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#147386 - 09/04/08 04:06 PM "Identity Farming" Do it for the kids?
thatguyjeff Offline
Newbie

Registered: 04/22/08
Posts: 41
Check This Link

It's a Wired article about hypothetically creating the perfect fake identity. The catch is it's like an investment, starting years in advance with a paper trail and waiting a couple decades before you could actually use it.

This got me thinking a little about my son. He's 3 at the moment. If I wanted to, this seems like a relatively easy thing to get away with.

Again, purely hypothetical situation here... this is way illegal to try and I'm not planning on it.

Like I said, got me thinking how something like this could come in handy down the road for him.

Say 20+ years from now, (conspiracy theory alert) the gov't is way over the top with nixing freedom, rights, etc. The whole federal ID thing is out of hand, whatever. And my son is in some trouble for something relatively harmless or because of some red-tape screw up. Maybe he was in the wrong place at the wrong time and there's a new version of the patriot act and he's tagged as a potential terrorist... who knows?

Whatever the case, he's in some deep trouble. Ta-Dah!!! Here you go son, a false identity with a complete paper trail. You have a new SSN, bank account with activity over the years, birth cirtificate, passport, almost everything save a drivers license - which would be easy to get with all the above.

Thoughts?
(again, very illegal, hypothetical situation only)

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#147391 - 09/04/08 04:47 PM Re: "Identity Farming" Do it for the kids? [Re: thatguyjeff]
Am_Fear_Liath_Mor Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 3078
James Robinson or Victor Kruger ? Picking the correct name for the identity farm seedling would be quite important I think whistle

I suspect Mr Kruger probably has less of a problem with the TSA grin



Edited by Am_Fear_Liath_Mor (09/04/08 04:50 PM)

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#147392 - 09/04/08 04:57 PM Re: "Identity Farming" Do it for the kids? [Re: thatguyjeff]
Henry_Porter Offline
Member

Registered: 03/24/07
Posts: 111
Interesting idea regarding your three-year-old son. I recommend "How to Be Invisible" by J. J. Luna for some ideas (and I'm sure an online search will uncover many other titles and articles on the subject).

There are legal ways to minimize one's "profile," but as you suggest it can be a pretty grueling investment of time, money and opportunity costs as you try to proceed along the spectrum of hidden identity.

Another strategy is "hiding in plain sight," a kind of stegography of life in which open visibility provides (perhaps) some measure of anonymity and/or risk management.

It is pretty much impossible to put the genie back in the bottle once one's identity accumulates the various datapoints of many current societies. Starting over with a new identity is something I can't speak to.

As I understand it, you in the USA don't have 20+ years to wait until your government and corporations are "way over the top" regarding privacy, data collection and data mining, surveillance, secrecy in government and much weakened "rule of law." A cursory reading of Presidential Directives in the last seven years, for example, makes this clear as does the Total Information Awareness project (now called ADVISE).

Hope this doesn't sound like conspiracy theory or off-topic politics. I keep up with US law and society because I consider it one of the last bastions of freedom and have been alarmed by trends and practices there in recent decades.

Part of my preparedness includes, as recommended by others elsewhere on this forum, situational awareness in terms of local, regional, national and international laws and policies especially as they relate to the ability to move during various "emergencies," be they of natural, man-made or unknown origin.

I'd say you're right to consider what kind of society your son is growing up in and what prudent steps you can take now to minimize certain risks to his pursuit of life, liberty and happiness.


Edited by Henry_Porter (09/04/08 04:59 PM)
Edit Reason: corrected my misspelling

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#147394 - 09/04/08 05:07 PM Re: "Identity Farming" Do it for the kids? [Re: thatguyjeff]
thseng Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 900
Loc: NW NJ
Seems like it could backfire in a big way when the social worker shows up with a court order to see your imaginary child. A jury might convict a "child killer" even without a body. The prosecutor would be using your own paper trail against you.
_________________________
- Tom S.

"Never trust and engineer who doesn't carry a pocketknife."

