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#271498 - 08/30/14 02:11 AM Cook Stove Recommendations
Jeanette_Isabelle Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/13/06
Posts: 2458
Loc: Somewhere in Florida
For bugging in, Mom wants small cook stove recommendations. Must retain heat and not use propane.

No fireplace but we have a small screened-in porch and yard.

Jeanette Isabelle
_________________________
“Trust me, this is not gonna end well!” — Pleakley, Lilo & Stitch

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#271499 - 08/30/14 02:34 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
LesSnyder Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 1637
Loc: New Port Richey, Fla
by retain heat, do you mean you want to bake with it?.... my own choice is naturally the one you don't want, namely propane... there are multi fuel camp style stoves burning proprietary fuel like Coleman fuel, that also work on unleaded gasoline.... there are wick style stoves favored by a many in the Oriental community that burn kerosene... there are do it yourself rocket style stoves made from red brick or cement block that can use wood... charcoal briquettes in a hibachi style with a cast iron Dutch oven would work for baking...

do you want any form of portability? any restrictions on fuel other than no propane?

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#271500 - 08/30/14 02:54 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5338
Loc: SOCAL
How about butane? If you do a search on Amazon for "butane stove you'll find a bbunch and they all look the same. I have the GAS ONE Stainless Steel Portable Gas Stove and have used it during a couple power outages. Worked great. Iwatani has a few listed that seem to be higher end but still with the same basic design. Apparently they have more BTU power but they're more spendy too. No affiliation with either company.

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#271501 - 08/30/14 03:18 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: LesSnyder]
Jeanette_Isabelle Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/13/06
Posts: 2458
Loc: Somewhere in Florida
Mom read your post. Did not say much.

Don’t know what Mom wants. Had to probe just to write the initial post. To answer your question, I think she means something that will cook using the least amount of fuel. She’s considering the Dutch oven. She says she wants to avoid gas or liquid fuels . . . fire safety. Fire + canisters = boom. That leaves wood, charcoal or some sort of pellets.

Jeanette Isabelle
_________________________
“Trust me, this is not gonna end well!” — Pleakley, Lilo & Stitch

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#271502 - 08/30/14 03:24 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Russ]
Jeanette_Isabelle Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/13/06
Posts: 2458
Loc: Somewhere in Florida
Originally Posted By: Russ
How about butane? If you do a search on Amazon for "butane stove you'll find a bbunch and they all look the same. I have the GAS ONE Stainless Steel Portable Gas Stove and have used it during a couple power outages.

I brought those up. Canisters take up space and if there is a fire, run!

Jeanette Isabelle
_________________________
“Trust me, this is not gonna end well!” — Pleakley, Lilo & Stitch

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#271503 - 08/30/14 03:49 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7344
Loc: southern Cal
What about flameless heaters, like those provided for MREs?
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#271504 - 08/30/14 04:08 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
EMPnotImplyNuclear Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/10/08
Posts: 374
Pellets can be cheaper (in dollars per BTU) than propane , and a 40lb bag can be had for $5 ... and yard trimmings/twigs can be found everywhere and you can burn them like pellets smile in a coffee can smile

PCIA Test Results of Cook Stove Performance • Time to boil • Fuel used to cook • Energy used to cook • CO emissions • PM emissions • Safety ratings • Cost to purchase • Monthly fuel use
TLUD Micro Gasification 2.0 Cooking with gas from dry biomass ... Catalogue of stoves ... silverfire.us greensteaders.org biolite.com ecozoomstove.com

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#271508 - 08/30/14 11:42 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
Brangdon Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/12/04
Posts: 1204
Loc: Nottingham, UK
Consider a hay box. It's just an insulated box; you heat the food with something else, put it in the hay box and then leave it to slow-cook for many hours.
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Quality is addictive.

