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#149947 - 09/23/08 05:46 PM Re: Digital TV [Re: comms]
Lizzie Offline
Stranger

Registered: 09/22/08
Posts: 2
Originally Posted By: comms
I am soooooo sick of this information campaign. This may make me unpopular but I don't think the gov't should be subsidizing this turnover. If someone hasn't bought a new tv in the last 10-15 years that is digital ready or have a cable converter, its not the taxpayers responsibility to fund a tv for them.



If you think that is an unpopular opinion, wait until you hear mine. I am soooooo sick of having this changeover to all digital broadcasting shoved down my throat. I cringe at the thought of all the analog televisions becoming obsolete without a STB to convert the signal. I recognize I'm in the minority, as I really don't care about high-quality, surround sound, HDTV, gigantic TVs. I just want a small TV that will work when I turn it on and give me the information I need/want at the time or, occasionally, some entertainment.

For the last year I have tried to investigate what would be the simplest way to accomplish the changeover in our own household. Most of the information I've received, even from our local cable company, has been so ambiguous that I refuse to buy ANYTHING until the answers to my questions become more clear. If that means that we end up without a functioning TV for a while, so be it. We've survived without television in the past and could certainly do so again. Frankly, I've checked out what's available for purchase now, and nothing is compelling enough to get me to part with my hard earned money.

I am especially unhappy about the nonexistence of a simple, reliable portable battery-operated TV to use in case of an extended emergency/power outage. Currently, we have a very small black-and-white analog TV that operates on DD batteries. I pull it out during extended power outages and have NEVER had a set of batteries fail to last the entire length of the power outage. I find that access to information both helpful and (I'll admit) comforting. I've looked at the portable digital TVs, and there is nothing out there that will run on just regular batteries. There are a few that have built-in batteries that must be recharged by plugging into the electrical outlet for a period of time. After recharging, it appears that the TV will broadcast for a little over an hour before needing to be recharged again. Some can be recharged with an additional adapter that you plug into your cigarette lighter, but I don't see myself doing that. So, I can pay 4 or 5 times as much money for a TV that will run for a little over an hour, to replace my current setup that lasts days/weeks and provides valuable information. No thanks. I'm not sure why this is true. Is it impossible to make a digital TV that would run off of regular batteries (i.e., DD batteries)? Does a digital tuner take so much more power that there is no way to replicate what a portable analog TV can do?

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#149950 - 09/23/08 06:09 PM Re: Digital TV [Re: Lizzie]
Yuccahead Offline
Member

Registered: 07/24/08
Posts: 199
Loc: W. Texas
Welcome and I think you raise some great questions.

I can't tell if you have cable or not but if you do, your old TV should work just fine -- while the power is on.

When the power is out, your battery powered TV may also work if it's hooked up to to cable. But it may not. It will depend on the scope of the outage and your cable set-up. A battery powered radio as a back-up for the TV is certainly worth considering if you don't have one already.

In the event of a extended outage as a work-around -- this may get a bit convoluted -- you could get a converter box and power it using:(1)a small generator, or (2) an inverter hooked up to your car. I'm sure others here will have even better ideas.

For Digital TVs, prices will continue to come down and the variety of offerings will continue to go up so sitting on your hands for a while may bring the solution you are looking for -- though that is hardly a good solution for you.
_________________________
-- David.

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#149952 - 09/23/08 06:23 PM Re: Digital TV [Re: Lizzie]
nurit Offline
Member

Registered: 03/27/08
Posts: 191
Loc: NYC
Welcome to the forum, Lizzie.

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#149954 - 09/23/08 07:46 PM Re: Digital TV [Re: Lizzie]
Grouch Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 07/02/08
Posts: 395
Loc: Ohio
Welcome to the board, Lizzie.

I'm also lamenting the impending loss of my small, battery powered TV (2-3 inch screen) and have found the current digital options very lacking. I hope the offerings will soon include something simple, affordable and adequate for use during a power outage.

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#149955 - 09/23/08 08:01 PM Re: Digital TV [Re: Lizzie]
Am_Fear_Liath_Mor Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 3078
Hi Lizzie,

Quote:
I am especially unhappy about the nonexistence of a simple, reliable portable battery-operated TV to use in case of an extended emergency/power outage. Currently, we have a very small black-and-white analog TV that operates on DD batteries. I pull it out during extended power outages and have NEVER had a set of batteries fail to last the entire length of the power outage. I find that access to information both helpful and (I'll admit) comforting. I've looked at the portable digital TVs, and there is nothing out there that will run on just regular batteries. There are a few that have built-in batteries that must be recharged by plugging into the electrical outlet for a period of time. After recharging, it appears that the TV will broadcast for a little over an hour before needing to be recharged again. Some can be recharged with an additional adapter that you plug into your cigarette lighter, but I don't see myself doing that. So, I can pay 4 or 5 times as much money for a TV that will run for a little over an hour, to replace my current setup that lasts days/weeks and provides valuable information. No thanks. I'm not sure why this is true. Is it impossible to make a digital TV that would run off of regular batteries (i.e., DD batteries)? Does a digital tuner take so much more power that there is no way to replicate what a portable analog TV can do?