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#147396 - 09/04/08 05:36 PM Re: "Identity Farming" Do it for the kids? [Re: thseng]
BobS Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 02/08/08
Posts: 924
Loc: Toledo Ohio
I would think if you are so inclined to create a fake identity it would probably be better to just find the right person and buy one. Playing with making one over a 25-year time span seems like it would be too easy to slip up and you could not be sure what would be needed 25 years in the future so some of what you would have created may not be of use.
_________________________



You can run, but you'll only die tired.


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#147399 - 09/04/08 06:38 PM Re: "Identity Farming" Do it for the kids? [Re: thseng]
thatguyjeff Offline
Newbie

Registered: 04/22/08
Posts: 41
Originally Posted By: thseng
Seems like it could backfire in a big way when the social worker shows up with a court order to see your imaginary child. A jury might convict a "child killer" even without a body. The prosecutor would be using your own paper trail against you.


I'm not sure how this would be a problem, I mean it could... The imaginary child would be the same as the real one.

For example, the passport photos would be the same picture of the same child. If it came down to getting caught doing this, the first thing a prosecutor would have to do is prove the flesh and blood version of both children existed in the first place. All they would have is the paper trail you created and that arguement could be countered simply by telling the truth. In order to discredit your identity farming story, they would need some sort of physical evidence I think. For example, there wouldn't be a record of the imaginary child ever enrolled in school, nor would there be any witnesses to claim they ever met the child.

I wonder which would be worse from a ciminal penalty standpoint, the supposed murder of a child, or years of social security fraud and falsifying various government documents? You could get tagged with multiple counts on the latter and rack up years and years in prison.

I suppose at the very least the murder charge, being a violent crime, would land you in maximum security whereas all the fraud charges would get you minimum security.


Edited by thatguyjeff (09/04/08 06:41 PM)

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#147401 - 09/04/08 06:50 PM Re: "Identity Farming" Do it for the kids? [Re: thatguyjeff]
BobS Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 02/08/08
Posts: 924
Loc: Toledo Ohio
What if they found out and did know it was an imaginary child and wanted to make an example of you and go after you for murdering your kid. As we all seen in the Duke Lacrosse case it did not take good evidence to run the boys and their familyís through hell. It came out right in the end after millions were spent to defend themselves from something they didnít do. But it could just as easily have gone the other way. All it took for this to go bad was a prosecutor with political aspirations.

I donít know that itís worth messing with.
_________________________



You can run, but you'll only die tired.


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#147410 - 09/04/08 07:45 PM Re: "Identity Farming" Do it for the kids? [Re: BobS]
thseng Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 900
Loc: NW NJ
"The wicked flee when no man pursueth."

You're talking about breaking multiple just laws based on the speculation that you might end up wanted by some future unjust police state. *

Become a real criminal now in order to dodge unjust persecution later?

Offhand I would suggest alternative hobbies such as decoupage, hang gliding and possibly aquaculture.

* and don't give me any crap about the patriot act. You flatter yourself if you think that you're worth watching.
_________________________
- Tom S.

"Never trust and engineer who doesn't carry a pocketknife."

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#147424 - 09/04/08 11:14 PM Re: "Identity Farming" Do it for the kids? [Re: thseng]
Nishnabotna Offline
Icon of Sin
Addict

Registered: 12/31/07
Posts: 512
Loc: Nebraska
Originally Posted By: thseng


You're talking about breaking multiple just laws based on the speculation that you might end up wanted by some future unjust police state. *


There, fixed that for ya.

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#147448 - 09/05/08 01:23 AM Re: "Identity Farming" Do it for the kids? [Re: thseng]
Henry_Porter Offline
Member

Registered: 03/24/07
Posts: 111
Originally Posted By: thseng

* and don't give me any crap about the patriot act. You flatter yourself if you think that you're worth watching.


No worries, it's not a problem to add civilians, er, citizens (whether or not they're worthy of scrutiny) to our data-mining or wiretapping programs.

If you're not doing anything wrong, why should you worry about the "Patriot" Act, FISA, various "National Security" and "Homeland Security" Presidential Directives, At&T's Hawkeye and Aurora database programs, right?

Papers, please....

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