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#271509 - 08/30/14 02:22 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7344
Loc: southern Cal
"Canisters take up space and if there is a fire, run"

The same could be said of any stove fuel, including flameless packets. You might not have a problem with buffalo chips
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#271510 - 08/30/14 02:45 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Brangdon]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5338
Loc: SOCAL
We have a thermal insulated cooker. I won't say brand name, there are a number on Amazon and they work pretty much the same.
Quote:
...Put inner pot over the stove top and bring to a boil and set into outer container, Stainless steel vacuum insulated outer container allows the food to cook thoroughly without fire or electricity while the outside body stays cool to touch, Can keeps hot food around 154F for 6 hours, Save energy Save time, No overcooking and no burn, ...
With this we can heat the food either inside or outside (electric range inside, butane/propane/kero/white gas outside) and then when the inner pot and food is up to temp, put it inside the insulated outer container. Then you can turn off the stove and if you are concerned, remove the butane bottle from the stove.

BTW, the butane stove I mentioned is fairly safe design. There's a reason all those different models look the same. IMO the fire issue, while being real would not be the fault of the stove unless the operator was irresponsible. That is true of any stove, including gas and electric range you find in any kitchen. The model I have boils water at least as fast as the kitchen's electric range.

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#271512 - 08/30/14 02:59 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
Dagny Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 1917
Loc: Washington, DC
Jeanette -- I'd very highly recommend cast iron "camp" Dutch ovens from Lodge of Tennessee. They are made in Tennessee and a great value (I've purchased most of mine on Amazon -- free shipping with Amazon Prime - and a lot cheaper than the MSRP you'll see on Lodge's website). They'll last a hundred years with minimal care. I think it would be a smart hurricane preparedness prep.

http://www.lodgemfg.com/seasoned-cast-iron/camp-ovens-and-grills

All your mom would need is a bag of charcoal briquettes. Camp dutch ovens are designed so that they can be stacked -- each oven helping heat the one above and below.

And a "chimney starter" to jumpstart the coals (via a bit of paper and a match):

http://www.amazon.com/Weber-7416-Rapidfi...chimney+starter

If you can find out how many people she'd like to be able to feed, then we can help with size recommendations. For one or two people, I'd get the 1 quart-2 qt-4 qt. I also use the 1-quart in my kitchen stove.


.

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#271513 - 08/30/14 04:21 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
Deathwind Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 02/01/14
Posts: 310
It's been awhile but Major's Surplus had some nifty stoves from Sweden I think. Wood fired, compact and cylindrical with pipes included. They would do well on a back porch I think.

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#271519 - 08/30/14 08:05 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
LesSnyder Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 1637
Loc: New Port Richey, Fla
FWIW... and not a direct response to Jeanette's question... during the 2004 hurricane season's 9 day power outage, this inexpensive tailgate grill did most of my cooking...it is very lite weight, and with the tall lid, probably capable of baking something like bannock or cornbread... I used the camp stove to heat water to shave with, but at the time most of my perishable food was chicken breasts, ground beef, hot dogs, fish fillets,and pork chops that were frozen... without easily attainable hot water for clean up of cooking pots and pans, I did a lot of meals with bamboo skewers, or directly on the grill.. with paper plates and plastic flat wear....OK it needs to be cleaned up a little... canned goods were cooked in a water bath over the fish cooker...eaten directly from the can.. add open cans to determine the water level... needle nose or multi tool to retrieve... hot water for cleanup



Edited by LesSnyder (08/30/14 09:37 PM)

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#271520 - 08/30/14 08:46 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
Am_Fear_Liath_Mor Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 3078

Well I have just ordered a Frontier Stove and water heater jacket a few days ago as I am expecting some national fuel shortages this winter. It should be very flexible not only as a stove, but as a space heater and water heater (for hot water for cleaning cooking utensils, washing and showering). Light enough to be luggable and compact enough for vehicle carry.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXc2iRVqPNk

A more substantive stove (more expensive) called the Traveller Stove is also available;

http://anevay.co.uk/camping-stoves.html?suitable_for=9

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#271526 - 08/31/14 01:50 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Am_Fear_Liath_Mor]
bws48 Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/18/07
Posts: 831
Loc: Anne Arundel County, Maryland
AFLM's stoves reminded me of the old cast iron wood fired stove in my Grandparent's home that they were still using up until the mid-1950's. It had an oven and "cook top" and also served to warm their house.

