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#273757 - 01/18/15 05:03 AM Re: Rope for GeneralWalking? [Re: hikermor]
wildman800 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 2695
Loc: La-USA
I don't carry rope for Day Hiking unless I have a specific plan for using it. I do carry 60ft of 3/8th's inch rope when I go backpacking/camping. If for no other use, I hang my backpack from a high tree limb while I sleep. I also find occasional need to use rope to rappel and or lower or pull gear up the short bluffs we have in the south.
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#273764 - 01/18/15 06:08 PM Re: Rope for GeneralWalking? [Re: hikermor]
Alex Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/01/07
Posts: 1034
Loc: -
Just a good length of paracord is great to have at all times if carrying a real climbing rope is not practical. Even though you should not rappel with it normally it could be a life saver in many serious situations even if used just as a guiding line (to better control your natural body balance) at tough spots of the trail.

A friend of mine has died several years ago trying to descend a steep but totally manageable slope on the side of the paved trail in the attempt to reach the little girl fell down (she has been rolling down for less than 100 feet away, was effectively stopped by thin bushes down there, and she was eventually rescued by the park rangers several hours later). The guy probably just bented too much forward and lost the balance and then rolled down for more than 300 feet breaking his neck. A piece of paracord, which elderly parents of the girl could just hold for him from the top, would definitely help him to better control the descent and ascent back. Or, perhaps, they could use the paracord loop to drop it down to the girl, so she don't have to rely on that crop of bushes to hold on.

I'm carrying 100' hunk of 5/32" Samson Amsteel in my hydration pack all the time: http://www.lfsmarineoutdoor.com/samson-amsteel-blue-rope-600-ft-spool.html It's much better than paracord and I would trust it even for climbing.

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#273773 - 01/19/15 12:01 AM Re: Rope for GeneralWalking? [Re: hikermor]
Byrd_Huntr Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 01/28/10
Posts: 1145
Loc: Land O' Lakes & Rivers - MN, U...
Originally Posted By: hikermor
As I opened your post, I thought "I wonder what he will say? Surely there is no real use for rope in his flat, lake-infested wilderness..." Just shows how versatile rope can be.


As this photo by eminent Minnesota photographer Craig Blacklock illustrates, Minnesota is not exactly tabletop flat. That said, you are correct in assuming that I know nothing about technical climbing or any of the ropes or gear associated with it.

Primary uses for rope in Minnesota:

-Tying inner tubes together to float down a river with a beer cooler
-Tying dogs together to pull the sled to the tradin' post
-Rope swings over the lake
-Hanging vittles in the trees so bears, coons, and bigfoot can't get 'em
-Pulling stuck smowmobiles out of the snowbank
-Tying up the Lund for a quick break on shore
-Bumper skiing
-Strapping an 8 pointer to the top of the SUV.

There's probably other uses, but I can't think of any.



Attachments
Craig Blacklock2.jpg


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#273774 - 01/19/15 12:38 AM Re: Rope for GeneralWalking? [Re: Byrd_Huntr]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 5654
Loc: southern Cal
Nice looking rock indeed! Is that Lake Superior?

I talked to my brother yesterday and he mentioned that he had just driven his truck out to his fishing house. The ice was six feet thick (Lake Bemidji).....
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#273776 - 01/19/15 02:19 AM Re: Rope for GeneralWalking? [Re: hikermor]
Burncycle Offline
Addict

Registered: 09/16/04
Posts: 502
9' of good rope and a locking carabiner and you can make a swiss seat in about a minute.

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#273784 - 01/19/15 09:05 AM Re: Rope for GeneralWalking? [Re: Burncycle]
Tjin Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 04/08/02
Posts: 1638
Originally Posted By: Burncycle
9' of good rope and a locking carabiner and you can make a swiss seat in about a minute.


