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#237611 - 12/19/11 11:22 PM Re: Is Ethanol Worth It? (for alcohol stoves) [Re: LED]
Hikin_Jim Offline
Sheriff
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 1804
Loc: Southern California
Originally Posted By: LED
Hi Jim. If you had to cook under a semi-enclosed shelter, would it be better to use the ethanol blend? Less toxic? Or would it not even matter.
Well, first, I am NOT a medical professional of any kind let alone a toxicologist. If it were up to me, I would prefer fewer nasties in whatever it was that I were burning. The absolute cleanest you can get? Everclear, 190 proof. It's in drinkable form and contains no denaturants.

However, methanol actually burns pretty cleanly. You'd probably be fine burning methanol so long as the flame were blue.

The main thing about methanol is DO NOT DRINK IN ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. Reasonable care in handling it is fine. It's not sulfuric acid or nerve agent or something.

HJ
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#237612 - 12/19/11 11:28 PM Re: Is Ethanol Worth It? (for alcohol stoves) [Re: Russ]
Hikin_Jim Offline
Sheriff
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 1804
Loc: Southern California
Originally Posted By: Russ
If "high ethanol content blends like Green denatured produce a little more soot", how does Sunnyside with an even higher percentage? Since "Complete combustion of ethanol forms carbon dioxide and water vapor", I'm thinking Sunnyside may burn cleaner (less soot) since it doesn't have as much other stuff in the mix. Is there an optimum blend to eliminate soot?
Russ,

Excellent questions, but I don't have a definitive answer (yet). I've got anecdotal indications that a mix of ethanol with water without some of the denaturing agents found in denatured alcohol will burn cleaner. However, I'm not quite ready to "publish" that yet until I've been a little bit more thorough.

A mix of around 90/10 ethanol/methanol is supposed to be very clean burning according to people that I've talked to, but I haven't personally verified that yet. I've obviously got some more experimenting to do.

HJ
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#237613 - 12/20/11 12:01 AM Re: Is Ethanol Worth It? (for alcohol stoves) [Re: Hikin_Jim]
Hikin_Jim Offline
Sheriff
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 1804
Loc: Southern California
P.S. To the above. If you want a "lose, lose," try isopropanol which is frequently sold as "rubbing" alcohol in the US. From what I've read (again, I am NOT a medical professional), it's more toxic AND it produces more soot when burned. Yep, here's the fuel you really (don't) want.

This is anecdotal, but a friend of mine was doing tests in his garage with isopropanol. He had to stop because he was feeling ill. He didn't feel 100% for a couple of days.

Therefore, last choice, emergency use only: Isopropanol.

HJ
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#237620 - 12/20/11 01:43 AM Re: Is Ethanol Worth It? (for alcohol stoves) [Re: Hikin_Jim]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal
We are grateful, HJ, that you are attending to these burning issues.....
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#237623 - 12/20/11 01:50 AM Re: Is Ethanol Worth It? (for alcohol stoves) [Re: hikermor]
Hikin_Jim Offline
Sheriff
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 1804
Loc: Southern California
Originally Posted By: hikermor
We are grateful, HJ, that you are attending to these burning issues.....
Careful. If you make "flame" posts, the moderators will be all over you. wink

HJ

P.S. You were one of the people who encouraged me to start taking up alcohol stove issues. So, I know you're interested... or are you getting burnt out on this topic?
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#237628 - 12/20/11 03:37 AM Re: Is Ethanol Worth It? (for alcohol stoves) [Re: Hikin_Jim]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal
We can safely say that this rare issue is well done.....
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#237630 - 12/20/11 03:46 AM Re: Is Ethanol Worth It? (for alcohol stoves) [Re: hikermor]
Hikin_Jim Offline
Sheriff
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 1804
Loc: Southern California
I gotta say, my jokes can't hold a candle to yours...

HJ
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#237631 - 12/20/11 04:42 AM Re: Is Ethanol Worth It? (for alcohol stoves) [Re: Hikin_Jim]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal
but your comments are matchless...
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#237633 - 12/20/11 06:03 AM Re: Is Ethanol Worth It? (for alcohol stoves) [Re: hikermor]
Hikin_Jim Offline
Sheriff
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 1804
Loc: Southern California
It always gets interesting when I strike up a conversation with you.

HJ
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#237634 - 12/20/11 10:20 AM Re: Is Ethanol Worth It? (for alcohol stoves) [Re: Hikin_Jim]
Byrd_Huntr Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 01/28/10
Posts: 1174
Loc: MN, Land O' Lakes & Rivers ...
Originally Posted By: Hikin_Jim
It always gets interesting when I strike up a conversation with you.

HJ


Thats the spirit!
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