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#195079 - 02/04/10 11:58 AM Re: Backpacking light--deodorant over knife & fire [Re: PureSurvival]
tomfaranda Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 02/14/08
Posts: 301
Loc: Croton on Hudson, NY
Pure survival, good posting. And you have a very interesting website.

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#195081 - 02/04/10 12:29 PM Re: Backpacking light--deodorant over knife & fire? [Re: Jared]
soli Offline
Stranger

Registered: 02/03/10
Posts: 5
Here's an interesting short blog post that tries to tread the balance of Being Prepared Not Equipped when going light. Essentially he is doing away with redundancy or overly engineered kit and ensuring he is aware of the surroundings/situations he is putting him self in.

I'm sure his advice won't be for everyone but for me it certainly puts a better slant on things than Mr Drury did.


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#195084 - 02/04/10 01:05 PM Re: Backpacking light--deodorant over knife & fire? [Re: soli]
jshannon Offline
Addict

Registered: 02/02/03
Posts: 647
Loc: North Texas
I disagree with some of what Drury has on his website and would not want him leading me or my friends/family on any trip.

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#195102 - 02/04/10 06:55 PM Re: Backpacking light--deodorant over knife & fire [Re: PureSurvival]
Susan Offline
Geezer

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 5163
Loc: W. WA
SOME are professionals, but very few, I suspect. Most are probably from the LSWWCGAW category {Let's See What We Can Get Away With).

How many ULs did you know before cell phones, SPOT and PLBs?

Sue

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#195110 - 02/04/10 08:28 PM Re: Backpacking light--deodorant over knife & fire [Re: Susan]
PureSurvival Offline
Member

Registered: 02/21/09
Posts: 149
Loc: UK
I knew many UL's before cell phones, Spot and PLB's.

In the UK much of our highland regions don't have mobile phone coverage. There are very few Spot's being used here and PLB's are only licensed to be used by sailors and pilots.

Communication Technology is not an argument for the increase in UL hikers. Material Technology has, as new lighter materials that provide advanced performance over older materials becomes increasingly available.

Modern synthetic materials work, this can be seen in mountain rescue statistics world wide that shown rescues of hypothermia cases are slowly dropping year on year.

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#195113 - 02/04/10 09:14 PM Re: Backpacking light--deodorant over knife & fire [Re: PureSurvival]
comms Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/23/08
Posts: 1502
Loc: Mesa, AZ
I think there is actually some things that UL'ers do well and have applied those tips to my own methodology which I admit leans much more to being prepared than not, so I automatically disqualify a UL rating.

That being said most UL'ers are not whack jobs. They make their own gear which I really like in some regards and rely heavily on their own sense of ability on the trail. The hypocrisy is that they survive only through a highly organized delivery service of friends and business along the trail. Nothing wrong with this at all, but its a completely different category of trail user than the typical backpacker.

The vast majority of backpackers invest in better constructed, higher quality, (yes heavier) gear that lasts much longer than 1 season and prefer taste, comfort, a heavier fixed blade knife, to distance.
_________________________
Don't just survive. Thrive.

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#195115 - 02/04/10 10:58 PM Re: Backpacking light--deodorant over knife & fire [Re: PureSurvival]
Susan Offline
Geezer

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 5163
Loc: W. WA
PureSurvival, I just noticed your location.

I'm across the pond in the Nation of No Responsibility.

Sue

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#195123 - 02/05/10 01:03 AM Re: Backpacking light--deodorant over knife & fire? [Re: Jared]
m9key Offline
Member

Registered: 05/28/03
Posts: 143
Loc: florida
ok to the suggester(backpackerlight),this list or loosely disorganized article however they want to call it.. knife seldom, flashlight seldom, hahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you got to be kidding me...ok one thing to add to the list common sense seldom...............sorry not trying to be harsh but for bpl to put that out there is foolish.......

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#195124 - 02/05/10 01:30 AM Re: Backpacking light--deodorant over knife & fire [Re: PureSurvival]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal


Originally Posted By: PureSurvival
There are plenty of cases of big wall climbers tied into a ledge for the night wearing their belay jacket, half length sleeping bag and a bothy bag.

I, too have tied into pro and settled down for a long night with my elephant's foot. Why in the world were they dragging along a superfluous bothy bag? (just kidding)

Do long distance runners carry a means to light fires and knives, no they don’t. I was a semi pro cyclist and cycled hundreds of miles a week in training alone did I or any other cyclists carry that kit. No. Nor do wild swimmers, orienteers, horse riders or most outdoor sports persons.

