Equipped To Survive Equipped To Survive® Presents
The Survival Forum
Where do you want to go on ETS?

Page 6 of 11 < 1 2 ... 4 5 6 7 8 10 11 >
Topic Options
#209110 - 10/05/10 09:06 PM Re: Are we raising a generation of nincompoops? [Re: MartinFocazio]
Dagny Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 1918
Loc: Washington, DC
Pop sociology. Generational generalities aren't very edifying or useful. "Experts" can't even agree on when one generation ends and the next begins. My sister had very different perspective and memories (or lack of) of significant events we both experienced and she's only four years younger.

Generation Z (born since 2000)
Generation Y (born late 70s or 82-1999)
Generation X (born 1961 or 65-86, opinion varies on when the Boom ended)
Baby Boomer (born 1946-61 or 64)
Silent Generation (born 1925-45)
Greatest Generation (born 1901-24)
Lost Generation (fought in WW I)


Big societal events are an interesting demarcation. The Boomers who were in their late-teens and 20s (and subject to the draft) during the Vietnam War were impacted differently than the Boomers who were 10 years old at the height of the war. The Boomers who were 28 during Watergate were affected differently than the Boomers who were 12.

The Korean War began five years after World War II -- yet different experiences for the combatants and the entire nation (no rationing during the Korean War). World War I was a different experience from WWII, for the combatants and U.S. civilians.

I graduated high school after the draft ended. Subsequent wars no longer included worry among those of draft age that they would be drafted to fight in it or worry on the part of their loved ones. Good or bad, lack of the draft has made the last thirty years of wars a different experience for the generations of "draft age" and their families.

Economic events and trends can have profound effects on psyche, depending on the age and circumstance of those experiencing them. The 1930s Great Depression had a life-long impact on the behavior and psychology of my grandparents. The 1970s stagflation and energy crises (even-odd days of rationing) were seared into my psyche (I was making minimum wage when the 1979 Iranian Oil Crisis occurred and gas price doubled in a year). The 21% prime interest rate and the 13% inflation rate of 1980 and the '81-'82 recession are vivid still as my family and I were affected.

Prior to the 2008 financial meltdown several of my peers and I used to discuss how today's 20 and 30-somethings had no memory of the last severe recession ('81-'82) and the economic hardships of the 1970s.

Those in today's job market won't soon forget the current downturn.

Those who were 20 on 9/11/01 will forever be impacted differently than those who were 10 (those who lost a loved one that day will obviously forever have a unique take on it).

Do kids still do civil defense drills ("duck-and-cover") in school?

I'd be interested in a discussion of life-shaping events that the entire society experienced and how those impacted people of different ages.



Top
#209118 - 10/05/10 10:03 PM Re: Are we raising a generation of nincompoops? [Re: Dagny]
Cauldronborn Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 07/10/09
Posts: 82
Loc: UK
Dagny, don't be to sure about how ten year olds remember 9/11. I was twelve years old myself when it happend and I'm British too. But I can remeber watching the footage of the first plane going in and seeing the second plane going in live, those images will forever remain clear to me as I realized just what had happened and the likely death toll. I think this further emphasizes your point on persective changing how generations are viewed and view themselves

Top
#209124 - 10/05/10 11:01 PM Re: Are we raising a generation of nincompoops? [Re: Cauldronborn]
Dagny Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 1918
Loc: Washington, DC
Originally Posted By: Cauldronborn
Dagny, don't be to sure about how ten year olds remember 9/11. I was twelve years old myself when it happend and I'm British too. But I can remeber watching the footage of the first plane going in and seeing the second plane going in live, those images will forever remain clear to me as I realized just what had happened and the likely death toll. I think this further emphasizes your point on persective changing how generations are viewed and view themselves



I don't presume to know how anyone remembers anything but this thread is about generalizing and 20 year olds, generally-speaking (especially those who read news reports), have a different take on things than 10 year olds.

Those of us who were in DC and NYC that day were having a different experience than those who weren't. Those who were Americans were having a different experience than those who are not. One thing just about everyone who was a sentient being and had a TV on that day has in common is that they will never forget where they were when it happened.

(BTW, among the most vivid and heartwarming memories for me of that time was the outpouring of concern and support in England, including the St. Paul's service.)

http://www.suite101.com/article.cfm/food_travel_uk/80132

http://www.novinite.com/view_news.php?id=1960

A friend who was born in 1951 recently toured the Texas School Book Depository and Dealey Plaza in Dallas (site of the assassination of President John F. Kennedy in 1963). She said it was striking how people of different ages responded to the museum tour. Older people of many nationalities were visibly moved, younger people were not. It was surprisingly emotional for my friend.

