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#187294 - 11/03/09 03:15 PM Re: Dogs: the proper response? [Re: Pete]
Blast Offline
INTERCEPTOR
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 07/15/02
Posts: 3561
Loc: Spring, Texas
Quote:
As far as shooting the dogs goes ... I'm not sure if your vegans would have cringed or cheered. How do you know that they would not have broken into applause.


It would have been interesting to see their response, especially after one commented on the NRA sticker on my truck.

-Blast
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#187295 - 11/03/09 03:16 PM Re: Dogs: the proper response? [Re: Dagny]
7point82 Offline
Addict

Registered: 11/24/05
Posts: 478
Loc: Oklahoma
I think everyone hit the high points. Which were (IMO)...
1) Good job! You seem to have stopped the dogs actions from escalating and had a plan if things had gotten worse.
2) Pepper/bear spray would have been a nice option to have.
3) Next time call the law. The next person that the object of the dogs attention might not fair as well.
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"There is not a man of us who does not at times need a helping hand to be stretched out to him, and then shame upon him who will not stretch out the helping hand to his brother." -Theodore Roosevelt

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#187296 - 11/03/09 03:18 PM Re: Dogs: the proper response? [Re: Blast]
TeacherRO Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 2396
Blast,

Well done. I'd add pepper spray to your hiking kit and call it in to the non-emergency number to report it afterwards (and to the good folks in charge of the park.)

T

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#187297 - 11/03/09 03:24 PM Re: Dogs: the proper response? [Re: TeacherRO]
JBMat Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 745
Loc: NC
While what you did was appropriate for the conditions...

Did you get the owner's name and/or report her to the 'proper authorities".

In the world of what if's - what if a child had been the target of their attack? Seems to me this woman hasn't clue 1 that her dogs are basically 4 legged weapons.

Good thing you had your staff with you. Like the others, I say add pepper spray.

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#187300 - 11/03/09 03:27 PM Re: Dogs: the proper response? [Re: TeacherRO]
Compugeek Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 08/09/09
Posts: 392
Loc: San Diego, CA
Kudos from me too.

You also demonstrated for your entire class a good response to that situation.

If the NRA comment was non-supportive, you further demonstrated responsible behavior.

And add my vote to the "report it, even this late", even if it's only to get it on the record.

Good job!
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#187306 - 11/03/09 04:26 PM Re: Dogs: the proper response? [Re: Compugeek]
Paul810 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/02/03
Posts: 1428
Loc: NJ, USA
The police "Use of Force Continuum" is pretty much what I think of when it comes to how I should handle a dangerous person or animal. It goes something like this:

1. Physical/Verbal Presence (look and sound tough)
2. Light hand-to-hand techniques (blocking, arm locks, pushing ect)
3. Mace/Pepper Spray/other Less than Lethal
4. Heavy hand-to-hand (punches/kicks)
5. Baton
6. Threat of deadly force
7. Deadly force

It's not perfectly adapted; for example, as a citizen I avoid the hand-to-hand stuff whenever possible, instead preferring the methods that allow me to keep my distance and escape. But, the basic idea is there. If it came to aggressive dogs I would do the following:

1. Aggressive stance and yelling
-if that doesn't work-
2. Pepper Spray them and try to get away
-if that doesn't work-
3. Hit them hard with stick/baton/whatever
-if that doesn't work-
4. Shoot if armed and I feel it's necessary to keep them from attacking

With that said, if I see an aggressive dog latched on to a child's arm or something it's getting a kick to the head and a couple rounds of hot lead. There's no reason to waste time at that point.

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#187313 - 11/03/09 06:17 PM Re: Dogs: the proper response? [Re: Paul810]
Kukulkan Offline
Stranger

Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 24
Loc: Los Angeles
Query: What were your students doing while you were playing wack-a-rott? It sounds like nothing.

Consider that two rottweilers likely are more than a match for you and a stick, and that once one of them has latched onto you (or someone else) it might be too late to escalate to a firearm.

Given these considerations, I'd suggest that in the unlikely event the situation repeats itself, you should consider asking the students to arm themselves with anything available and to come to your assistance. The dogs were being given the impression that that they were facing only one threat. You and four students are more than a match for two rottweilers and the dogs would recognize that fact as soon as four or five people started yelling and waiving sticks at them.

By the way, my suggestion is not meant as a criticism . . . I think you handled the situation very well. I just don't believe that people can be categorized either as sheepdogs or sheep. Almost all of us have some sheepdog.

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#187315 - 11/03/09 06:49 PM Re: Dogs: the proper response? [Re: RoverOver]
GauchoViejo Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 03/06/08
Posts: 94
Loc: Argentina
I hear you Rover! Once I had to defend myself from 3 feral dogs. I had my big knife and that saved my bacon, I broke the spine of the leader and the other two run away. One thing that chilled my blood was that none of them barked, not even once. They just came at me at full speed. I was wearing high boots (because of the snakes) and I had rolled my jacket around my left arm, so I was unharmed.

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#187320 - 11/03/09 07:31 PM Re: Dogs: the proper response? [Re: NightHiker]
HerbG Offline
Member

Registered: 02/12/07
Posts: 142
Can anybody share any personal experiences about the effectiveness of pepper sprays on large aggressive dogs? Does it really halt an attack in its tracks or is there a lag time?

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#187322 - 11/03/09 07:34 PM Re: Dogs: the proper response? [Re: NightHiker]
Henry_Porter Offline
Member

Registered: 03/24/07
Posts: 111
Possibly...

1. Shoot dog(s) as needed.
1a. No worries, vegans, you don't have to eat or wear them.

2. Pepper spray dog owner as needed.

Seriously...

I can't understand folks who don't take responsibility for their animals and are seemingly oblivious to the dangers and trouble they impose upon others.

I'd say you did very well, Blast.

Thank you for sharing your experience and thoughts. Reminds me to take at least a good stick with me in the woods this weekend.

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