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#142478 - 08/01/08 01:24 PM Re: Where can you count on harvesting clean wild f [Re: BobS]
Nishnabotna Offline
Icon of Sin
Addict

Registered: 12/31/07
Posts: 512
Loc: Nebraska
I think the closest you could come would be to raise it yourself.
Otherwise, I don't think you could ever count on it and even then I'm not sure you would be able to maintain the integrity of your operation without going to extreme means that would brand you as crazy to most of your neighbors. It surly would not make any economic sense.

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#142479 - 08/01/08 01:31 PM Re: Where can you count on harvesting clean wild f [Re: dweste]
samhain Offline
Addict

Registered: 11/30/05
Posts: 598
Loc: Baton Rouge, Louisiana
Originally Posted By: dweste
I would like to be able to eat the animals and plants I harvest without concern about heavy metal, biological, or chemical poisoning.

Where in the United States can you count on harvesting clean wild food?

Thanks.


Answer: Nowhere.

Wind and water currents carry pollutants everywhere across the globe.

There are areas where the pollution is going to be more concentrated, and just because you're out in the woods doesn't mean you're safely far enough downstream from a pig farm, or someone's hunting camp dumping raw sewage in the creek, etc...

Life is a exercise of risk management (not risk elimination). Know your surroundings, judge the risk, and act accordingly with the caveat of nothing is 100% safe.

Being well prepared and informed isn't a guarantee of safety, it just stacks the deck in your favor and gives your some options.
_________________________
peace,
samhain autumnwood

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#142519 - 08/01/08 05:44 PM Re: Where can you count on harvesting clean wild f [Re: samhain]
Susan Offline
Geezer

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 5163
Loc: W. WA
Samhain said it.

The best you could probably do is find a reasonably clean piece of land (pasture - check the history of use), have the water thoroughly tested (around $200, I think), start improving the soil by growing mixed cover crops and applying needed minerals (after a good soil test), and then start growing your own food.

No one is going to point out a great, safe piece of land to you. Why should they? No one is going to test various places to see what is wrong with it for you. Why would they? No independent company would do it, and why should the taxpayers pay for it?

This kind of research is strictly up to you.

Sue

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#142545 - 08/01/08 09:19 PM Re: Where can you count on harvesting clean wild f [Re: dweste]
Joy Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 04/21/08
Posts: 67
Dweste, There are 2 books that I can think of that might fit what you are looking for. They both have maps and look at different catagories like environmental, crime, natural and manmade diasters, etc. I am worried though that by posting them, I am getting into an area that they might not want on this board.

One of the books kind of talks about this subject, but not in the detail I think you are looking for. He has a section where he discusses different chemicals and then shows maps (but not very good maps - in fact pretty lousy maps! ) of places that have higher concentrations of the ones he cites. You could probably find better maps online. The book is called "Strategic Relocation: North American Guide to Safe Places" by Joel M. Skousen He doesn't go into the detail I think you are looking for. But if you are still looking for a place to move to, this book might help some . The book is expensive. He does have a website. Joels book deals with relocation to safe areas that have low crime, low pollution, low radiation. Stuff like that. I was disappointed in the quality of the maps and the over all presentation of the book. His other book gets better reviews, it deals with creating a secure home or retreat for diasters of all kinds. It is called "The Secure Home." Joel does have a website.

I can email you the name of the second book. It is a controversial book and some of their stuff I don't believe in, but I think for the information you are looking for, it might be able to help you. I have not seen or read this book, so I am only going by what is on their website. Let me know if you are interested in it and I will email you the website.

You can find maps similar to and probably a lot better then the ones in Joels book. If the purpose of your question is to narrow down the areas you are interested in moving to, then I suggest that you pick a few areas and study the different environmental maps of that area. Schools often study the evironmental impact on rivers. So there might be websites with that kind of information. I saw some on rivers for fishing, but I haven't searched for land, plants and animals. When I did a search I also added the word 'map' and that helps a little.

I did my search for your area mostly. But like I said, pick an area and study it online. From everything I have ever read, Northern California, most of Oregon and the upper part of Wyoming are places to study, because they show up on a lot of different maps as clear of the problem that map is talking about. When you study maps of say radiation down wind or radiation spread, those 3 areas are often clear. If you look at the map below of arsenic you will see that most of Oregon is clear. So make notes of areas around the country that you are interested in and then check them on the various maps and you can weed out the most polluted areas. That is the best I can suggest.

Below are some websites that I found last night while doing a small search for you. I did my search mostly for rivers in your area. They might not be just what you are looking for, but maybe you will spend more time looking then I did.

So far this webpage is the closest thing I can find for what you want, but the reports are over 10 years old!
http://water.usgs.gov/nawqa/nawqasum/index.html

I found this report on your area from the above website:
http://www.ehib.org/papers/NeedsAssessmentDF.pdf

This page has some maps that show arsenic around the country, but the maps are small and you can't really see them good.
http://www.agiweb.org/geotimes/nov01/feature_Asmap.html

I found this for seafood. I don't know if there is something similar for fresh water fish in rivers and lakes:
http://www.montereybayaquarium.org/cr/seafoodwatch.asp

The UC Davis Biosentinel Mercury Program Fact Sheet
http://www.sfei.org/cmr/fishmercury/552_UCDFactSheet_FinalWebApril18_HiRes2.pdf

For plants I would think the further away from civilization the better. So you would want to pick an area with lots of forests and no big cities nearby or upstream for a long distance. Joel Skousen says to avoid cities that are surrounded by mountains that create a bowl-like area where "air pollutants get trapped during winter time when there is a temperature inversion present (warm air over cold air)." End quote Two of the cities he mentions that have this bowl -like area are Los Angeles and Salt Lake City.

