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#238484 - 01/02/12 06:36 PM Nice rescue & novel underwater window breaking...
thseng Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 900
Loc: NW NJ
http://www.chron.com/news/article/Passers-by-rescue-children-from-icy-Utah-river-2436555.php

Says he put his handgun gun against the window underwater and fired:

Quote:
Willden said he tried unsuccessfully to open windows and doors. He then used his firearm just as he had done in training for his current job as a bodyguard and Department of Defense contractor.

One thing that's not clear to me is how the driver ended up outside the vehicle with all the windows and doors closed.
_________________________
- Tom S.

"Never trust and engineer who doesn't carry a pocketknife."

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#238487 - 01/02/12 07:44 PM Re: Nice rescue & novel underwater window breaking... [Re: thseng]
BigToe Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/04/08
Posts: 81
I wonder if the father jumped out of the car before the water flow / vehicle angle held the doors closed.

Also significant:
Quote:
One of the girls had found an air pocket and was breathing fine but was trapped in her seat belt. Willden cut it with a pocket knife and pulled her from the rear passenger window.
Thankfully Willden EDCs a knife.
_________________________
Men have become the tools of their tools.
Henry David Thoreau

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#238492 - 01/02/12 09:49 PM Re: Nice rescue & novel underwater window breaking... [Re: thseng]
Bingley Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/27/08
Posts: 1576
Does anyone know about the safety issues involving firing a round underwater in such a situation? I recall vaguely having a conversation with a navy diver who said he generally wouldn't shoot underwater, because the bullet doesn't travel that far, and the shock wave would be very punishing for the shooter. In this rescue scenario, would the rescuer risk injuring the submerged or the partially submerged kids (i.e., damaging their hearing)?


Edited by Bingley (01/02/12 10:16 PM)

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#238501 - 01/02/12 10:48 PM Re: Nice rescue & novel underwater window breaking... [Re: thseng]
Dagny Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 1918
Loc: Washington, DC

A lot of heroes in that story. Thank heaven the children were revived.

Thanks for posting it.

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#238507 - 01/03/12 12:14 AM Re: Nice rescue & novel underwater window breaking... [Re: thseng]
jzmtl Offline
Addict

Registered: 03/18/10
Posts: 530
Loc: Montreal Canada
Those kids would be SOL if they lived in Australia, both guns and folders are banned.

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#238522 - 01/03/12 06:21 AM Re: Nice rescue & novel underwater window breaking... [Re: thseng]
Phaedrus Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 04/28/10
Posts: 3148
Loc: Big Sky Country
I keep a Houdini Rescue Tool in my truck; it's attached to a paracord loop around the steering column. The Houdini is hard to separate from the lanyard loop but one good tug and it pops off (with the other end secured, that is). The nice thing is the loop is way too small to slip over the wheel so it has nowhere to go in the event of a rollover, etc. It has a belt cutter and a glass breaker, and I've tested both to be sure they work.
_________________________
“I'd rather have questions that cannot be answered than answers that can't be questioned.” —Richard Feynman

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#238551 - 01/03/12 05:15 PM Re: Nice rescue & novel underwater window breaking... [Re: Phaedrus]
thseng Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 900
Loc: NW NJ
interview here:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/45853756/ns/us_news-life/
Sounds like he and his son should be awarded honorary ETS membership:
Quote:
>> bruce your son also had the knife needed to break open the seat belts . how proud were you watching your son in action?

>> chris has always been one who has been prepared, like he always says, he never leaves the house, but what he doesn't have, these three items with him, a firearm, and a knife and a portable flashlight, portable, in his pocket.

He also explains how he aimed so that the bullet would hit the inside of the upside-down roof.

Reminds me of when I was a teenager and my dad & I were at a horse show. We're not horse people and we were only there to watch my sister ride. A horse pulling some type of little cart spooked and took off, the driver dragging behind with the reigns wrapped around her foot. Much to my surprise, my dad hopped the fence and took off after it.

I stood there and thought "What's he doing? He doesn't know anything about horses, he's liable to scare the thing worse!" Luckily someone stopped the horse. When my dad got back, I asked him what the heck he had planned to do. He told me "I wasn't going to do anything! I expeced you to be right behind me and use your pocket knife to cut the reigns!"

Oh.

Had it been an icy river, I'd like to think I would have been right there. But with horses, as a layman, my plan is: "First, do no harm."
_________________________
- Tom S.

"Never trust and engineer who doesn't carry a pocketknife."

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#238695 - 01/05/12 02:14 PM Re: Nice rescue & novel underwater window breaking... [Re: NightHiker]
NAro Offline
Addict

Registered: 03/15/01
Posts: 517
There is no barotrauma from a handgun fired underwater. Personal experience with .9mm and 40cal. You feel a pressure wave like clapping hands over your ears under water, but it is annoying rather than painful. But the attenuation of sound seemed (to me) to be less uncomfortable than if fired in air.

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#238704 - 01/05/12 04:29 PM Re: Nice rescue & novel underwater window breaking... [Re: thseng]
JerryFountain Offline
Addict

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 418
Loc: St. Petersburg, Florida
Phaedrus,

Nearly all glass breaking tools are usless underwater. There is no friction with the ground to swing one quickly and water resistance slows it down. Automatic center punches would work but unless there is something to hang onto you cannot push it in to cock the spring.

As to the ear damage, a contact shot will not pose too much threat to the diver as the gas pressure all goes inside. In some areas a Glock is the standard shark defense tool if you are spearfishing. A non contact shot would be loud enough to be uncomfortable but, as has been stated, the alternative is worse. There is the possibility of ear damage but it is small.

Respectfully,

Jerry

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#238710 - 01/05/12 06:07 PM Re: Nice rescue & novel underwater window breaking... [Re: thseng]
clearwater Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/19/05
Posts: 1177
Loc: Channeled Scablands
Length of the barrel has an effect on shooting a firearm while
underwater. Handguns are the way to go for this.

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