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#224672 - 05/30/11 05:18 PM Re: Knife rights and five seconds to live. [Re: Art_in_FL]
quick_joey_small Offline
Addict

Registered: 01/13/09
Posts: 571
Loc: UK
You are possibly right about him approaching the officer. I thought the cop said 'he kept coming' but now listening to the video, I'm not too sure that is what he's saying. But he did feel threatened and the jury 9who unlike us had access to all the evidence) thought the evidence inconclusive.
That close; a sudden turn might look like the start of an attack. As I said before; maybe the officer did shoot when he shouldn't have. I But we don't have the proof he did. Aren't people innocent till proven guilty? Though the web is awash with people calling this murder based on a video that shows nothing of the confrontation.
qjs


from wikipedia:
>In August, 2010 homeless First Nations woodcarver John T. Williams was shot and killed by SPD officer Ian Birk. Birk testified that he saw Williams stabbing at a piece of wood with knife as he walked down the street. After stopping and getting out of his patrol car Birk repeatedly told Williams to drop his knife. Williams was, in turn, shot when as turned toward the police officer. Birk would testify that Williams' knife was open and he appeared intent on attacking him. Subsequent grandjury findings on the level of threat posed by Williams were inconclusive but an internal review of the shooting by the SPD's Firearms Review Commission found the shooting "unjustified" and cited Birk's tactical mishandling of the confrontation as being responsible for Williams' death.[6] In the aftermath of the shooting Williams' lengthy criminal record and threats against police officer's lives were published.[7] Birk also resigned from the Department, though prosecutor Dan Satterberg declined to file charges prompting a protest by Williams' family and supporters.

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#224679 - 05/30/11 06:44 PM Re: Knife rights and five seconds to live. [Re: Art_in_FL]
quick_joey_small Offline
Addict

Registered: 01/13/09
Posts: 571
Loc: UK
>In the aftermath of the shooting Williams' lengthy criminal record and threats against police officer's lives were published.

Maybe I was closer to the truth when I compared it to Osama. If you are a known violent criminal, who has threatened police officers lives and with a knife in your hand you repeatedly refuse to drop it then make a sudden move....
If that had been Mother Theresa there'd be no dead body on the street.
qjs

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#224682 - 05/30/11 07:20 PM Re: Knife rights and five seconds to live. [Re: quick_joey_small]
ireckon Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 04/01/10
Posts: 1629
Loc: Northern California
The cops surely are chatting it up nicely before they form a stack to approach this guy who is supposed to be so dangerous. One of the closest cops is fully NOT paying attention to the "potentially" dangerous man on the ground while he's chatting with his partners. I wonder if that's standard police procedure too. This does look like those cops selected this opportunity to carry out some training. These cops can't think outside the book.

If a cop is allowed to issue the death penalty without a judge and a jury, then the cop needs a much better reason then the evidence shown here. A normal death penalty case goes on for years and goes through many appeals, and we know the criminal is scum. This victim wasn't awarded the opportunity of an appeal. This victim got an instant death penalty because he didn't turn around fast enough for a cop who was the initiator. This cop got away with murder, plain and simple.
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#224685 - 05/30/11 07:29 PM Re: Knife rights and five seconds to live. [Re: quick_joey_small]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5357
Loc: SOCAL
Williams criminal record probably says a lot about him being a habitual inebriate -- not really rationale for deadly force, however . . . the article: SPD Officer Ian Birk Escapes Charges spells out quite clearly why Birk wasn't prosecuted. I'm sure that WA State LE don't want that loophole too closely scrutinized.
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Better is the Enemy of Good Enough.
Okay, what’s your point??

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#224719 - 05/31/11 12:51 AM Re: Knife rights and five seconds to live. [Re: Art_in_FL]
Art_in_FL Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/01/07
Posts: 2432
A decent write up of the autopsy result:

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2013082467_shooting06m.html


PDF of autopsy results. Note order of shot listing is unrelated to sequence of shots:

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/ABPub/2010/10/05/2013082602.pdf

All shots seem consistent with Williams' face, the shot in chin entered side and exited the other side, and body, shot entered right side of chest and exited left side under arm, being turned sideways to Birk.

Shots were fired from 9 or 10 feet away.

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#224725 - 05/31/11 01:25 AM Re: Knife rights and five seconds to live. [Re: Art_in_FL]
bacpacjac Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/05/07
Posts: 3601
Loc: Ontario, Canada
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You can find me on YouTube here:
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#224726 - 05/31/11 01:25 AM Re: Knife rights and five seconds to live. [Re: Art_in_FL]
bacpacjac Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/05/07
Posts: 3601
Loc: Ontario, Canada
_________________________
Mom & Adventurer

You can find me on YouTube here:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCT9fpZEy5XSWkYy7sgz-mSA

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#224727 - 05/31/11 01:25 AM Re: Knife rights and five seconds to live. [Re: Art_in_FL]
bacpacjac Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/05/07
Posts: 3601
Loc: Ontario, Canada
_________________________
Mom & Adventurer

You can find me on YouTube here:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCT9fpZEy5XSWkYy7sgz-mSA

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#225424 - 06/07/11 08:31 PM Re: Knife rights and five seconds to live. [Re: bacpacjac]
Am_Fear_Liath_Mor Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 3078
http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/06/07/florida.shooting.witness/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

Looks like the cops are getting a little smarter with regard to the suppressing of some evidential video, which might not tally with their account during their street operations. wink

Edit.

Changed for political correctness.



Edited by Am_Fear_Liath_Mor (06/07/11 09:05 PM)

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#225426 - 06/07/11 09:00 PM Re: Knife rights and five seconds to live. [Re: Am_Fear_Liath_Mor]
Teslinhiker Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/14/09
Posts: 1418
Loc: Nothern Ontario
Originally Posted By: Am_Fear_Liath_Mor



I may get flamed for this, however I firmly believe that this fine forum is not the appropriate venue for such debates on so called "street executions." Doug Ritter has a very good reputation in regards to promoting safety, survival and knife rights. It is my opinion, inflammatory posts like the above only serve to undermine his efforts now and in the future.

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Earth and sky, woods and fields, lakes and rivers, the mountain and the sea, are excellent schoolmasters, and teach some of us more than we can ever learn from books.

John Lubbock

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