For some reason there does appear to be a shortage of portable ATSC capable battery powered portable TV designs available. Looking on Amazon I was only able to find these ones, which seemed to be the business.

http://www.amazon.com/Haier-HLT71-7-Inch...0741&sr=1-1

http://www.amazon.com/Worlds-First-Batte...9795&sr=8-9

There is also the small problem of the digital TV reception as most of the internal or supplied external whip antennas have a gain problem with the reduced TV signal strength. This should improve though once the full digital switch over takes place. Many of the portable TVs aren't really portable as they still need to be tethered to the main antenna attached to the side of the house.



The European DTV system has a slightly different broadcast format but it is not so different from the ATSC broadcast signal that a wider range of battery powered portable TVs such as the Laura DTV shown above shouldn't become available in the future.

The most cost effective way would be to get vouchers or coupons ($80 worth) from the US goverment to help to pay for an ATSC STB then power both your current portable TV and the ATSC STB from a battery power supply. You should/may then be able to get an ATSC STB which will be powered from a 12V DC power supply. Most STBs shouldn't consume more than a few watts.

https://www.dtv2009.gov/

Having the entire country switch over on the same day is a bit mad though.





Edited by Am_Fear_Liath_Mor (09/23/08 08:30 PM)

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#149995 - 09/24/08 03:42 AM Re: Digital TV [Re: Am_Fear_Liath_Mor]
Lizzie Offline
Stranger

Registered: 09/22/08
Posts: 2
Thanks for the welcome and the comments.

AmFearLiathMor,
I have seen the digital portable TVs, including the ones for which you provided links. The main drawback, for me, is the limited battery life. As mentioned in the previous post, I've been spoiled by the simple analog portable TV I've had for many years. The battery life is easily long enough for a week-long (or longer) power outage, and I can keep up on what's going on without even having to change the batteries. But, if I should have to change the batteries, it's a simple matter of inserting a new set of batteries--no STB, no battery with inverter, etc. needed. Obviously, I'll have to adapt, but I don't have to be happy about it.

I'm still wondering if anyone can explain to me why there are no digital TVs with regular batteries, rather than the built-in lithium ion rechargeable battery. Is it a matter of asthetics, so that the TVs are very small and portable? Or does a digital TV require more power so that this is the best option in terms of function?

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#149996 - 09/24/08 03:57 AM Re: Digital TV [Re: Lizzie]
jshannon Offline
Addict

Registered: 02/02/03
Posts: 647
Loc: North Texas
I have been digital over the air only (with $7 Walmart antenna) for more than 1.5 years and love it. Of course the reception will occasionally falter, but I won't be buying cable.

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#150002 - 09/24/08 04:55 AM Re: Digital TV [Re: Lizzie]
JCWohlschlag Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 11/26/06
Posts: 724
Loc: Sterling, Virginia, United Sta...
I do not think we will be seeing good options for portable digital TVs until the ATSC (the entity) gets their standards fixed up. It seems when the initial standards for ATSC (the format) were adopted, consideration for portable, mobile devices was very lacking. It turns out that portable, mobile TVs cannot get very reception at all using the regular ATSC format due to the fact that they move around. The future ATSC-M/H (Mobile/Handheld) standard is designed to accommodate these devices.
_________________________
“Hiking is just walking where it’s okay to pee. Sometimes old people hike by mistake.” — Demitri Martin

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#150016 - 09/24/08 02:29 PM Re: Digital TV [Re: JCWohlschlag]
Yuccahead Offline
Member

Registered: 07/24/08
Posts: 199
Loc: W. Texas
"I'm still wondering if anyone can explain to me why there are no digital TVs with regular batteries, rather than the built-in lithium ion rechargeable battery. Is it a matter of asthetics, so that the TVs are very small and portable? Or does a digital TV require more power so that this is the best option in terms of function?"


Lizze,
I think the answer runs along these lines. Your old portable TV is still kinda big. It has to have room for the old type of TV screen -- a CRT -- which required a fair amount of depth behind the screen. So there was plenty of space for the designers to place a bunch of D cells. Also, when your TV was made, new battery technology like that found in the new portable digital TV's didn't exist at a reasonable cost.

When current TV manufacturers make a portable TV, they have new technology to use. Namely, flat screens and small rechargeable batteries. They have probably done a fair bit of research that tells them that most people would only use a portable TV on batteries for a limited amount of time and that smaller size was more important for their sales. In time, manufacturers will get around to making TVs for the niches that have been left behind in the rush to get DTVs to the biggest parts of the market.

My old portable TV seems to use 1000 mA and requires 9D batteries. I couldn't find the power use for the new TVs but I would guess it is a bit less.
_________________________
-- David.

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#150037 - 09/24/08 06:30 PM Re: Digital TV [Re: Lizzie]
Am_Fear_Liath_Mor Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 3078
Lizzie,

The digital switchover will be a sad moment for many. Your simple analogue television, which has served you so faithfully for many years, will soon be joining its ancestors in tele heaven. Your tele will be in good company though. I too will soon begrudge the loss of a Casio EV-680 to the so called 'TV digital revolution' in 2010. frown

http://www.thevalvepage.com/tv/Tele.htm

The Sinclair FTV1 - what nostalgia.

http://www.thevalvepage.com/tv/sinclair/ftv1/ftv1.htm

A complete history of the portable television.

http://www.guenthoer.de/index-e.htm





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