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#162229 - 01/10/09 03:22 AM How do I become more assertive person ?
picard120 Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 07/10/05
Posts: 763
How do I become more assertive person ?

I tend to be shy hence it hurts my career in long term.

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#162233 - 01/10/09 03:41 AM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: picard120]
OldBaldGuy Offline
Geezer

Registered: 09/30/01
Posts: 5695
Loc: Former AFB in CA, recouping fr...
Mine came from age and experience. Not knowing a thing about you, I am sorry to say that I can't help you much...
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OBG

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#162234 - 01/10/09 03:43 AM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: OldBaldGuy]
Desperado Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/01/08
Posts: 1530
Loc: DFW, Texas
Whew, tough subject. Just try to do better than I do. I usually make an horses posterior out of myself if not careful.
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I do the things that I must, and really regret, are unfortunately necessary.

RIP OBG

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#162238 - 01/10/09 03:52 AM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: Desperado]
scafool Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 12/18/08
Posts: 1534
Loc: Muskoka
What is assertive?

What it means to me is just speaking up clearly about what you want to without trying to run over everybody.

Now as a construction worker type person I will tell you that sometimes you have to yell at people to get their attention, and sometimes it is best to take them off to one side and talk easy to them.
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May set off to explore without any sense of direction or how to return.

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#162256 - 01/10/09 04:56 AM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: picard120]
wildman800 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 2846
Loc: La-USA
Believe it or not, watching episodes of Star Trek: The Next Generation, Star Trek: Voyager, and Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, gave me some very important Leadership Techniques.

Those shows demonstrate many of the times, places, and ways to apply those techniques. There are several examples of bad leadership that are just as valuable as the good leadership examples.

These shows are enactments of actual leadership theory.

my $0.02 worth.
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QMC, USCG (Ret)
The best luck is what you make yourself!

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#162276 - 01/10/09 09:26 AM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: wildman800]
Tom_L Offline
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Registered: 03/19/07
Posts: 690
I thought Leadership Secrets of the Rogue Warrior by Richard Marcinko (the famous Navy SEAL guy) was a really good read though certainly not very PC.

IMO, leadership is a matter of personal charisma, integrity and competence. Some people tend to be very aggressive, backstabbing their way through the ranks to get promoted and enjoy their moment of fame. Sometimes they prevail over more competent but honest, quiet individuals. However, that does not really make them assertive or successful in the long run because anyone worth their salt will see through them easily. Aggressive self-promotion is simply no substitute for real leadership.

As Marcinko points out better than I ever could, you cannot be a good leader or a confident person (the two are basically the same) unless you believe in yourself and work with 110% intensity to achieve your goals, be it education, career or anything else in life. By doing so you will automatically improve your self-esteem. Truly assertive people (assertive in the good sense) always lead from the front. They inspire others by doing, not saying. That's why all the motivational talk so popular these days will be to little avail unless you back it with real action.

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#162281 - 01/10/09 11:17 AM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: Tom_L]
Rodion Offline
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Registered: 04/29/08
Posts: 285
Loc: Israel
Customer service.
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#162285 - 01/10/09 01:17 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: picard120]
Blast Offline
INTERCEPTOR
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 07/15/02
Posts: 3760
Loc: TX
Steroids?

-Blast
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#162286 - 01/10/09 02:02 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: Rodion]
Art_in_FL Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/01/07
Posts: 2432
Assertiveness is usually too simple a goal to be effective. Shy people typically go from resentful silence to nags or whiners in one step and then get frustrated when they meet resistance or get ignored.

The key is to speak up pretty close to when you first think you should. Holding back leads to coming on too strong and or over thinking of what you want to say. When you do speak say what you think one time, phrasing it as a question is good, and then leave it be.

Unfortunately being shy means feeling your under represented and ending up repeating yourself because it feels right. What gets missed is that every repetition weakens the message, causes resentment and makes you look weak.

People are creatures of habit so if people around you are used to your being passive your going to have to give them time to notice that what you say is worth listening to. Say something meaningful, make your point quickly and simply, and then let it go. Don't worry about being heard. Just practice speaking when you think of it in a natural manner.

Next time do the same thing. Wash, rinse, repeat. Over time people will notice. When they do you can then engage by asking a question. Don't overdo it. Don't repeat yourself needlessly. Don't whine. Slowly build credibility. It takes time for them to get used to listening to you and it takes time for you to calibrate what and how you want to communicate.

The other aspect seen with shy people is that often they are so worried about being heard and working on what they want to say they really don't listen. Possibly the first thing about communicating is having something to say. The easiest way to have something to say is to listen closely, ask questions, feed what people say back to them. Sounds silly but it works and can be the equivalent of conversational training wheels. People love it. It shows your paying attention. It also gets your foot in the door in a conversation.

Shy people have things to say. The problem is how to say it to people who are used to not listening to them without making it a drama. How to get heard without dominating the conversation or getting ignored.