Functionally, it sounds like this might be what your Mom is thinking of.

A quick Google search for "old fashioned wood burning kitchen stoves" revealed that various versions are still being made.
For example:
http://www.elmirastoveworks.com/fireview/ and
http://www.antiquestoves.com/general%20store/generalstore.index.htm

(no affiliation)

I have seen similar concepts built out of brick (fire brick and red brick).

Costs and installation (perhaps on the porch) might be prohibitive, but they can last a lifetime.
_________________________
"Better is the enemy of good enough."

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#271530 - 08/31/14 04:31 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
dougwalkabout Offline
Crazy Canuck
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/03/07
Posts: 2915
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Maybe you should experiment with hexamine solid fuel tablets. Inexpensive, compact, and non-explosive. Good for boiling up a cup of tea or heating up canned food. For baking or bigger cooking tasks, BBQ charcoal is a better deal.

There are many brands (esbit, coghlans) etc.
http://www.coghlans.com/products/fuel-tablets-9565

Don't bother buying the little folding stove; you can make one out of a tin can or a couple of bricks or anything. Remember to use it in a well-ventilated location and on a non-flammable surface.

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#271543 - 09/01/14 01:18 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: bws48]
UTAlumnus Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/08/03
Posts: 1004
Loc: East Tennessee near Bristol
If the main things you need it for are stove top uses, they make a small version of these. It will also work for an alternate heat source. Granddad used one to heat his woodworking shop here in the winter. He fed his with scraps.

small wood stove

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#271545 - 09/01/14 03:41 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: UTAlumnus]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7344
Loc: southern Cal
The more this thread progresses, the burning question arises, "What's wrong with propane? I ask that because, aside from solo biking and hiking trips, I probably use propane more than anything else. It is available in a variety of reasonably safe containers, and with just modest, fairly routine safety practices, is about as safe as anything else.

On one of my field projects, we cooked on a two burner propane stove for five to ten people regularly for several months, doing our baking and heating in a stove top oven accessory. No problems at all.

Propane is versatile - accessories are available that allow you to use the same fuel for lanterns and refrigeration, if you choose to get that elaborate (we did in our field camp). It is also fairly cheap, especially bought in quantity.

In case of a major earthquake, I plan to basically camp out in the back yard, cooking and possibly illuminating with propane. Any fuel or stove setup can have safety issues, as can domestic ranges, for that matter. We've had potential problems ever since humankind tamed fire.
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Geezer in Chief

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#271546 - 09/01/14 04:24 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: hikermor]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5338
Loc: SOCAL
I agree with this. I have a two burner Colman stove with an adaptor to use 20# propane bottles for long term stuff. Great set-up and smaller propane bottles are available.

Maybe it's not the safety of the stove that's the issue. Maybe it's limitations on storage of the gas bottles and if there were a fire ... dunno, maybe Jeanette can amplify...

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#271547 - 09/01/14 04:32 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations (hexamine expensive [Re: dougwalkabout]
EMPnotImplyNuclear Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/10/08
Posts: 374
Originally Posted By: dougwalkabout
... hexamine solid fuel tablets. Inexpensive, compact, and non-explosive...

hexamine is the most expensive fuel you can buy smile

coghlan's 24 fuel tablets of hexamine , 0.2oz per tablet, 0.3lb total at 12,900 BTU/LB is 3870 BTU total. you can buy them at these prices
Code:
3870 BUT   / $18.15 USD =   213  BTU/$ dollar
3870 BUT   / $12.83 USD =   302  BTU/$ dollar
3870 BUT   / $6.33  USD =   611  BTU/$ dollar
                            696  BTU/$ dollar
3870 BTU   / $4.35  USD =   890  BTU/$ dollar 
3870 BTU   / $2.53  USD = 1,530  BTU/$ dollar
                          1,610  BTU/$ dollar

