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#260350 - 05/06/13 10:04 PM Re: Choosing the Right Gun [Re: MDinana]
wildman800 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 2816
Loc: La-USA
Yes. But the availability of different types of ammo is a major consideration now.

Who knows when the ammo manufacturers will have enough slack time to produce more .32acp? For instance, or .17HMR when existing supplies have been consumed.
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#260351 - 05/06/13 10:25 PM Re: Choosing the Right Gun [Re: bacpacjac]
wileycoyote Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 276
Loc: eastern oregon
while more powerful and having better bullet design options, if deer (or defense) is the goal, then 22mag is far from the ideal choice anyway.

22mag is far more expensive, harder to find, louder and does more damage on small game.

22LR is cheaper, will always be easier to find, allows for lots more practice for equal cost, and much much quieter (particularly with subsonics in a rifle).

but like any cartridge, they should both always be used within their capability, ie: small game.

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#260352 - 05/06/13 10:38 PM Re: Choosing the Right Gun [Re: wildman800]
haertig Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/13/05
Posts: 2067
Loc: Colorado
Originally Posted By: wildman800
But the availability of different types of ammo is a major consideration now.

But it won't be a concern forever. Panic buying creates ammo shortages every time a gun-grabber agenda comes up in Congress. The panic will pass. And experienced shooters know that you buy ammo when it is readily available and cheap, not during panic situations when you can't find it and have to pay outrageous prices if you do. There are two general types of folks that buy ammo during panic situations: (1) the naive group that thinks all ammo will disappear completely and they have to buy it now before it is no more, and (2) the speculators who buy in large quantities with the expectation that they will be able to make a profit ripping people off by selling it at even higher prices.

The first group is just ignorant, usually composed of people who have never shot a firearm before, and are clueless regarding these very predictable ammo/gun shortage cycles. The second group can take it in the shorts as far as I'm concerned, when they find they have a ton of ammo that they can't even sell for what they paid for it.

Experienced shooters just ignored the current shortage/panic_buying because they already owned all the ammo they need. They learned this during the previous panic buy, or the panic before that, or the one before that... Much to annoyance of gun-grabbers, there are very good reasons why experienced shooters recommend minimum ammo levels of 1000 rounds of each centerfire cartridge you have a gun for (and regularly shoot), plus 10,000 rounds of .22LR. You obviously don't buy all this at once, you build over time, we're talking many years, buying things when they are on sale, when you have spare cash, etc. And you ride on your inventory and never worry about having to buy during the panic times.

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#260353 - 05/06/13 10:54 PM Re: Choosing the Right Gun [Re: MDinana]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5074
Loc: SOCAL
... .223 or .308 would be better yet. .22LR is a great round precisely because it owns the low end. Nudges higher in power like the very small upgrade to .22WMR will do a better job on the larger varmints but is still small for deer -- slightly better, but still underpowered; you will still need a good head shot.

I carry two rifles when I travel, a .22LR bolt gun and a .308 bolt gun. Both have very good iron sights and between the two cover just about all the game I would consider. I take a box of .308 hunting rounds and a brick of .22LR. I'll use the .22 for practice/plinking and the .308 usually stays in its sleeve for the trip.

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#260354 - 05/07/13 02:06 AM Re: Choosing the Right Gun [Re: bacpacjac]
MDinana Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/08/07
Posts: 2186
Loc: Bluegrass
Man, a .22lr and .308 would be a great dual caliber rifle. Probably better than a .22lr/410 for Canada (just in terms of big wildlife).

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#260355 - 05/07/13 02:26 AM Re: Choosing the Right Gun [Re: wileycoyote]
Roarmeister Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 09/12/01
Posts: 904
Loc: Saskatchewan, Canada
Originally Posted By: wileycoyote
while more powerful and having better bullet design options, if deer (or defense) is the goal, then 22mag is far from the ideal choice anyway.

22mag is far more expensive, harder to find, louder and does more damage on small game.

22LR is cheaper, will always be easier to find, allows for lots more practice for equal cost, and much much quieter (particularly with subsonics in a rifle).

but like any cartridge, they should both always be used within their capability, ie: small game.


While the .22LR will always be king in terms of price for rimfire, there is a new kid on the block for alternative rimfire ammmo. That's the .17WSM, which is created by necking down a .27 caliber nail gun shell to fit the 20 gr. bullets of the .17HMR In terms of performance it clocks in at 3000fps at the muzzle and 400 ft-lbs of energy which blows away the HMR and .22mag. It counters the problem of low energy and high wind drift of the HMR. Ammo is apparently on price par with the HMR and magum rimfire ammos.

Quite literally, the .17WSM could replace the HMR, HM2 and magnum rimfires leaving only the .22LR as competition. And the only reason the .22LR would remain is because of the vast popularity and pricing.

.17WSM would seem to be an ideal rimfire alternative to .22 centerfire ammo at least for those don't reload and it is suitable for varmits like coyotes.

http://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/winchester-ammunition-17-super-magnum-rimfire-17wsm-shot-show-2013/
http://suburbanbushwacker.blogspot.ca/2013/01/speed-thrills-17-wsm-for-recessionista.html
http://www.chuckhawks.com/17_super_mag_first_look.htm

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#260387 - 05/09/13 12:47 AM Re: Choosing the Right Gun [Re: bacpacjac]
Eugene Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 2823
A lot of what we consider 'political' organizations such as the NRA and NSSF have plenty of resources to help, for example:
http://www.outdoorroadmap.com/resources/target-shooting/how-choose-your-child%E2%80%99s-first-gun

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#260388 - 05/09/13 01:25 AM Re: Choosing the Right Gun [Re: Roarmeister]
haertig Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/13/05
Posts: 2067
Loc: Colorado
Originally Posted By: Roarmeister
Quite literally, the .17WSM could replace the HMR, HM2 and magnum rimfires leaving only the .22LR as competition. And the only reason the .22LR would remain is because of the vast popularity and pricing.

That's a lot to say for a cartridge that is not even commercially available yet. At least I don't think so - has anyone ever seen this ammo in stock anywhere? Are there any firearmss available in this chambering yet? All's we know about it so far is marketing hype.

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#260390 - 05/09/13 02:10 AM Re: Choosing the Right Gun [Re: haertig]
Roarmeister Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 09/12/01
Posts: 904
Loc: Saskatchewan, Canada
Originally Posted By: haertig
Originally Posted By: Roarmeister
Quite literally, the .17WSM could replace the HMR, HM2 and magnum rimfires leaving only the .22LR as competition. And the only reason the .22LR would remain is because of the vast popularity and pricing.

That's a lot to say for a cartridge that is not even commercially available yet. At least I don't think so - has anyone ever seen this ammo in stock anywhere? Are there any firearmss available in this chambering yet? All's we know about it so far is marketing hype.


The cartridge was supposedly available in April. Savage is selling their B.MAG rifle with a MSRP of $349 so retail should be under $300. At least 2 other manufacturers have versions in the works.

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#260393 - 05/09/13 02:45 AM Re: Choosing the Right Gun [Re: Roarmeister]
haertig Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/13/05
Posts: 2067
Loc: Colorado
I would be interested in this new cartridge. Not because I have any use for it. But simply because "I don't have this cartridge" yet. Many folks try to consolidate on only a few standard cartridges. I'm not like that. wink However, it seems premature to predict it will replace all the other rimfire cartridges out there with zero real world experience behind it. If it just supposedly came out last month, then only a small group of very lucky people would have ever seem it, let alone shot it. Even fewer would own it and be able to report on it.

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