Which goes back to your point. She was just 12 and remembers the assassination vividly. She also was among the millions who watched the subsequent live-on-TV assassination of the assassin, Lee Harvey Oswald. She has said it was a terrifying time to live through, at least for her.

My parents and grandparents often spoke of the tension during the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962. They lived in Los Angeles and said the groceries were cleaned out because there was widespread concern that we were on the precipice of nuclear war.

I've seen the black-and-white broadcasts of President Kennedy's national address during that crisis but don't presume to know what it must have been like to be a parent with small kids watching that unfold. I hope never to watch a president in the future make such an announcement. Doubtful I'd ever forget it!







Top
#209133 - 10/05/10 11:39 PM Re: Are we raising a generation of nincompoops? [Re: MartinFocazio]
sotto Offline
Addict

Registered: 06/04/03
Posts: 450
While we are arguing about whether our current generation is putting us all in the crapper, there is a group of human beings (who shall remain nameless, but there's a whole lot of them, they come from a very big Eastern country with a whole bunch of Dynasties, there's a lot of restaurants associated with their style of food, they give you leftovers in a cute white little folded box sometimes with a metal bail, invented gunpowder and fireworks (yah!), built a very large and longlasting wall, invented paper and ink, used to be associated with making cheap knick-knacks sold in gift shops but now are associated with making top quality high tech devices including spy satellites, etc etc) who put incredibly high value on education, generally make certain their kids perform at or near the top of their classes, frequently hold jobs in highly technical positions involving computers, biomedical sciences, and electronics; and who we may all be working for before you can say "Jack RobinWu".

I jokingly said something along this line to one of my young female colleagues from this country the other day, mentioning something like 20 years as the expected timetable for this turnover, and she said back to me in complete seriousness, "No, 5 years."

Top
#209135 - 10/06/10 12:09 AM Re: Are we raising a generation of nincompoops? [Re: paramedicpete]
Art_in_FL Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/01/07
Posts: 2432
Originally Posted By: paramedicpete
Sorry to disagree but I believe in personal responsibility, not blaming others including parents, schools, friends, etc. for the failing of the individual. There are just too many opportunities available to blame others. There are kids who come from the worst families, poorest schools, crime-ridden neighborhoods and are subjected to intense negative peer pressure, who arise and decide to make something of themselves. Our military is full of well trained, disciplined and intelligent young persons, many of which came from the above conditions and who by many were written off as nincompoops.


Interesting that you cite the military as an opportunity because the military is one of the few organizations that still will take the majority of people who show up without a large number of requirements or preconditions. The entry minimums have risen but, partly as requirement for the optional re-institution of the draft, an eventuality that has to left open, there is still an underlying ethic that 'there are no bad privates'. As an exercise in institutional adaptability and 'can-do spirit', they take what comes and make the best of it.

Which makes the point very well. While it is useful to instill a sense of self-reliance and responsibility in individuals it is also necessary to demand the same from corporations, businesses, organizations.

Organization that use, but do not improve or train employees, and businesses that do not provide benefits, are strip-mining the population. They are extracting the best and brightest but then, once the person is used up, as soon as anything is required in return, they are dropped like toxic waste.

Top
#209136 - 10/06/10 12:20 AM Re: Are we raising a generation of nincompoops? [Re: MartinFocazio]
ireckon Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 04/01/10
Posts: 1629
Loc: Northern California
No generalities here, America is well behind in STEM (science, technology, engineering & math) education. I recently saw on CNN that America is ranked 27 out of the 30 top countries in STEM education. (I can't find the link but the info is out there somewhere.)

Ho-hum, who cares, right?

Well, I care. I personally think that stat is a big freakin' deal because America use to be the runaway leader in STEM education. I believe that stat is a reflection of the many people in America who feel a sense of entitlement to remain smug, cocky and barely competent. India, China and other countries are kicking America's ass in STEM education. Let's not sugar coat it and pretend like everything is going to be OK. If we continue along this path, America is going to be entirely OWNED by the world's leaders in STEM. We almost are already.

Perhaps more than ever, we need OUR OWN people who know how to rebuild our infrastructure, build bridges, operate the power grid, etc. We also need the rest of America to understand the value of such skills. I have nothing against industries like entertainment, art, music, fashion, etc. We all need our entertainment. However, America can't sustain itself if too many people want to be the next Oprah, sell novels, appear on the next reality TV show, etc.
_________________________
If you're reading this, it's too late.

Top
#209170 - 10/06/10 01:20 PM Re: Are we raising a generation of nincompoops? [Re: ireckon]
sotto Offline
Addict

Registered: 06/04/03
Posts: 450
Originally Posted By: ireckon
I have nothing against industries like entertainment, art, music, fashion, etc. We all need our entertainment. However, America can't sustain itself if too many people want to be the next Oprah, sell novels, appear on the next reality TV show, etc.


