Equipped To Survive Equipped To Survive® Presents
The Survival Forum
Where do you want to go on ETS?

Page 2 of 3 < 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
#195727 - 02/12/10 03:30 AM Re: Notice what is happening in the knife world? [Re: big_al]
Art_in_FL Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/01/07
Posts: 2432
The good news is that in a whole lot of ways knives have improved. The average quality of the steel, mostly stainless steel now, and other materials is much better than it has ever been. The designs are as solid and functional as they ever have been. Prices are down and the level of utility delivered per dollar is up. Functional and effective knives are available for $10. For $60 or less you can get one that is as good as any in common use by our ancestors.

The down side is that as job specialization and assembly line industrialism have been applied ever more intensively fewer and fewer workers are employed making knives. Most employees know only their individual task. Fewer have any understanding of manufacturing a knife as a functional object. Expert knife smiths, ones that know it from the structure of iron up, are few and far between. And getting scarcer every year.

Ironically as the number of experts decreases the average quality goes up and prices go down. I don't think we are in danger of not knowing how to make knives. The device is pretty easy to understand and a minimally functional knife is quite easy to make. You don't need a great understanding or mastery of knife making to make a tool to skin a squirrel with. Hard pressed and without better options you could work with aluminum torn from a beer can or a piece of glass from a broken bottle. Our very distant relatives did it with less.

It is entirely possible to kill and prepare a chicken with bare hands alone. I have done it. It wasn't as clean and neat as using a knife but it can be done without any specialized talent or skill. IMHO it is good to do it once. Just to know you can. It makes a good demonstration. But not one for young children.

Top
#195759 - 02/12/10 03:53 PM Re: Notice what is happening in the knife world? [Re: Doug_Ritter]
Mark_F Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 06/24/09
Posts: 714
Loc: Kentucky
Originally Posted By: Doug_Ritter
While Buck moved a number of its lines overseas, in many cases offering the same models at different price points, one US made, one China-made, they have been moving the majority of that back to the U.S. this past year with a goal to move most of it back.


Blackjack did the same thing in the early 90s. Right before the company went under. I always wondered if the money they squandered moving operations overseas and back again had anything to do with that.

A lot of knife manufacturers have shifted production overseas for many reasons. Some (but certainly not all) are

1) No unions
2) Less or no benefits for employees
3) Cheaper labor (partly the result of points one and two)
4) Less environmental restrictions
5) Less taxes
6) Cheaper to manufacture (the result of all of the above)

Combine this with adequate quality control (CRKT took the lead in this) and you can produce a $200 knife with a $50-$75 price point. The quality control is the key. Without it you have just another crappy foreign-made over-priced piece of junk. FWIW and YMMV.
_________________________
Uh ... does anyone have a match?

Top
#195865 - 02/14/10 05:05 PM Re: Notice what is happening in the knife world? [Re: Mark_F]
HerbG Offline
Member

Registered: 02/12/07
Posts: 142
There is at least one American manufacturer left who does all their work in house, Bear Cutlery. Their plant is only a few miles away from where I live and they offer a full range of knives and multi tools:

http://www.bearandsoncutlery.com/

Top
#195866 - 02/14/10 06:14 PM Re: Notice what is happening in the knife world? [Re: HerbG]
pforeman Offline
Member

Registered: 04/23/08
Posts: 129
Loc: Iowa
Thanks for the info about Bear... the products look good and when I've got some money again, I'll be a customer!

I've got an old original A. G. Russell Sting from Springdale Ark. I picked up the "new" version by CRKT and it's a lot like my first one and the quality is very good too. Time (many years from now) will tell but so far I am happy with both.


Edited by pforeman (02/14/10 06:20 PM)

Top
#195902 - 02/15/10 11:22 AM Re: Notice what is happening in the knife world? [Re: HerbG]
Byrd_Huntr Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 01/28/10
Posts: 1174
Loc: MN, Land O' Lakes & Rivers ...
Originally Posted By: HerbG
There is at least one American manufacturer left who does all their work in house, Bear Cutlery. Their plant is only a few miles away from where I live and they offer a full range of knives and multi tools:

http://www.bearandsoncutlery.com/



I have several Bears in my collection. The quality/value was alway good, and I have noticed that the fit and finish is improving. My deer hunting knife is a Bear Power Grip with a part serrated gamehook blade. With it's tight flat leather sheath and rubberized grip, it doesn't rattle around in the stand. I slide two black 6" zip ties into the sheath and snap them and the paracord lanyard inside the retainer with the knife. It is just the right shape and size to field dress a deer quickly. The blades on all of mine are good quality and sharp out of the box. The Bear knives I have all came with excellent leather sheaths.
_________________________
The man got the powr but the byrd got the wyng

Top
#196317 - 02/22/10 03:17 AM Re: Notice what is happening in the knife world? [Re: benjammin]
Stu Offline
I am not a P.P.o.W.
Old Hand

Registered: 05/16/05
Posts: 1058
Loc: Finger Lakes of NY State
The majority of my knives come from Bark River Knives in Escanaba Mi. USA made semi-custom knives
_________________________
Our most important survival tool is our brain, and for many, that tool is way underused! SBRaider
Head Cat Herder

Top
#196362 - 02/22/10 05:28 PM Re: Notice what is happening in the knife world? [Re: Stu]
benjammin Offline
Rapscallion
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 4020
Loc: Anchorage AK
Bark River, another great knife manufacturer you won't see sold at Walmart or Target.
_________________________
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer, English Philosopher (1820-1903)

Top
#196366 - 02/22/10 06:01 PM Re: Notice what is happening in the knife world? [Re: big_al]
ILBob Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 02/05/10
Posts: 776
Loc: Northern IL
I no longer care much where something is made. There is often little discernible quality difference between stuff made in the USA and stuff made elsewhere.

