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#180525 - 08/26/09 06:22 PM Re: Film-Maker Airlifted Dying of Starvation [Re: GauchoViejo]
Leigh_Ratcliffe Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/06
Posts: 1355
Loc: United Kingdom.
Originally Posted By: GauchoViejo
I checked your site which is chock full of praise for the "daring explorer". Anybody that goes into the North American woods carrying a riot shotgun is not an expert in my book.


A shotgun is not necessarily a bad choice of tool. Ruggedized riot guns do have the advantage of being tough.

However, you do need to pay attention to your loads. Personally I would carry mostly birdshot for taking small game and birds on the wing, with a few rounds of heavier shot (goose shot)for taking slightly bigger game and a few solid slugs for Deer and self defence against Bears and Humans etc.

Probably load the magazine as 1 birdshot, 1 goose shot and then solid slugs.

Personally I would have taken one look at the porcupine and then shot it.

Dinner.

Yum, yum.
_________________________
I don't do dumb & helpless.

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#180530 - 08/26/09 06:45 PM Re: Film-Maker Airlifted Dying of Starvation [Re: ]
Colourful Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 11/14/07
Posts: 87
Loc: Yukon
He was lucky the Yukon had unusually warm and dry weather at that time. No frost & few bugs helped, I'm sure.

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#180533 - 08/26/09 06:53 PM Re: Film-Maker Airlifted Dying of Starvation [Re: ]
Tom_L Offline
Addict

Registered: 03/19/07
Posts: 690
Quote:
I got respect for anyone who can go into the wild alone even if they're not properly equipped. He didn't even have a PLB. He had a spot. Granted he reported in every few hours and they did routine fly overs..but still.


With all due respect, venturing alone and unprepared into the great unknown does not only show a measure of courage but also some incredible lack or judgment, a.k.a. stupidity.

Sometimes "tough is enough" but as far as most things in life, you really need a bit more than that IMHO. Outdoor survival is just common sense. That guy went into the wild armed to the teeth with semi-useless gear and called it adventure. But people have survived in the far North with far less for ages. Not just survived but lived with their families, you could say they even prospered as far as reasonably possible in such desolate environment. But they didn't make a big thing out of it. They didn't even call it survival or adventure. It was just everyday life.

I normally wouldn't comment on a TV show but I'm getting sick and tired of pseudo serious survival reality programs which are in effect plain old exploitation.

What's more, the audience watching those shows get all the wrong messages. They fall for the hype, the drama and lacking any first-hand experience they can't tell it's all either fake or very much dumb. Where is it going to end? What's going to be THE ultimate survival reality thing? Watching the host die on screen, close up and all? Do you really want to support that kind of TV?

IMO what a good survival show really ought to do apart from teaching some useful skills - ingrain some healthy respect for nature, survival skills and the people who devised them to live even in some very harsh environments. That's one reason why I like Ray Mears - his calm, respectful approach is so refreshing and I always pick up some useful bits of knowledge in the end.

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#180534 - 08/26/09 07:05 PM Re: Film-Maker Airlifted Dying of Starvation [Re: Tom_L]
Am_Fear_Liath_Mor Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 3078

Looks like the Yukon Camping holiday didn't work out too well then, but the Alaska Wilderness Survival Starvation Television Show looks like a sure fired commercial success. grin


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#180553 - 08/27/09 12:28 AM Re: Film-Maker Airlifted Dying of Starvation [Re: ]
NobodySpecial Offline
Member

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 197
Personally I never venture into the woods of western canada without a reservation -
http://www.grousemountain.com/Winter/dining/the-observatory/

although I suppose a shotgun might work !

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#180561 - 08/27/09 12:54 AM Re: Film-Maker Airlifted Dying of Starvation [Re: Leigh_Ratcliffe]
GauchoViejo Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 03/06/08
Posts: 94
Loc: Argentina
I guess it depends on where you are lost. Down here you get two choices
a)subtropical forest: I carry a Winchester .44-40 with hot handloads (I've fired hundreds of this rounds, so I know what they do) and home made shotshells with #7 shot. I've tried this setup and it works for me.
b)Andes foothills. FN .30-06 and .22 Colt Woodsman

So you could manage with a shotgun for a), but you would starve in b)

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#180567 - 08/27/09 02:28 AM Re: Film-Maker Airlifted Dying of Starvation [Re: GauchoViejo]
Todd W Offline
Product Tester
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/14/04
Posts: 1928
Loc: Mountains of CA
If a 30-06 is fine in B then so would a shotgun with slugs.

