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#228339 - 07/24/11 01:54 AM Norweigan island mass shooting lessons?
dweste Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 02/16/08
Posts: 2463
Loc: Central California
As we get details of what the media is calling the "mass shooting" outrage and tragedy at the island summer camp in Norway, what lessons can we learn? How could we prepare our kids, and ourselves, to survive the situation?


Edited by dweste (07/24/11 01:55 AM)

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#228342 - 07/24/11 05:17 AM Re: Norweigan island mass shooting lessons? [Re: dweste]
MDinana Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/08/07
Posts: 2184
Loc: Deep south... Carolina
you mean besides packing a pistol and wearing a bullet proof vest?

I don't think there's any good way to prep for it. You can either choose to live ultimate safety and become a recluse, or go into society and be subject to the whims of those around you. Situational awareness only gets you so far, and all the FAKs, SAKs, pocket tinder and BOBs won't help when EIGHTY people are shot around you.

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#228343 - 07/24/11 05:39 AM Re: Norweigan island mass shooting lessons? [Re: dweste]
dweste Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 02/16/08
Posts: 2463
Loc: Central California
I know it is early days and still shocking. I also know there are folks in this community who can suggest some ideas for what to do, and what you want your kids to do, to better chances of surviving "shots fired" situations.

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#228344 - 07/24/11 06:02 AM Re: Norweigan island mass shooting lessons? [Re: dweste]
bigreddog Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 07/02/06
Posts: 253
As a parent in a country that mirrors Norway (minimal civilian armed response), my only thoughts are to drill / condition / hope that your kids respond promptly by running and hiding - I suspect when the full timeline of the attack is mapped out a lot of the kids stayed still and froze - pretty much a natural reaction.

For all sorts of crises, one of the major problems is people (not just kids) not recognising it and acting early.

Otherwise my thoughts go out to all victims and their families

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#228345 - 07/24/11 06:36 AM Re: Norweigan island mass shooting lessons? [Re: dweste]
Xterior Offline
Member

Registered: 06/25/05
Posts: 148
I don't think there is a lot you can do.

One thing I've read is that worried parrents calling their childeren on their cells actually give away their positions. So it would be probebly be a good idea to shut it off.

Alse make sure you are in a good physical health, to maximize your escape chances.

Packing a pistol is maybe a vialable option in some US states, but almost illegally in Western Europe

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#228347 - 07/24/11 11:04 AM Re: Norweigan island mass shooting lessons? [Re: dweste]
bws48 Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/18/07
Posts: 830
Loc: Anne Arundel County, Maryland
The only things are to run and hide. AKA "Cover and concealment."
I know this sounds overly simple minded and was joked about in the famous Monty Python bit "How not to be seen" but it doesn't make it any less true or effective.

This was the only option on the island and the survivors all apparently survived this way, including in at least one case, by playing dead.

My heart and prayers goes out to the parents and families and to the people of Norway.
_________________________
"Better is the enemy of good enough."

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#228350 - 07/24/11 11:28 AM Re: Norweigan island mass shooting lessons? [Re: dweste]
NuggetHoarder Offline
Member

Registered: 07/01/11
Posts: 145
Loc: Appalachians
Originally Posted By: dweste
what lessons can we learn? How could we prepare our kids, and ourselves, to survive the situation?

OK, here you go...
1. When seconds count, the police are only minutes away (90 long ones in this case)
2. Don't bother dialing 911 (it doesn't do any good)
3. Shoot first (unless you're in a heavily gun controlled country like Norway)
4. Don't trust uniforms (it could kill you)
5. Don't live in a left wing anti-self defense locality.

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#228351 - 07/24/11 11:31 AM Re: Norweigan island mass shooting lessons? [Re: dweste]
Tarzan Offline
Member

Registered: 02/02/08
Posts: 146
Loc: Washington
I think an aggressive campaign aimed at individuals contemplating such types of activities should be started at once. The focus should be for such persons to "Be the first step in a sea of change" and put the first round through their own heads. After they see how that works for them, they can move on.
I feel my idea has a lot of merit and could gain traction.

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#228352 - 07/24/11 12:03 PM Re: Norweigan island mass shooting lessons? [Re: Tarzan]
Glocker36 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 07/05/07
Posts: 27
The real tragedy about the mass shooting in Norway is that even ONE person responsible for the safety of those children had a gun, they could have stopped it. But they didn't and they couldn't.

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#228354 - 07/24/11 12:24 PM Re: Norweigan island mass shooting lessons? [Re: dweste]
LesSnyder Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 1534
Loc: New Port Richey, Fla
instill in your kids the mechanics of the OODA loop:

Observe a perceived threat
Orient yourself to the threat
Decide on course of action
Act on your decision

teach them the difference between cover and concealment... cover will stop a bullet, concealment just hides your location

teach them that distance is your friend, especially if confronted with a pistol shooting threat... secondly, once distance has been reached...it is much harder to hit a moving target traversing laterally than directly away, and for inexperienced handgun shooters at distance, the muzzle is typically pulled off target away from the shooting hand... for right handers, it is typically pulled to the left, so teach them to run to the right

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