To me if a $30 knife does everything I need it to do, I would be a fool to spend $300 on a knife that does the same things for me.

If the US wants to start making things again, that may turn out to be a good idea, but it would require a huge change in the political and social structure for that to happen. In keeping with the rules of the forum, I don't believe I can further comment on this particular issue.

I do hate to see long time manufacturers go belly up but that is the way things tend to go. There are very few organizations that have survived for as many as 50 years. Its normal for them to go away and new ones take their place.
_________________________
Warning - I am not an expert on anything having to do with this forum, but that won't stop me from saying what I think. smile

Bob

Top
#196729 - 02/27/10 04:39 PM Re: Notice what is happening in the knife world? [Re: ILBob]
jdavidboyd Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 12/20/06
Posts: 78
Loc: Hudson, FL
Originally Posted By: ILBob
...There is often little discernible quality difference between stuff made in the USA and stuff made elsewhere....



Whoa dude! Quick, duck!!!
_________________________
What's so funny 'bout peace, love, and understanding?

Top
#196733 - 02/27/10 04:56 PM Re: Notice what is happening in the knife world? [Re: jdavidboyd]
ILBob Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 02/05/10
Posts: 776
Loc: Northern IL
Originally Posted By: jdavidboyd
Originally Posted By: ILBob
...There is often little discernible quality difference between stuff made in the USA and stuff made elsewhere....



Whoa dude! Quick, duck!!!

Just the facts.

If you believe it is not possible to make a good quality product outside the USA, you are smoking something that is negatively affecting your judgment.

The overwhelming majority of electronic components (ICs, resistors, capacitors, etc.) are made offshore these days. And the quality of electronic products has never been higher. Most consumer electronics are made offshore as well, and those products are of very high quality, as are a lot of small appliances and tools.

The US market will not except pure junk, but there is no mass market for Cadillacs, and the offshore manufacturers know that. They go to a lot of trouble to make their products of a high enough quality that it more than meets the customers wishes.

If I want to buy pots made out of aluminum, that may well be of a "lower" quality than SS pots with copper bottoms, but if the aluminum pots meet my needs, how have I as the consumer been cheated? I have actually been well served by the manufacturer who made me what I wanted to buy at a price point I was willing to pay.

I am one of the guys that has helped the Chinese and the Mexicans make better products. A fair number of machines I have worked on ended up there. I have been there and seen the plants in action. I have also been in some US based plants that compete very effectively price wise against offshore plants. Its not impossible to do so. You just have to be down right good at what you are doing, and sadly, as a country, we lost the big edge we had in manufacturing long ago. We can't compete largely because we no longer want to compete, not because of some unfair advantage the Chinese have.
_________________________
Warning - I am not an expert on anything having to do with this forum, but that won't stop me from saying what I think. smile

Bob

Top
Page 2 of 3 < 1 2 3 >



Moderator:  Alan_Romania, Blast, chaosmagnet, cliff 
June
Su M Tu W Th F Sa
1
2 3 4 5 6 7 8
9 10 11 12 13 14 15
16 17 18 19 20 21 22
23 24 25 26 27 28 29
30
Who's Online
1 registered (Phaedrus), 235 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Mollerstrom, Louis, tomuchgear, salomoncrosk, Claire
5283 Registered Users
Newest Posts
The Best Thing Since Doug Ritter's PSP?
by Jeanette_Isabelle
01:09 AM
Cell phones & Other Electronics
by Russ
06/14/19 06:59 PM
Easy way to start a fire
by hikermor
06/13/19 02:54 AM
Thanks and Congrats, Doug!
by hikermor
06/12/19 05:10 PM
Go or Stay ? An interesting informal discussion
by Jeanette_Isabelle
06/12/19 04:30 PM
Earthh Shaking News
by Janysboy
06/12/19 02:29 AM
Basic Survival Skills that shouldn’t be complicate
by Phaedrus
06/10/19 06:14 AM
Death Cap Mushrooms
by WesleyH
06/09/19 01:17 PM
Newest Images
Tiny knife / wrench
Handmade knives
2"x2" Glass Signal Mirror, Retroreflective Mesh
Trade School Tool Kit
My Pocket Kit
Glossary
Test

WARNING & DISCLAIMER: SELECT AND USE OUTDOORS AND SURVIVAL EQUIPMENT, SUPPLIES AND TECHNIQUES AT YOUR OWN RISK. Information posted on this forum is not reviewed for accuracy and may not be reliable, use at your own risk. Please review the full WARNING & DISCLAIMER about information on this site.