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#141902 - 07/28/08 08:39 PM Sailboat bug out / bug in
dweste Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 02/16/08
Posts: 2463
Loc: Central California
I just made offers on a couple small sailboats:

26D $5000 1987 Walnut Creek http://home.earthlink.net/~ulrichtribe/our1987macgregor26d/

26D $6000 1989 http://sfbay.craigslist.org/scz/boa/764328132.html

FYI: The D means it is a water ballasted daggerboard model with a stern hung rudder, rather than the later (1990-94) swing centerboard models with post hung rudder that are denoted with an “S”. The ‘89 D has the higher coamings without the stainless steel cockpit rails of the 87 & 88 models.

This listing has some better information on this boat:
http://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/7661

My hope is to outfit such a craft as liveabord capable, and secondarily as a bug-in or bug-out possibility. This would give me a second "destination" for bug-out, in that I could sail off into the SF Bay and beyond as opposed to the foothill "retreat" I am working on.

First, anybody got a better deal out htere on a MacGregor 26 - any model?

Second, while I am comfortable with freshwater and inland sailing, including the SF Bay, I am not prepared for sailing out underneath the Golden Gate Bridge into the Pacific Ocean. This will be a fun goal to work toward.

In addition to reading and online study, I am thinking about Coast Guard Auxiliary for coastal navigation courses. Suggestions for other courses or schools that are not too expensive?

Thanks.

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#141920 - 07/28/08 10:10 PM Re: Sailboat bug out / bug in [Re: dweste]
wildman800 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 2800
Loc: La-USA
For a sailboat of that age, $192.30 per foot is reasonable, if not the best deal that you will likely find.

I would take a close look at the ribs and keel, if you can get within view of them and make a critical inspection for any wood rot. Chances are there won't be any, but I recommend that you look for it, considering the price per foot being asked.

The USCG Auxiliary has some great courses concerning the Rules of the Road (and please be smart enough NOT to believe that sailboats have the Right of Way) and on Navigation.

There are other organizations that teach those same classes and more, check them out. (my memory is failing me at this moment). Go to your local bookstores and get a copy of Chapman's or some other comparable book that will teach you the Rules, Navigation, Signals, etc.

Talk to professional seamen about tips on where safe anchorage may be utilized in rivers (below the points) and offshore.
_________________________
QMC, USCG (Ret)
The best luck is what you make yourself!

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#141922 - 07/28/08 10:19 PM Re: Sailboat bug out / bug in [Re: wildman800]
dweste Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 02/16/08
Posts: 2463
Loc: Central California
Thanks!

I offered $3,000 so we will see.

The boats are all fiberglass with floatation all over. I will probably require a marine survey and ownership history search if I have to pay close to full asking price.

I picked up Chapman's a couple times and couldn't get my brain to engage the material. Math is not my strong suit, though I get along very well with map and compass on land. I suspect navigation will seem more relevant!

Where does one run into professional seamen to talk to about such practical stuff? I have joined three online forums to have access to experienced sailors in my area.

Thanks again.

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#141928 - 07/28/08 10:45 PM Re: Sailboat bug out / bug in [Re: dweste]
wildman800 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 2800
Loc: La-USA
Additional thoughts:

The layout looks very good to me, I lived aboard a 26 ft Watkins for 9 months and played on it for 8 years total.

For living aboard, you'll find that those hanging baskets are great for storing fruits and vegetables. Hanging hammocks alongside the bulkheads provide great storage places for your clothes, blankets, etc. Roll everything up as tightly as you can (just like camping).

As a Bug Out/In Vehicle, no matter where you sail, you've got your motel room with you.

I would not have a problem getting 250 miles from land in such a craft as long as I had my charts, GPS, and VHF-FM radios including the NOAA Wx Freqs.

Keep in mind that there are certain flags that you should keep onboard:
The US flag (ensign), Alpha (divers down), Bravo (refueling), Delta (breakdown), Oscar (man overboard), your state flag (courtesy), a black ball (anchored), are all good to have onboard.

There are certain flags that it isn't a good idea (IMHO) to have onboard:
The Jolly Roger (pirate flag), The Confederate Flag (a flag of rebellion), or any other flag that may be controversial, is not a real good idea to fly or HAVE ONBOARD.

There are certain things that are fun and/or useful to have onboard and to make use of:
A wind sock (they come in all sizes, colors, & designs. they tell
you the wind direction and strength, at a glance.), a RADAR reflector (this will save your life, even in the Bay), and there are a few other things that might interest you as you look around.

Take it for what you think this is worth. Bon chance et bon voyage, mon ami!
_________________________
QMC, USCG (Ret)
The best luck is what you make yourself!