And Joel also suggests nutritional supplements to help flush out the pollutants before they do damage - but he doesn't go into much detail. For more detail I suggest a couple books by Dr. Blaylock. Dr. Blaylock is a retired Neurosurgeon. Both books deal with chemicals that we get from the foods we eat and how they affect us and what he recommends we take to prevent some of the damage they do, etc. Be sure to read the reviews towards the bottom of the page. You can click on the book cover of the first book to get to the contents page if you want to read what is in it.

Health and Nutrition Secrets:
"Learn how the chemicals and compounds you encounter every day can lead to unexpected health complications and life-threatening disorders. Health and Nutrition Secrets presents the latest information about strokes and heart attacks, diabetes, protecting the digestive system, and the best ways to keep the immune system young and powerful. New revised edition has chapter on The Role of Fats in Health."
http://www.amazon.com/Health-Nutrition-S...2153&sr=1-1

Excitotoxins: The Taste That Kills
http://www.amazon.com/Excitotoxins-Taste...2153&sr=1-3

And for anyone who is interested, his other book is on cancer.

I hope this helps. Let me know if you are interested in the other book? I have Joel's book, and although I am glad I have it, I think you will like the maps in the second books better.

Joy

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#142546 - 08/01/08 09:32 PM Re: Where can you count on harvesting clean wild f [Re: Joy]
wildman800 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 2846
Loc: La-USA
You might also want to take a look at: Prudent Places by Holly Deyo. You can find it at: http://www.standeyo.com

No, I don't have any affiliation with Stan or Holly Deyo, except that I like their website and I really liked Holly's other book: Dare To Prepare by Holly Deyo.
_________________________
QMC, USCG (Ret)
The best luck is what you make yourself!

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#142553 - 08/01/08 10:19 PM Re: Where can you count on harvesting clean wild f [Re: wildman800]
Joy Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 04/21/08
Posts: 67
Cool! Thank you Wildman, that is the other book I was talking about. I just didn't know if DR would want me posting either of them. Since you posted it, here is a link to the page that tells what is in the book I was talking about. It is the same one Wildman mentioned, it is called "Prudent Places USA" and this book and Joel's book are the closest I can think of to help you narrow your search down. Then I suggest you study local online maps and stuff for those areas.

I hope this link goes directly to the page. If not seach for the book "Prudent Places USA"
http://standeyo.com/index1.html

Dweste, is this the kind of information that you are looking for?

Joy

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#142556 - 08/01/08 10:46 PM Re: Where can you count on harvesting clean wild f [Re: Joy]
dweste Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 02/16/08
Posts: 2463
Loc: Central California
Yes, thanks Joy and wildman800.

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#142568 - 08/02/08 12:32 AM Re: Where can you count on harvesting clean wild f [Re: wildman800]
Art_in_FL Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/01/07
Posts: 2432
Originally Posted By: wildman800
White Man came to the country and found:

Braves spent all of their time hunting and fishing,
Squaws spent all of their time with the work,
There were NO taxes,

And white man thought he could improve on a system like that!!


Great, except your wrong.

The native Americans had a complex social and economic culture that included payments in labor and material goods, in essence taxes, given by individuals and families to the tribe. And gifts and/or offerings to disadvantaged persons within the tribe, essentially welfare. These were couched in terms of donations and charity but within the context of a tightly interdependent tribe failure to meet these obligations often met with stiff social sanctions.

The potlatch is a well known form of redistribution of wealth but most tribes had some form of wealth redistribution, welfare, socialization of risk, large collective projects (including huge building projects and war) and effective taxation in one form or another. Usually enforced by sanctions on those who do not comply.

The idea that the native Americans had some 'Freeman' paradise is simply a myth. A myth that goes along with the idea that somehow nature is inherently less toxic and more 'clean'. Nature isn't inherently clean in any modern sense. Nature is alive with pathogens, parasites and toxins. Some of these make most man made toxins and pollutants pale in comparison. Eat the wrong mushroom, the wrong portion of a polar bear or the wrong berry and your would have been better off spicing up your meal with a can of Raid.

Modern man also operates at something of a deficit. We have developed a complex infrastructure that keeps us away from most natural pathogens and toxins. Into the 1890s most rural people were exposed to giardia and after a protracted disease cycle, and some number of deaths, they developed some level of immunity. In many rural locations it was common for young kids to get sick and to transition to some level of immunity to the local mix of endemic and naturally occurring pathogens, toxins and parasites.

Now most Americans can go through their entire life without being exposed to giardia. This only becomes a problem when non-immune individuals step outside of the protective infrastructure and fail to take proper precautions.

In this sense there are no safe locations simply because, as the joke goes 'Bears [defecate] in the woods'. Outside a very few spots, like certain springs not too far from my location, deep wells and the ice in certain remote locations there is no safe standing waters in the US. And this only considers the naturally occurring pathogens. The same is true of the plants and animal foods gathered in remote locations. They usually have to be processed, washed at a minimum and/or cooked, to be safely eaten.

Nature itself is not inherently more safe from toxins and pathogens than a urban environment. Humans create safe zones and sources but, as a consequence, end up creating highly toxic zones. The wilderness is less toxic than the worse of the toxic zones made by man but very few places ever become as safe as the human created safe zones.

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