Compare that to dollarstore unscented vaseline 4oz for $1 , its 0.25lb * 19,900BTU/lb , 4970 BTU/$

Compare to Walmarts which lists 6-lb Crisco (24970 Calories) 95,400 BTU / $8.98 = 10,620 BTU/$ dollar

Compare to this past winter 40 lb of premium wood pellets for 342,000 BTU / $4.98 = 68,675 BTU/$ dollar


So for a three day or 30 day in-home earthquake kit, hexamine is too expensive as both fuel and tinder.

Everybody has paper and oil/grease/butter around the house to use as tinder to burn pellets or twigs or logs smile

I would leave the hexamine to Ultralight gram counters smile

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#271548 - 09/01/14 12:04 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: UTAlumnus]
bws48 Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/18/07
Posts: 831
Loc: Anne Arundel County, Maryland
Originally Posted By: UTAlumnus
If the main things you need it for are stove top uses, they make a small version of these. It will also work for an alternate heat source. Granddad used one to heat his woodworking shop here in the winter. He fed his with scraps.

small wood stove


Great stove!

As soon as I saw the ad I realized there was one (or nearly identical to it) in an old hunting shack I used to stay in when deer hunting. It worked great: lots of heat.
_________________________
"Better is the enemy of good enough."

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#271549 - 09/01/14 01:22 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations (hexamine expensive [Re: EMPnotImplyNuclear]
dougwalkabout Offline
Crazy Canuck
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/03/07
Posts: 2915
Loc: Alberta, Canada
Originally Posted By: EMPnotImplyNuclear
Originally Posted By: dougwalkabout
... hexamine solid fuel tablets. Inexpensive, compact, and non-explosive...

hexamine is the most expensive fuel you can buy smile



Lovely math, but you missed the point. Experimenting with a few packets of hexamine tabs will help define the OP's actual needs.

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#271550 - 09/01/14 02:38 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: hikermor]
Am_Fear_Liath_Mor Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 3078

Quote:
"What's wrong with propane?"


Absolutely nothing. I have a double Foker LPG burner for emergency use



http://www.gasproducts.co.uk/acatalog/copy_of_Cast_Iron_Double_Burner_Gas_Boiling_Ring_with_FFD.html

With a low pressure 15kg LPG Gas bottle this will give approx 4-6 months cooking @ .1Kg per day fuel use.

Keeping the bottles in movable heaters designed for 15kg LPG butane bottles.



Lockable Storage for LPG butane and propane bottles (various sizes and capacities) are available for external storage

If the requirement is purely for stove cooking using wood then the Horizon Wood Gasifier Stove may be worth a look as well. Should be very efficent to use and potentially almost smokeless. (lack of smoke is an important consideration)

http://anevay.co.uk/camping-stoves/the-horizon-rocket-stove.html

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#271551 - 09/01/14 03:11 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
GoatRider Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/28/04
Posts: 835
Loc: Maple Grove, MN
I had a scare with propane on my camping trip last week, but it turned out well so it actually reduced my fear of propane.

I was lighting my Peet propane boot dryer, and suddenly there were flames all over. I kicked it away, and then there were just a few flames around the top of the tank, and by reflex I blew on it, and they went out. I just hadn't screwed the tank on all the way, and it was leaking a bit.

I think from now on when car camping, I'm going to take the fire extinguisher out of my car and keep it by the camp stove. I might even get a dedicated extinguisher and keep it with my camping gear.
_________________________
- Benton

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#271552 - 09/01/14 03:43 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
LesSnyder Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 1637
Loc: New Port Richey, Fla
just a follow up... my usual recommendations for an emergency stove is a multi fuel camp stove (Coleman fuel and unleaded gasoline (they have single burner models with kerosene capability) and a propane 1# adapter... pics from box store, no recommendation on my part