A shotgun is probably the most versatile firearm ever made.

You can take anything from birds to bears, re-load it fast, hold 7-9 rounds and normally they can take a beating and keep on working too.

A 30-06 while fine for big game would never let you take a bird or a rabbit for that matter... at least not with any meat left worth eating.

It's hard to tell from the picture as I haven't seen the show but it looks like an 870 to me. I have an 870 and love it. For in the woods for protection, and general hunting I would go with an 870 20" barrel and mag extension. Smooth barrel, with shot ranging from 00 to bird, slug and a handful of hard cast slugs. Load the mag minus one and at any time you can make your second shot or pump out the first and make your first shot whatever you want.

If we are talking only protection in grizzly country then minimum 44mag... this guy went into the woods to "live". Look at people in the olden days who were on horses and lived in the woods they had pistols on themselves a rifle on their horse and sometimes a shotgun. He wasn't in my opinion over loaded, but he sure as heck didn't need all those things to "survive".

Bear country warrants a pistol of some sort, and for food gathering a .22LR is good. Add a shotgun and you can take down big game at further distances EASIER than your pistol or birds (not that you can't take a bird with a 22 though.)

Anyway... I can see how he thought he'd wanted all those fire arms they are all useful for different tasks but crossover a lot too wink

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Self Sufficient Home - Our journey to self sufficiency.

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#180572 - 08/27/09 03:33 AM Re: Film-Maker Airlifted Dying of Starvation [Re: ]
scafool Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 12/18/08
Posts: 1534
Loc: Muskoka
Normally the people who live there take a .22 rifle as a survival gun.The main reason is because the shells are so light. You can carry an awful lot of .22 caliber shells in a pocket.

Pistols are not allowed for hunting in Canada and even if they were allowed they are so much less effective than a rifle that no one would take them into the woods with them. They are just dead weight.

Shotguns are usually not counted as a survival gun because of the weight of the shells too.

Survival strategy usually focuses on smaller animals and involves techniques which we would consider poaching.


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May set off to explore without any sense of direction or how to return.

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#180573 - 08/27/09 04:45 AM Re: Film-Maker Airlifted Dying of Starvation [Re: scafool]
Todd W Offline
Product Tester
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/14/04
Posts: 1928
Loc: Mountains of CA
Originally Posted By: scafool
Normally the people who live there take a .22 rifle as a survival gun.The main reason is because the shells are so light. You can carry an awful lot of .22 caliber shells in a pocket.

Pistols are not allowed for hunting in Canada and even if they were allowed they are so much less effective than a rifle that no one would take them into the woods with them. They are just dead weight.

Shotguns are usually not counted as a survival gun because of the weight of the shells too.

Survival strategy usually focuses on smaller animals and involves techniques which we would consider poaching.




I was using the term survival in the sense of protecting one self from grizzly, polar bear, charging moose, etc. Not in the sense of using it to survive as a source to bring food to the table.

RE: Pistols... they are fine hunting weapons in skilled hands, and are used for such in the USA. Again, I was referring to pistol as survival as protecting one self and not putting food on the table.

Also, I am not aware of where he went as I didn't read into his story nor do I get TV service. So I am not sure if he needs protection from such animals, but going into the woods alone I would chose a pistol if I was hiking wink And others depending if I had a base camp etc.

Can you own a handgun in Canada?
The website is confusing because it says certain calibers are prohibited, and then the ones not listed to be prohibited are restricted. Does restricted mean you can't own it at all?? It's written clear you can't own one with a barrel under 4.14" or .32 or .25... the rest are just "restricted".

_________________________
Self Sufficient Home - Our journey to self sufficiency.

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#180576 - 08/27/09 05:55 AM Re: Film-Maker Airlifted Dying of Starvation [Re: ]
Tom_L Offline
Addict

Registered: 03/19/07
Posts: 690
Quote:
PS: I have a posting I'll be doing in the future about Ed's show. As much as I said I respect him, I will make it clear that he did quite a few things wrong. What you had to say certainly will aid with writing that post. If you don't mind me using it, that is.


Well sure.

And for one thing, I hope I haven't come across too harshly. I certainly don't wish anyone ill and I'm glad that Mr Wardle made it back safely. Hopefully the moral of the story will not be overlooked. Maybe the somewhat anticlimactic ending of the show will lead the audience to honestly reflect on the realities of wilderness survival.

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