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#265917 - 12/18/13 11:48 PM Re: Compact cold weather sleeping bag on budget [Re: nursemike]
AKSAR Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 1156
Loc: Alaska
Originally Posted By: nursemike
Viesturs is also, IIRC, a veterinarian and a pretty devoted husband/dad who co-authors good books about climbing, and avoids the tendency to trash other climbers. Likeable sort, unlike many of the climber-authors.

Yes. Viesturs also has a commendable reputation for dropping his own plans and aiding other climbers in distress. From the Wikipedia article on Viesturs:
Quote:
Viesturs is known for his assistance to other mountaineers. In 1992 he and fellow American Scott Fischer brought down French climber Chantal Maudit, suffering from exhaustion, after her summit of K2. Viesturs was in the IMAX climbing team during the 1996 Everest Disaster. He was featured in the Everest IMAX movie. Filming was delayed as a blizzard struck. The IMAX team postponed shooting and followed Viesturs up the mountain to aid the stranded climbers. The team ultimately decided to keep going, and summited Everest on May 23, 1996. In July 2003, Viesturs and a Kazakh team headed by Denis Urubko were instrumental in the rescue of French climber Jean-Christophe Lafaille from Broad Peak. Lafaille had developed high-altitude pulmonary edema and was unable to complete his descent. They coordinated a rescue attempt in the dark and were able to get Lafaille safely off the mountain and helicoptered out for medical help.
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#265919 - 12/19/13 01:11 AM Re: Compact cold weather sleeping bag on budget [Re: Mark_F]
UTAlumnus Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/08/03
Posts: 999
Loc: East Tennessee near Bristol
A down bag may not be the best idea if there is a dust mite allergy involved. Allergy specialist specifically told us to avoid foam or feather pillows when he tested me to see what I was allergic to. Don't know if there would be a big difference between a feather pillow & down.

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#265927 - 12/19/13 04:26 PM Re: Compact cold weather sleeping bag on budget [Re: Am_Fear_Liath_Mor]
JerryFountain Offline
Addict

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 418
Loc: St. Petersburg, Florida
Originally Posted By: Am_Fear_Liath_Mor
[quote]A word of caution on the temperature ratings specified by US retailers.

Here is an example of the specification for a high spec synthetic Bag - Thermarest Centari™ bag.

http://www.cascadedesigns.com/therm-a-rest/sleeping-bags/centari-0-sleeping-bag/product

The EN Comfort rating is -5 C / 23 F

Yet the Rating given by most retailers regard it as a -18 C / 0F bag.

If you are going to go out in dangerously cold temperatures please go by the EN Comfort rating to give yourself a safety margin and insure the insulation under your sleeping bag has a R rating of at least 4.5 when using a synthetic sleeping bag.


Good points. Certainly you need to verify ratings on any bag. The EN rating is a good one, but, like the US ratings which are made using a different set of criteria, they can be misleading and add up to a mismatched bag. I find the US ratings a little high for me, the EN way too high. I usually need to go one step higher - using my usual setup. My Daughter-in-Law is a totally different story. She needs a bag warmer that the EN rating to stay comfortable. She uses a US rated 0F bag in 40F weather. At 35 she needs to add a dog (thankfully she has one that likes to sleep with her). grin


Respectfully,

Jerry

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#265929 - 12/19/13 06:01 PM Re: Compact cold weather sleeping bag on budget [Re: JerryFountain]
Denis Offline
Addict

Registered: 01/09/09
Posts: 631
Loc: Calgary, AB
An article I found, Degrees of Comfort has a good summary of correction factors one can use to more closely figure out the temperature rating they should be looking for in a bag.
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Victory awaits him who has everything in order — luck, people call it. Defeat is certain for him who has neglected to take the necessary precautions in time; this is called bad luck. Roald Amundsen

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#265932 - 12/19/13 08:49 PM Re: Compact cold weather sleeping bag on budget [Re: Denis]
Mark_F Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 06/24/09
Posts: 714
Loc: Kentucky
Interesting article. One other thing I noticed on the really cold night of camping was the air inside the tent also got really cold, so simply breathing in the cold air seemed to sap the heat right out of me. Added to that, every time I moved cold air seemed to rush inside the sleeping bag (or the air I had warmed with my body rushed out, either way, brrrr) made the night really miserable, even with 3 layers of clothing on. Dry synthetic long johns, fleece shirt and pants with wool socks and a hat on my head, and I eventually added insulated coveralls to get through that night (and yes, all were fresh and dry). How cold did it actually get? Hard to say for sure, i know it got below freezing as there was frost on the cars, tents, equipment, grass, and everything else that was outside the tents.