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Coleman-Dual-Fuel-2-Burner-Stove/9870596

http://www.sportsauthority.com/Century-T...=34-237316508-2

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#271558 - 09/01/14 05:40 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
Quietly_Learning Offline
Member

Registered: 05/29/12
Posts: 164
I would recommend pm'g Hikin_Jim . He's the resident stove expert and has great insight. Unfortunately he hasn't posted in a long time. He also has a very well written blog http://adventuresinstoving.blogspot.com/?m=1

I would have to go with the others and recommend what you don't want which is a Coleman style multi burner stove. Small, portable and lots of btu's for the size. I've used a Coleman car camping on many occasions. If properly stored the canisters are safe.

Another option would be digging a hole in your backyard and with wood or charcoal making a fire pit or outdoor oven. You can use a Dutch oven in the fire pit which retains heat very well. Benjamin has posted about Dutch ovens on a number of occasions so he and Dagny could give you recommendations. I would think a well made fire pit would add resale value to your home.

http://www.pinterest.com/motheroftrouble/diy-fire-pits-outdoor-stovesovens/

(Not exact what you're looking for but it looks like a fun experiment:)
http://www.motherearthnews.com/real-food...x#axzz39koIDoZ3

One thing I would NOT recommend is cooking in your screened in porch. Flare-ups happen so further away from your house is better in case of any accidents. Also never abad idea to bring the fire extinguisher with you when cooking in the back yard.

Good luck

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#271588 - 09/05/14 09:37 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
RayW Offline
Addict

Registered: 12/06/01
Posts: 563
Loc: Orlando, FL
This stove still uses a liquid fuel, so I don't know if you could talk your mom into this or not. It uses alcohol so it is not explosive and it is marketed towards the boating world because of that.


http://www.dometic.com/enus/Americas/USA/Marine/Stoves/products/?productdataid=71772

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#271589 - 09/05/14 10:57 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
haertig Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/13/05
Posts: 2201
Loc: Colorado
Originally Posted By: Jeanette_Isabelle
She says she wants to avoid gas or liquid fuels...

That sounds like your choice is thus narrowed down to ... a standard BBQ grill and a ton of Match-Light (no charcoal fluid required) charcoal briquettes and wooden matches. Nothing wrong with that. But "no gas or liquid" eliminates most other choices.

Personally, I would go for a Coleman propane burner stove, and one of those tailgating propane grills, feed with a couple of 20lb propane cylinders and an adapter hose. The fuel would last a long time and you'd get to cook more or less "normally", even using you standard household cookware. Many many people use propane BBQ grills safely, but of course there are a few nimrods who manage to blow themselves up. Still, I wouldn't let that deter me from using propane. Just learn how to use it safely. Millions of people do exactly that, every day.

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#271631 - 09/10/14 10:33 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: haertig]
nursemike Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 869
Loc: wellington, fl
wally world solar oven

No connection with Wally World; I am however a priest of the sun god Ra, and recommending use of solar energy may represent a conflict of interest.
_________________________
Dance like you have never been hurt, work like no one is watching,love like you don't need the money.

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#271632 - 09/10/14 10:47 PM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: nursemike]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5338
Loc: SOCAL
Would you happen to know the width/depth/height of the oven. Will it hold a cookie sheet? We cookie monsters love to worship Ra while cookies bake... cool

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#271633 - 09/11/14 02:34 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Jeanette_Isabelle]
LesSnyder Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 1637
Loc: New Port Richey, Fla
the description and price sounds like an educational model... information at the start of this pdf file may be of interest

http://www.sunoven.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/EverythingUnderTheSun.pdf

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#271653 - 09/13/14 03:06 AM Re: Cook Stove Recommendations [Re: Russ]
nursemike Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 869
Loc: wellington, fl
Originally Posted By: Russ
Would you happen to know the width/depth/height of the oven. Will it hold a cookie sheet? We cookie monsters love to worship Ra while cookies bake... cool


Possible in the higher priced model SunOven
_________________________
Dance like you have never been hurt, work like no one is watching,love like you don't need the money.

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