It is an art. An art that nobody gets right all the time. Don't try for perfection. Make mistakes and laugh at yourself. Don't take yourself too seriously. Relax.

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#162302 - 01/10/09 05:18 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: Blast]
ironraven Offline
Cranky Geek
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 4642
Loc: Vermont
No, not roids, geez Blast.

I have a friend who was very shy. Then we got him into ren faires, fencing, and archery. That got him into doing tech work for a local theatre group. Then being a make uped and costumed wandering creepy thing in the parking lot for the halloween show, and moving on from there.

The thing about theatre, ren faires and fencing. They have women. Many of them single. The only danger is the one I face- in the renisance the ones who are interested me were legal. This is not the 15th century.

EDIT: Plan B.

Go back to school, gain knowledge.
Knowledge is power.
Evil is power.
Study hard, become evil.
Become Bond-villan evil.
Have you seen the kind entourage they get?


Edited by ironraven (01/10/09 05:21 PM)
Edit Reason: plan b
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When a man dare not speak without malice for fear of giving insult, that is when truth starts to die. Truth is the truest freedom.

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#162303 - 01/10/09 05:21 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: Art_in_FL]
oldsoldier Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 11/25/06
Posts: 742
Loc: MA
I have always been an assertive person, so, I cannot speak from the other side. I think its something that is in you; kinda like being a good singer, a talented artist, or something along those lines. Some people have that natural magnetic personality, are natural leaders, and some arent. But, I think being assertive, and being a leader, CAN be mutually exclusive; you dont have to be one, to be the other. A leader can recognize strengths and weaknesses in others, and employ those to the benefit of all, fr instance. Assertiveness is a little different, in that, essentially, you are strong willed. A good leader CAN posess this trait, but doesnt necessarily have to. Hope this all makes some sort of sense!
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#162309 - 01/10/09 05:47 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: oldsoldier]
MDinana Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/08/07
Posts: 2208
Loc: Beer&Cheese country
There's a difference between leading, and being assertive. By being assertive, am I to assume you mean that you would like to be more "asserting" (def: to state or declare positively and often forcefully or aggressively)

In other words, you want to speak up more often?

Step 1: think of relevant comment
Step 2: open mouth
Step 3: say thought from step 1

Really, it comes down to just taking action. Kind of like going to the gym, or asking a girl out: eventually you have to man-up and just do it. So what if you're wrong, or right? If you're wrong, as long as you're not totally off-topic, it shows you're at least paying attention and thinking. If you're right, it gets noticed.

The big thing is learning when and when not to back down. lots of blowhards like to pontificate upon themselves. If it's the boss, fine let him. If it's a coworker, if he's looking like an idiot, let him. If someone is stealing your words and trying to claim credit, I wouldn't back down. Usually something that points out his rudeness works well, such as, "I'm sorry, was I finished?" Or "I thought I was speaking, but apparently I was wrong." And sometimes, a short but rude "I'm not done" works well. Point to the interrupter at the same time.


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#162325 - 01/10/09 06:52 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: Tom_L]
OldBaldGuy Offline
Geezer

Registered: 09/30/01
Posts: 5695
Loc: Former AFB in CA, recouping fr...
"...Rogue Warrior...not very PC..."

That is for sure! smile smile smile
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OBG

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#162333 - 01/10/09 08:41 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: ]
Dan_McI Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 12/10/07
Posts: 844
Loc: NYC
You really don't learn things by someone telling you how, especially when it is something like this. IMO, this is something you learn by doing it a little and with practice improving.

I also think a lack of assertiveness is often a lack of confidence and/or not wanting to offend others. It's been my experience that the less I worry about whether someone likes me or not, them more people seem to do so.

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#162336 - 01/10/09 08:51 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: ]
NAro Offline
Addict

Registered: 03/15/01
Posts: 517
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0915166127/thepsychologyinf

Assertiveness, as taught by counselors and Psychologists, typically has nothing to do with getting your way.. or "winning." It is about clear expression of your feelings and wishes. The Alberti and Emmons book has been around in various editions for many years and is still the "gold standard" if you want to teach yourself.

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#162337 - 01/10/09 09:19 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: picard120]
OldBaldGuy Offline
Geezer

Registered: 09/30/01
Posts: 5695
Loc: Former AFB in CA, recouping fr...
Something I suggested to my son, long ago, was to take a public speaking type class at your local college or junior college, or whatever you have where you live. If one class doesn't do it for you, take it again, and again, and again. Might help, can't hurt.

ps, my son ignored me, so he still has a problem with "assertiveness"...
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#162346 - 01/10/09 10:16 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: OldBaldGuy]
Dagny Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 1918
Loc: Washington, DC
I'm impressed that you posted this question. That took guts. Lacking context for your question, I'll venture out on a limb:

If you don't advocate for yourself and your informed opinions then others will get the opportunities, raise, promotion and recognition you deserve. Sort of the snooze-you lose scenario.

