In case anyone is interested Costco has solar panels w/free shipping.

Solar Panels Solar Panels

nice! What could these power?

tro

Good price for 54W of power especially considering it has a charge controller and everything.

54W, for perspective, is enough to run most 12VDC electric coolers (Mine uses 47W peak according to the manufacturer).

Any information about hooking them in series to increase power?

-Blast

I noticed these a few days ago. It's a very good deal, especially if you don't have any of the bits-and-pieces (charge controller, inverter).

54W is actually a useful amount of power. I wouldn't go with less than 45W for a mobile setup. It will keep all your battery-operated items (flashlights, LED lanterns, laptops, NiMH chargers, radios, cell phones, etc.) running quite nicely. Someone has thought this through.

FWIW, I have a couple of ICP panels (a 5W and a 15W). They've been out in the weather, -30C to +30C, for about three years now and have kept trickling out the precious juice.

In terms of hooking this setup in series: I'm pretty sure the panels would take it (most can take up to 10A, though check the documentation). But the charge controller that's included is only rated to 4A. So buy two setups and hook each to a big fat battery. Switch over as required.

I went with the SunLinq 25 Watt Foldable Solar Charger for my car -- just plug it into the cigarette lighter.

Harbor freight has a 45 watt setup for $179.

Nope, Harbor freight $219
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=90599

I would run them in a setup similar to a buss bar. All the units would be hooked to a single feed line to the battery. Each unit would be or is protected by a diode to prevent nasty electrical things happening.

$.02 worth

Agree. Run them in parallel to maintain whatever the output voltage happens to be (~12-15 VDC).

I may run up to the local Costco and see if they have these in stock.

Free shipping... waste $ driving AND buying other things!! L O L

Do we know if there is any built in circuitry? Cooking them up in parallel might not be the only option. Besides, hooking them up in series would prevent you from using the charge controller and other goodies that come with it!

Looking more closely at the photos, it seems the charge controller is a stand-alone item. Still, it can only handle 4 amps, so putting two sets in parallel is not an option.

You could ditch the controller and connect the individual panels in parallel. However, you would need to monitor the battery's voltage very closely. 14.2 VDC is the cutoff point for charge controllers I've seen. Much above that and you can overcharge (fry) your battery. Hint: it always happens when you're not looking.

BTW: many higher-end solar setups are wired in series, and run at 24 VDC. Less line loss (a.k.a. the toaster effect) that way.

(There's no inverter included -- I misunderstood. Small inverters are cheaply and readily available these days. Don't try to run a Mac off one, they don't like the modified sine wave and the power supply overheats.)

Harbor Tools has a 45-watt solar panel that has a charge controller. Its normally $249.00, sometimes on sale for $199.00


Has anyone had any experience with these?

Whoa, I didn't know that! Thanks for the warning.

-Blast

I should qualify the Mac thing:

As of a year ago, the word on desktop-ish Macs was: avoid modified sine wave inverters, period.

I have no solid info as to whether this applies to laptop-ish Macs. Ask the question of a suitable guru: "if I do this, will it cook my loved one / void my warranty?"

FWIW, I have never used a cheapo inverter on a desktop wintel box (yeah, chicken) but I have logged many hours on wintel laptops powered by uber-cheapo modified sine wave inverters. Not so much as a hiccup on three different machines. So it all lies in the design of the power supply.

As a person who's worked for one of the largest computer makers in the world I can safely say that no major brand computer company would question you about what you plugged a computer into if it fried...they're much more concerned with your safety. If they're not, buy from somebody else.

Most notebook computer supplies are designed to be pretty robust these days. The premise behind a notebook is that you could be anywhere and plugging it into anything. With the exception of some high end power hungry models, they're pretty forgiving in my experience.

A desktop model is another creature all together. Power supplies in desktops are pretty standard and the basic design hasn't changed much in a long time. Unfortunately this is a common area for cost cutting. That said, I'm not surprised about the warning on desktops. A computer you build yourself would be much more tolerant especially if you installed a top of the line power supply.

