 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 06/18/06
Posts: 358
Teslinhiker, I'll stand by the heavy and gimmicky tools. Look back at Dagny's original post. The bag is proposed for the car and/or office. Those heavy tools are appropriate for those venues in rescue or recovery. They may be useable by others with more training , but less prep sense.

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#275893 - 07/22/15 04:26 AM Re: Earthquake Kit - recs? [Re: acropolis5]
Teslinhiker Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/14/09
Posts: 1418
Loc: Nothern Ontario
Originally Posted By: acropolis5
Teslinhiker, I'll stand by the heavy and gimmicky tools. Look back at Dagny's original post. The bag is proposed for the car and/or office. Those heavy tools are appropriate for those venues in rescue or recovery. They may be useable by others with more training , but less prep sense.


I think you missed some important parts of Dagny's subsequent posts which what I based my comments on.
Originally Posted By: Dagny

she works at a hospital (administrative) so the first-aid component of the bag is oriented to her being elsewhere when the quake hits -- perhaps in a store or forced to abandon the car because of road/bridge damage.


Originally Posted By: Dagny

My sister is pretty petite and not currently athletic (thin and not very strong) so pack weight is a major consideration.


The backpack that Dagny linked to is only 1,343 cu. in (22 liters) which is fairly small for a GHB. Also the backpack is stowaway / fold up type, so it will have minimal padding on the shoulder straps and none on the waist straps. A petite and non athletic person carrying about 10 -15 lbs for a possible 12-14 mile walk over a long period of hours will soon have pack fatigue which is why all my comments and suggestions were centered on keeping total weight to a minimum. This is why I also suggested shoes instead of boots. People do not realize how much energy goes into lifting your feet mile after mile, especially when wearing boots.

There are quite a number of hospitals in Portland but Dagny did not mention which one but that is fine. By many measurements, Portland is a small city compared to most USA cities and if you are not caught in the downtown area then you don't have worry as much about office towers etc falling and sending debris into the streets so shoes would work ok in other areas.

For example here, there is a hospital that is located in a largely residential area of single family homes and even with a large scale quake, the streets would still be passable on foot as the quake would not send a lot of house debris onto the street and road surface itself. Another hospital I know of is in a park like setting and the streets surrounding it are a mix of residential and light commercial type buildings with minimal danger of collapsing out onto the streets and roadways.

One other thing to keep in mind, earthquakes can be fickle and cause severe damage in some areas but a few blocks over, there is minimal damage such as was seen in the 1994 Northridge earthquake.

So that all said, everyone has their own ideas on what post earthquake GHB works for them. That includes me - but over the last year, I have very carefully vetted all the items I chose and firmly believe in the right tools for the task. I have also carried my 28 liter pack over some long urban distances and found out what seems like a good load of items on paper - does not always translate well to real world usefulness nor is always practical. Now that we are moving again in September, work will be about 7 miles closer so my GHB can and will be reevaluated again for that shorter distance.
_________________________
Earth and sky, woods and fields, lakes and rivers, the mountain and the sea, are excellent schoolmasters, and teach some of us more than we can ever learn from books.

John Lubbock

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#275895 - 07/22/15 11:42 AM Re: Earthquake Kit - recs? [Re: Dagny]
Dagny Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 1918
Loc: Washington, DC
Since I have so much extra stuff after a couple decades of camping and hiking (and a decade on ETS), including extra packs and jackets, I have just decided that I may at least get her started on a second bag -- so she'll have one for office and one for her car. The car stuff I put together for her a few years ago includes a Mora, fire stuff, etc. That could be the core of a second bag.

Will include in both packs an inventory of what's in there and why. Like many Oregonians, she's done some car camping so has some stuff, like camp stove and tent, at home.


.

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#275896 - 07/22/15 11:43 AM Re: Earthquake Kit - recs? [Re: Dagny]
Tom_L Offline
Addict

Registered: 03/19/07
Posts: 690
This really is turning into a good discussion. All in all though, I guess it shows a fundamental dilemma with EDC. We all know it would be great to have instant access to all sorts of gear at any time. Yet in real life our EDC is pretty much limited to what we can fit inside our pockets and maybe a bag or backpack. All the while keeping in mind what is acceptable under the social and legal norms.

Given the circumstances I would say a 22L pack is just the right size for a smaller-framed female, maybe even at the upper limit. Right now I am looking at my backpack, which I carry daily to work. It's a 5.11 Rush 12 backpack with a 24L capacity. About the largest size I would consider practical for realistic EDC in an urban environment.

My Rush 12 is just big enough for a smallish laptop, a few books and a water bottle plus a minimalist survival kit. I have taken quite some time to come up with a compact but hopefully well rounded list of things I carry with me daily, as much as I can stuff inside the front pocket without adding too much bulk (under 2lbs all in all excluding the water bottle). It includes a basic FAK, my Leatherman Wave, flashlight, a couple of lighters, a small prybar and a few other assorted gadgets.

Honestly speaking, it is still very much minimalist. If suddenly caught in an earthquake zone I would much rather have some extra gear at hand. But then, even a minimalist kit carried on your person is a lot better than nothing. What good will that nice, big GHB in your office or car trunk do if by some chance you can't get to it in the first place?