The times I've pushed back when I thought I deserved a promotion, higher salary or bonus, I've never had a boss begrudge me for making the case for myself. Sometimes I was convincing, sometimes not. You have to be a professional about it. At the least, you'll put yourself on their radar for next time and hopefully get useful feedback on your performance.

As a boss, I've never begrudged anyone who made a reasoned case for themselves. Sometimes they prevailed, sometimes not. Some considered chutzpa is admirable as a leadership trait.

Asserting in meetings depends on the players -- whether the participants are all peers or if there is hierarchy present. In any event, listening (not just hearing, but really concentrating on listening) is a critical skill so you can guage when to assert an opinion or pose a strategic question.

I heartily second OldBaldGuy's recommendation on speech class. Public speaking is among the most terrifying prospects for most people. If you can gain confidence in addressing a large audience, small ones such as you'll find in meetings should become easier.

Good luck. If this is career-related, I'd Google a lot and see what guidance comes up.

Knowing that you need to be assertive is at least half the battle. Some folks never figure the first part out.



Edited by Dagny (01/10/09 10:20 PM)

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#162349 - 01/10/09 10:41 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: picard120]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5357
Loc: SOCAL
A first step is to know that you are right; thinking you're right isn't enough, you gotta be certain. Then when you make your case you can do so with confidence.

Do you play poker?
_________________________
Better is the Enemy of Good Enough.
Okay, what’s your point??

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#162350 - 01/10/09 10:44 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: OldBaldGuy]
MedB Offline
Member

Registered: 10/08/05
Posts: 108
Picard,

First off, kudos on coming here and asking the question. It's often not easy to to that.

Many here have already hit upon some great suggestions. And this is one of those subjects that have lots of paths to success. But my experience training leaders over the years has crystalized a few thoughts you might find helpful...

#1 - Assertiveness is a habit. That means it can be learned just like shyness was. That's important to remember.

#2 - Like all habits, repetition is key. At times it will be uncomfortable. Be prepared for that and accept it. You are learning a new way to act so by definition you are out of your comfort zone.

#3 - Start by helping people. This may sound counter-intuitive at first until you understand it. Instead of starting out by asking for things for yourself, many people find it easier to start being assertive by doing for others. Go into a meeting/situation looking for who you can help. Who's situation can you improve? Which person at the table can you make more successful? Who can you help win? By helping others win, you will find that you most often get what you need. Or at the very least, it will give you the "right" {in your own mind} to ask for what you need.

#4 - Continue the win-win strategy by offering options that YOU shape. Asking yes/no questions can be scary at first. That fear of rejection or closing down the options can paralyze people. Instead, craft options that are win-win in nature. You will find it much easier to be assertive. For example... instead of asking the boss additional resources (yes/no), craft options YOU can live that help HIM/HER win. "Mr Bossperson, I know there is always a lot of pressure to get the monthly report published. And it's a visible project. There are a couple of options that might help. We could either move submission deadline up to Tuesday or maybe publish via website instead of paper. Which of those do you think would work better?"

The key for #4 is the format. State issue and how you are helping that person. Offer two options that will work and you are comfortable with. Leave the decision to them. This format leaves "authority" with the other person, but you are in fact the one driving the solution. It preserves egos and is easy to do.

I hope this helps and good luck. And if you are interested in discussing more of this, send me a PM.
_________________________
MedB

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#162372 - 01/11/09 02:15 AM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: MedB]
benjammin Offline
Rapscallion
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 4020
Loc: Anchorage AK
Find something you have mastered, something you are really good at and that is generally interesting. See if there's a place you can offer to teach your skills to someone else. It will be uncomfortable at first, but if you prepare yourself and the material well, you will find that you can speak from a position of authority, and this will build your self confidence. When you discover how to hold people's attention, you will learn a new skill, and you will be able to speak more confidently in other, less comfortable conditions.
_________________________
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer, English Philosopher (1820-1903)

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#162441 - 01/11/09 06:13 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: benjammin]
DannyL Offline
Member

Registered: 02/22/08
Posts: 103
Loc: SE Alaska
First off, learn the difference between being assertive and being arrogant.

Master that, and the rest just comes from experience.

(ben, I was not directing this post at you, but at the original OP. )


Edited by DannyL (01/11/09 06:15 PM)

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#162600 - 01/12/09 02:29 PM Re: How do I become more assertive person ? [Re: DannyL]
benjammin Offline
Rapscallion
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 4020
Loc: Anchorage AK
No worries, and it's not the first time I might've been referred to as arrogant. I am definitely intimidating, especially at meetings. People say I have the demeanor of Darth Vader unless I make a conscious effort to be overly sedate.

At 6'5" and 270 lbs, I can see where they might get that idea. Did I also mention I have a booming Bass voice as well?

What really gets them is when I start making sounds like I am breathing through a mask. LOL
_________________________
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer, English Philosopher (1820-1903)

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