If you carry a section of rope dedicated for a swiss seat; then you might as well buy a proper harness. The cheapest basic ones can be had for 30 dollars. The cheap ones are usually more universal in size and the lack of padding makes them smaller and lighter (if size and weight is a issue).
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#273795 - 01/19/15 07:15 PM Re: Rope for GeneralWalking? [Re: Alex]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 5654
Loc: southern Cal
Unfortunate indeed for your friend; sorry to hear that. This certainly illustrates why rope can be useful. I would prefer something more substantial than paracord or slippery, nondynamic dyneema

I do indeed carry mason's twine/paracord routinely - contemplated use is for lashing/tying. Depending on the situation and terrain, I might throw in a cordelette (20-30' of 7mm kernmantle) or bump it up to something longer like 30 meters of real rope - http://www.rei.com/product/885246/edelweiss-discover-8mm-x-30m-super-dry-twin-rope - , thus adding about two pounds to the overall weight of my pack.

If real climbing is anticipated, I have my bag all packed and ready to go - 60M of rope, helmet, harness w/slings, biners, and selected goodies - a good ten pounds plus of character building weight. There have been occasions where that has just been a good start.

It all comes down to how much rope for anticipated conditions, but something is way better than nothing.
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#273803 - 01/20/15 12:54 PM Re: Rope for GeneralWalking? [Re: hikermor]
Tom_L Offline
Addict

Registered: 03/19/07
Posts: 690
I tend to carry at least a short length of rope pretty much all the time, even though rarely anything more substantial than paracord.

Paracord or equivalent is very handy all around, but I would never trust it as a climbing rope. It's simply not strong enough and leaves absolutely no room for error if you fall.

IMHO trying to substitute a proper climbing rope with paracord is inviting disaster. Sometimes, something might be worse than nothing. To be of any serious use, a climbing rope must be rated to hold much more than simply one's bodyweight. Maybe this link can explain it a little better:
http://www.alpineexposures.com/pages/faq-climbing-ropes-explained-test-uiaa

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#273814 - 01/20/15 11:53 PM Re: Rope for GeneralWalking? [Re: hikermor]
clearwater Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/19/05
Posts: 926
Loc: Channeled Scablands
Rope stuff that is often misstated regarding single and half ropes and the
impact force etc.

"1. Half ropes likely do not offer significantly lower impact forces than single ropes in high fall-factor falls where one strand is clipped as is common.
2. Rope diameter alone is NOT a good indicator of impact force (some of the “fat” 11mm ropes offer lower impact force than the “skinny” single or half ropes).
3. The “published” impact numbers may not mean much (there’s a wide range between the published and actual in Jim’s data)."


http://willgadd.com/single-and-half-rope-impact-forces-data/

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#273822 - 01/21/15 08:44 AM Re: Rope for GeneralWalking? [Re: clearwater]
Tjin Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 04/08/02
Posts: 1638
Originally Posted By: clearwater
Rope stuff that is often misstated regarding single and half ropes and the
impact force etc.

"1. Half ropes likely do not offer significantly lower impact forces than single ropes in high fall-factor falls where one strand is clipped as is common.
2. Rope diameter alone is NOT a good indicator of impact force (some of the “fat” 11mm ropes offer lower impact force than the “skinny” single or half ropes).
3. The “published” impact numbers may not mean much (there’s a wide range between the published and actual in Jim’s data)."

http://willgadd.com/single-and-half-rope-impact-forces-data/


The main difference of stated impact force on the rope is the test weight:
Values required by the Standard:
• Single rope: Impact force lower than 12kN holding the first factor 1.77 fall with a mass of 80kg.
• Double rope: Impact force lower than 8kn holding the first factor 1.77 fall with a mass of 55kg.
• Twin rope: Impact force lower than 12kN holding the first factor 1.77 fall with a mass of 80kg,
(source: http://bealplanet.com/sport/anglais/savoir.php)

This effect can be seen on triple rates ropes like the Beal Joker. Not sure why you would weight less when falling from a double rope using a double rope technique.
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