I'm confident that, when Oprah is elected president, all will be set right. ;-)

Top
#209194 - 10/06/10 05:33 PM Re: Are we raising a generation of nincompoops? [Re: MartinFocazio]
ireckon Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 04/01/10
Posts: 1629
Loc: Northern California
Regarding the idea of allowing creativity in education, I'm fine with NOT formally including creativity as part of the curriculum. We have a limited number of resources. Creativity can be developed naturally at home and on the playground. Kids should be encouraged to do so. I'm NOT talking about getting rid of classes like music. I'm talking about ensuring that kids are, for example, being taught music theory in their music classes and being tested on it.

I personally don't respect somebody's creativity, unless that person first knows the rules and then respectfully ventures from those rules. I draw the analogy to music. You can't be a great musician until you understand and appreciate what was there before you showed up on the scene. You may be a naturally gifted musician, but you can't be great until you understand the rules and history of your art form.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that most kids naturally have a problem with following simple instructions. Adults have the responsibility of teaching the rules. Kids will be creative naturally and don't need much help from us there.
_________________________
If you're reading this, it's too late.

Top
#209257 - 10/07/10 01:32 PM Re: Are we raising a generation of nincompoops? [Re: MartinFocazio]
sotto Offline
Addict

Registered: 06/04/03
Posts: 450
I see there have been no posts on this thread in almost the last 24 hours. Please, let's not let this thread die. As an old f__t, I love complaining about the younger generation.

In order to pep things up, I would like to relay the latest Nincompoop News. I am spending quite a lot of time (a LOT of time) working with a young-ish person helping them with a slight problem they have--nothing insurmountable, just a temporary disability. Coincidentally, I also helped her father with the same problem several years ago. So I said, "Where do you work?" She said, "Oh, I'm the ______ Director at the ____ County _______ Office." I said, "Oh, really?! You know, I've always wanted one of their T-shirts or a baseball cap!"

To which she replied, "Well, you can go online and buy one then."

So, I then said, "OK, thanks for that info. Say, I wonder if there's a chance I could get a little tour over there sometime?" To which she replied, "I'll give you the number of the place to call and you can see if you can schedule that."


Top
#209261 - 10/07/10 01:53 PM Re: Are we raising a generation of nincompoops? [Re: ireckon]
bacpacjac Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/05/07
Posts: 3601
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: ireckon

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that most kids naturally have a problem with following simple instructions. Adults have the responsibility of teaching the rules. Kids will be creative naturally and don't need much help from us there.


I think you're onto something here. It always amazes me how my kids are ready to apply creative solutions to problems that don't exist instead of just going with the flow. I find myself saying "Ya know, if you just did that the way you're suppposed to it might just work." "Ya know, if you used that thing the way it's intended it would probably make things easier." etc. etc. etc. It's almost as if they don't think they're smart unless they invent/create/discover EVERYTHING on their own.
_________________________
Mom & Adventurer

You can find me on YouTube here:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCT9fpZEy5XSWkYy7sgz-mSA

Top
Page 6 of 11 < 1 2 ... 4 5 6 7 8 10 11 >



Moderator:  Alan_Romania, Blast, chaosmagnet, cliff 
March
Su M Tu W Th F Sa
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
31
Who's Online
1 registered (SRMC), 332 Guests and 70 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
GallenR, Jeebo, NicholasMarshall, Yadav, BenFoakes
5367 Registered Users
Newest Posts
What did you do today to prepare?
by dougwalkabout
Yesterday at 11:21 PM
Zippo Butane Inserts
by dougwalkabout
Yesterday at 11:11 PM
Question about a "Backyard Mutitool"
by Ren
03/17/24 01:00 AM
Problem in my WhatsApp configuration
by Chisel
03/09/24 01:55 PM
New Madrid Seismic Zone
by Jeanette_Isabelle
03/04/24 02:44 PM
EDC Reduction
by EchoingLaugh
03/02/24 04:12 PM
Using a Compass Without a Map
by KenK
02/28/24 12:22 AM
Newest Images
Tiny knife / wrench
Handmade knives
2"x2" Glass Signal Mirror, Retroreflective Mesh
Trade School Tool Kit
My Pocket Kit
Glossary
Test

WARNING & DISCLAIMER: SELECT AND USE OUTDOORS AND SURVIVAL EQUIPMENT, SUPPLIES AND TECHNIQUES AT YOUR OWN RISK. Information posted on this forum is not reviewed for accuracy and may not be reliable, use at your own risk. Please review the full WARNING & DISCLAIMER about information on this site.