Unfortunately, you logic here seems to be -"This is what a lot of people do, therefore it is all right" - on that basis, we could all be smoking, eating at McDonald's regularly, and driving without seat belts while talking on our cell phones.

I carry a role of vet wrap, a wad of gauze pads and some tape.


this is very close to a description of what I typically carry in similar circumstances. I think we are wrestling with a semantic difficulty here. An FAK, in my usage, is not usually a large, elaborate, heavy thin packed in day glo colors. It is what is appropriate for the circumstances and training of its owner. It ideally incorporates other carried items, like a bandanna, and definitely includes some sort of shelter in nearly all circumstances - treatment for shock is almost always required.

If you go out by yourself, a first aid kit, other than for treating very basics injuries, is useless to you if the injury is too bad, shelter is more important than first aid.

Perfectly true, you can encounter a situation in which your FAK will be inadequate, like a 300 foot fall down a sheer cliff, decapitation, etc. There are also scores of situations where prompt first aid can substantially improve the outcome. Improvisation and creativity is a critical component of treatment in any wilderness setting.


There is no need to splint if you are going to get medical attention on seen because they are always going to want to replace your work with professional equipment.

Perhaps this is a difference in procedures between the UK and USA, but over here, I can't imagine replacing a properly applied splint just to put my gadget on the victim. I would check for peripheral circulation, and let it go, if it seemed to be working. Of course, I suspect this is rather hypothetical - I have never encountered a group that had attempted to apply a splint. Are you seriously suggesting that, having realized the likelihood of a fracture, you would sit passively by and wait for the rescue squad? In the western US, that could be a very long wait.

don’t tell me you live in a desert so hypothermia is not a problem.

A great deal of my outdoor experience has been in a desert environment. Just before I left Tucson, I reviewed the operations of our unit over the past twenty years or so (1965-1985). Falling was the number one cause of fatalities, followed closely by drowning and hypothermia. Deaths from hyperthermia were fairly rare. This situation may have changed now with the flood of immigration over the border.

It is a common misconception that Arizona is uniformly warm. I have personally recorded -30 F at Wupatki, just north of Flagstaff, a locality where -40F has been officially recorded, along with snow in every month of the year. Arizona has many mountain ranges, and any over 5,000 feet in elevation offer a lot of cold weather.

Arizona, though deficient in rainfall, is subject to torrential floods when it does rain. Some folks can't deal with floods very well. Our typical victim drove around barriers closing the road to enter into the flowing stream...

I have more than 20 years experience of the outdoors and survival and my kit is proportionate to the trip I am doing. I agree that the novice just starting out should take more precautions in kit than the more experienced


I agree heartily with you on these points. My SAR experience spans about thirty five years (some 400 plus operations) and my total outdoor experience dates back to 1956, when I was fortunate enough to leave the mid west and arrive in Arizona and the Western US.

I think we agree on a lot of major points, but if we are ever out together, should I fall and break a leg, please, please apply a splint,,,,,, even if it is a saguaro cactus, fastened with a handy rattlesnake.


_________________________
Geezer in Chief

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#195147 - 02/05/10 03:21 PM Re: Backpacking light--deodorant over knife & fire [Re: hikermor]
PureSurvival Offline
Member

Registered: 02/21/09
Posts: 149
Loc: UK



Sorry hikermor your not mission critical so you can look after yourself wink

My coment about the desert was not so much that they get cold. Desert is not defined by temperature but lack of precipitation. As you state Arizona has elevation which means cold. I have been cold at one time or other in none elevated deserts of Africa, Australia and the Middle East. My point is, even in hot weather, a casualty with major trauma can succumb to hypothermia through conduction to the ground. Major burn cases often succumb to hypothermia through convection because water is evaporating from the dressings.

Quote:
this is very close to a description of what I typically carry in similar circumstances. I think we are wrestling with a semantic difficulty here. An FAK, in my usage, is not usually a large, elaborate, heavy thin packed in day glo colors. It is what is appropriate for the circumstances and training of its owner. It ideally incorporates other carried items, like a bandanna, and definitely includes some sort of shelter in nearly all circumstances - treatment for shock is almost always required.


I agree but reading many posts on this forum of peoples FAK's. It seems common that people make them way to elaborate. It amazes me how many people on the internet have more elaborate FAK's than my war fighting medic kit yet don't have any aid training at all.

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