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#141935 - 07/28/08 11:04 PM Re: Sailboat bug out / bug in [Re: dweste]
wildman800 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 2800
Loc: La-USA
The navigation is best learned by:

1st - Having someone walk you through a fictitious or fantasy trip, on the chart, from where you are to that fantasy port of call that you've always wanted to make. This teaches you how to plot courses, turn bearings, how to take bearings off your magnetic compass, danger bearings, and to plot every turn will teach you how to plot on a chart.

2nd - Don't forget then to figure out the tides and currents at the port of departure and arrival, as well as those places, daily, that you are passing near.

3rd - Calculate what speed you hope to make (on a sailboat, 5kts is the rule of thumb) and layout your DR (dead reckoning) calculations along your route.

4th - Apply it to your trips out into SF Bay until you get proficient in the art.


Edited by wildman800 (07/28/08 11:04 PM)
_________________________
QMC, USCG (Ret)
The best luck is what you make yourself!

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#141937 - 07/28/08 11:05 PM Re: Sailboat bug out / bug in [Re: wildman800]
BobS Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 02/08/08
Posts: 924
Loc: Toledo Ohio
I don’t know that much about sail boats, but I would guess it could handle the ocean if once you get the skills to do so. It could be a lot of fun to learn to do. Also woman love sail boats and that can’t be all bad for you, unless you are married.

I had a friend he and his wife live on a 43 foot boat all winter (in Toledo Ohio) while a home was being built. They bubbled the marina water (had pipes run under water throughout the marina water and then pump air through the pipes all winter to keep the water from freezing.)

They loved it, they only problem was the 100-yard walk to the shower building.


When I was in school I read a book about a boy that sailed around the world on a boat about that size (if you are interested it was called “the boy that sailed around the world alone”)
Link to it http://www.amazon.com/Boy-Sailed-Around-World-Alone/dp/0307165108
It was a great adventure read, reading about all the problems and how he overcame them and the cultures he saw.


See if your local library has it to read as Amazon wants $35.00 for it.



I would get a good GPS that is suited for waterways as far as mapping. Also a solar panel setup and a small wind generator, charge controller, battery bank and a good size inverter will give you an unlimited amount of power.

That and a fishing pole, and an alcohol stove and you have an unlimited supply of food, you will have to buy denatured alcohol for fuel.


Edited by BobS (07/28/08 11:11 PM)
_________________________



You can run, but you'll only die tired.


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#141938 - 07/28/08 11:06 PM Re: Sailboat bug out / bug in [Re: wildman800]
dweste Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 02/16/08
Posts: 2463
Loc: Central California
Excellent advice, thanks.


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#141941 - 07/28/08 11:18 PM Re: Sailboat bug out / bug in [Re: dweste]
Fitzoid Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 08/23/05
Posts: 289
Loc: WI, MA, and NYC
There are a few books written by people who've lived for extended periods in small sailboats, some of whom are relatively famous. The books have a lot of practical tips and gotchas that I thought were really informative. You can't learn to sail by reading, but you can learn a lot about living on a sailboat that way.

I particularly thought "Time on Ice: A Winter Voyage to Antarctica" by Deborah Shapiro and Rolf Bjelke (two world class sailors who've set many records) was absolutely superb. They purposefully wintered over in Antarctica stuck in the ice, in a miniature replica of Shackleton's trip. Talk about being self-sufficient.


_________________________
-----
"When I read about the evils of drinking, I gave up reading." Henny Youngman

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#141943 - 07/28/08 11:28 PM Re: Sailboat bug out / bug in [Re: Fitzoid]
BobS Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 02/08/08
Posts: 924
Loc: Toledo Ohio
They purposefully wintered over in Antarctica stuck in the ice.


Some people are crazy!!!!!
LOL
_________________________



You can run, but you'll only die tired.


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#141945 - 07/28/08 11:31 PM Re: Sailboat bug out / bug in [Re: dweste]
bws48 Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/18/07
Posts: 812
Loc: Anne Arundel County, Maryland
There are few things more fun than messing about in boats. A great part of that fun is equipping it.

I had a great sailboat here in the Chesapeake Bay (a Pearson 36), and the one thing I found was that all sailboats, and possibly all boats, are water soluble. Thus, to best protect your investment in your new boat, avoid all contact with water.crazy Absent that, apply liberal amounts of time and elbow grease.grin

Seriously, I think a sailboat is a great, and under-considered option for bug out/bug in. Transportation and shelter and free (wind) energy.

Wish you the best.
_________________________
"Better is the enemy of good enough."

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