There is also a big difference between EDC items that are actually useful on a day in, day our basis, such as a pocket knife or flashlight. That is the kind of stuff that you are likely to use regularly so EDC makes sense even if (thankfully) you never find yourself in a disaster situation.

However, in the event of a major earthquake you will likely need bigger, heavier, heavy duty gear that has little to no everyday utility in an urban environment. Like a full-sized crowbar, shovel, chain saw, axe, sledgehammer etc. That kind of equipment is what really comes in handy in an earthquake zone but it is far too bulky for EDC and isn't even found in many urban homes and apartments.

IMHO the only practical solution is to come up with a compact kit small enough for actual EDC and keep a larger, better stocked GHB in the car trunk, workplace or wherever else you spend most of the time when away from home. Also, keep in mind that many public buildings will have rescue tools of some sort placed somewhere strategically (or not) as part of contingency planning. At my workplace we keep a pretty good rescue kit with a fireaxe, pickaxe, heavy crowbar etc. Unfortunately, the last time I checked it was locked up in the basement, so not quite within immediate reach. But it is something well worth checking out, I'm sure a hospital would have similar equipment stashed somewhere.

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#275901 - 07/22/15 09:10 PM Re: Earthquake Kit - recs? [Re: Teslinhiker]
bws48 Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/18/07
Posts: 831
Loc: Anne Arundel County, Maryland
Originally Posted By: Teslinhiker

Metal cup to boil water - Not needed in an urban GHB.


Probably not needed in the strict sense of the word, but I think the the psychological boost of stopping, resting and having a "cuppa" during a 12-14 hour (or longer) trek is well worth it. But then, maybe that is something I inherited from Mom's English heritage. . . grin
_________________________
"Better is the enemy of good enough."

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#276074 - 08/04/15 07:17 PM Re: Earthquake Kit - recs? [Re: Dagny]
TeacherRO Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 2574
Good points - Spread out your gear; edc, backpack, at desk/locker in a small duffel, in car. Depending on what has happened, time of year, etc. I like to be able to choose my set-up.

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#276095 - 08/05/15 03:19 PM Re: Earthquake Kit - recs? [Re: Dagny]
JeffMc Offline
Member

Registered: 05/10/15
Posts: 129
Loc: Northwest Florida
Originally Posted By: Dagny
... has a ham radio operator license


Why not add something like a BaoFeng BF-F8HP 8W High Power VHF/UHF Ham Two-way Radio, available for $63 on Amazon? It's amazingly tiny and lightweight, and I'd expect your sister could probably make good use of it.


Edited by JeffMc (08/05/15 04:24 PM)

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#276097 - 08/05/15 03:45 PM Re: Earthquake Kit - recs? [Re: bws48]
JeffMc Offline
Member

Registered: 05/10/15
Posts: 129
Loc: Northwest Florida
Originally Posted By: bws48
Probably not needed in the strict sense of the word, but I think the the psychological boost of stopping, resting and having a "cuppa" during a 12-14 hour (or longer) trek is well worth it. ...


I agree. It is an excellent antidote to being caught off guard or rattled by an unexpected calamitous turn of events. It helps raise morale, especially when cold, wet and maybe a bit shocky, and allows a little time to settle the nerves, think through the situation, and plan an effective course of action. Also, even if the owner doesn't need it, it's still a means of effective psychological first aid that can be offered to someone else who does.

One of the best pieces of disaster/survival advice I ever heard was "don't just do something, sit there!" Our most important survival tool is our brain, and our most important survival preparation is a good plan. But these usually need just a little time to become fully operative.

In addition to the boiling cup, might it be worth adding a tiny 1 oz. home-made or Trangia alcohol burner and a small plastic bottle of denatured alcohol (which has multiple uses)?


Edited by JeffMc (08/05/15 04:49 PM)

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#276100 - 08/05/15 04:21 PM Re: Earthquake Kit - recs? [Re: Teslinhiker]
JeffMc Offline
Member

Registered: 05/10/15
Posts: 129
Loc: Northwest Florida
Originally Posted By: Teslinhiker
Originally Posted By: acropolis5
...Those heavy tools are appropriate for those venues in rescue or recovery. They may be useable by others with more training , but less prep sense.

...
A petite and non athletic person carrying about 10 -15 lbs for a possible 12-14 mile walk over a long period of hours will soon have pack fatigue which is why all my comments and suggestions were centered on keeping total weight to a minimum.


There's no rule that requires you to take everything you have with you on a long walk to safety. I have a few basic rescue tools and other items in or with my BOB/GHB that I expect would be very useful in some some situations, but not others, and I plan to cull through my kit and leave any unnecessary gear behind before walking any appreciable distance with it. Hopefully, I'll be able to leave things in my trunk or other reasonably secure location and recover them later.

Also, although my bag is only about 2400cc, it does have a real internal frame and load-bearing hip belt. I'm not a fan of daypacks that suspend all the weight from my shoulders, if I plan on walking very far. I have used the pack from my kit for backpacking trips several times, and it proved quite comfortable for long miles while well laden.

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