A few other things to note, the sleeping bag I used is a rather normal rectangular design, seemed well insulated tho it is an older bag we bought a while back so I suspect it's rating was less than adequate. DS and I slept on 4 layers of old comforters (2 blankets each, folded in half) with the sleeping pad on top of that, followed by a fleece blanket and then the sleeping bag (with two of those chemical handwarmers inside) on that, with the foot of the sleeping bag covered with a large contractors bag and all covered with more fleece blankets. DS seemed to tolerate it better than I did, and with temps expected to be close to the same for the next weekend's campout, I went and bought us some cots to sleep on, plus the fleece sleeping bag liners and the full size chemical hand and body warmers. I guess it was a combination of all of those and maybe the temps not getting nearly as cold, but that next campout, with the same sleeping bags and blankets we had at the previous one, was much more tolerable.


Edited by Mark_Frantom (12/19/13 08:54 PM)
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#265933 - 12/19/13 09:32 PM Re: Compact cold weather sleeping bag on budget [Re: Mark_F]
Denis Offline
Addict

Registered: 01/09/09
Posts: 631
Loc: Calgary, AB
Originally Posted By: Mark_Frantom
Added to that, every time I moved cold air seemed to rush inside the sleeping bag (or the air I had warmed with my body rushed out, either way, brrrr) made the night really miserable, even with 3 layers of clothing on.

A good mummy bag would definitely solve that particular issue. When its cold out I find its best to cinch the hood up nice & tight, leaving only a breathing hole. This keeps most of that nice warm air inside the bag where we want it!

Something like this:
_________________________
Victory awaits him who has everything in order — luck, people call it. Defeat is certain for him who has neglected to take the necessary precautions in time; this is called bad luck. Roald Amundsen

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#265934 - 12/19/13 09:35 PM Re: Compact cold weather sleeping bag on budget [Re: Mark_F]
bws48 Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/18/07
Posts: 830
Loc: Anne Arundel County, Maryland
The perception of cold, like that of pain, is absolutely an individual one. What is comfortable to many, if not most people, may be unbearably uncomfortable to others. A large number of medical, genetic, and/or environmental conditions affect these things---too many to list or even try to identify.

The only solution is to try to gauge the individual's own susceptibility to the precautions and equipment in your planning.

As an example, I tend to wear a sweater and/or long sleeves when many around me are in short sleeves. . . .I am one of those who need those "warmer" sleeping bags.
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#265946 - 12/20/13 03:28 AM Re: Compact cold weather sleeping bag on budget [Re: Denis]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7153
Loc: southern Cal
Your illustration shows the warmest way to wear a mummy, but i am always twisting and turning and thus breathing into the bag, etc., and it gets to be quite a hassle. If it isn't bitterly cold,I like to cinch the bag around my neck and put on separate insulation around my head and neck. A balaclava works great for that. Then I can flop around all I want.

No one has mentiond that sleeping in a group makes a difference, such as being the middle person in a three person tent.Mild exercise will warm you up if things get really cold....
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#265949 - 12/20/13 05:40 AM Re: Compact cold weather sleeping bag on budget [Re: Mark_F]
MoBOB Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/17/07
Posts: 1219
Loc: here
For me, the best sleeping bag is sleeping on my mattress at home. I am side sleeper and nothing has ever been comfortable. Add to that, I am claustrophobic. If anything gets the least bit twisted or constricting, I go absolutely ape! I usually run out of the tent in a cold sweat, partake of a good Modified Stationary Panic (thanks Patick F. McManus), and then sit by the fire until I calm down - 20-30 minutes. So, I have to sleep, how shall I say it, fairly close to birth conditions - only socks and underdrawers. In the end, I don't do the sleeping outside thing anymore.
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"Its not a matter of being ready as it is being prepared" -- B. E. J. Taylor

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#265954 - 12/20/13 01:01 PM Re: Compact cold weather sleeping bag on budget [Re: Mark_F]
gonewiththewind Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/14/08
Posts: 1517
As has been discussed here before, you need to pick the right bag for the conditions. I live in a fairly wet area, so I choose synthetic bags. We also do not generally get extremely cold. I also have fairly young scouts, so the durability and safety factor of the synthetic bag is a plus for me. If I lived in a dry climate I would prefer down bags. It is always a challenge to equip the scouts suitably without overloading them. I have a good 0 F down bag, and my own sons each have one as well. Cost is also a significant factor for many families, which also leads me to the military surplus synthetic bags. You have to find what is right for your situation, there is no one right answer for everyone everywhere.

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