If your goal were to run a desktop off of solar power exclusively (don't laugh, you can already buy such things retail) you could build your own computer and then get a DC-DC conversion power supply designed for use in car based PCs. A small battery and some solar panels later, you'd be in business no inverter required. And these power supplies are usually about the size of a candy bar because there's no transformer needed...it's all solid state.

I somewhat agree with this but for different reasons. If you buy 2-panels, you will get a controller for each one. One controller to each panel tied together downrange of the controllers would float each solar panel from the other one and allow each controller to only have to deal with the output of one solar panel.


But I would make a guess that this would give you problems because the output from one panel and controller could easily effect the other controller by fooling it into thinking the battery has more of a charge then it really does.


The best way to tie two solar panels together is to run both of them into one controller that is made to handle the combined output of both of them. Solar charge controllers are not super expensive, so all you need to do is to buy a bigger solar controller.


Wind power controllers are expensive (they need a dump load and generally have to handle much more power then a solar controller) but solar ones are not too expensive.

Fair enough, BobS. I have a 10A charge controller that cost me about $30. And it does look like the panels in this setup are independent. So, you can reconfigure as you please.

But here's the rub, as I see it: this package is less and less of a deal if you have to start adding external components.

I would argue that if you buy two of these setups, you'd be better off keeping them separate, hooked to appropriate batteries.

On that theme: deep cycle batts are nice, but cheapo inverters are designed for car batteries and shut down at ?? 10.6 volts (I think) to prevent damage. So, the xbox goes down, tough luck kids. But the second batt keeps running the LED lighting and the radios, which really matter.

My 2-cents' worth.

Ah, so you were caught in the local **ll meltdown? Bad luck, dude. Hope you came out okay.

I agree with everything you've said about desktop vs. laptop power supplies. It agrees with my own experience.

No reason a desktop can't be run off pure solar. My 120 watts of generation (growing all the time) does a lot of real work around here. Any info you can provide on DC-DC units would be welcome. I hate losing 15-20% of my juice to inverters.

I left before things got bad...sorta saw it coming.

Here's a good site for hardware. The link below is to a 6V-24V suply for use in cars:
http://www.mini-box.com/M1-ATX-90w-Intelligent-Automotive-DC-DC-Power-Supply

Those minibox supplies are nice, I have the pw60 running my 500mhz box

There are other things that do not like MSW inverters, did not know that some things didn't like them and cooked an older makita battery charger. The newer makita chargers don't seem to have this problem.

http://www.donrowe.com/inverters/inverter_faq.html#modified

And click on,

Do I need Modified Sine Wave, or Pure Sine Wave?

for a list of devices that don't like MSW inverters.

When I first saw this posted, I thought this (original Costo set-up)looked like a great inexpensive solor backup system. And it looked to me like it was ready to go pretty much right out of the box, no need to purchase additional parts save maybe a stand for the panels.

So now some of you have me wondering with all the sine wave discussion. That stuff is way over my head. I do understand the basics when it comes to batteries and inverters. I have a little experience using a deep cycle marine battery and inverter. But aside from charging and hooking the thing up to my sonar, lights, trolling motor or other whatnot, I know nothing.

So, my question, if I want an alternative backup power source for the house to use to power a few lights, maybe a TV, and recharge the phones, ipod, and laptops (I have a macbook and a windows laptop both), and the GPS is this a good option? And, is it ready out of the box like I say?

Based on your needs, I think this package is a pretty good deal.

Keep in mind this is a charging system only.

You will need to provide your own storage battery -- the bigger the better. If you want 110V AC power you'll need to provide your own inverter.

Don't worry about the modified sine wave issue too much. The manual that comes with your inverter will list items that are incompatible.

To recharge batteries, sine wave is irrelevant. For lights, I'd suggest getting 12VDC lights if you can, so you don't have to power an inverter to run 120VAC lights; or get rechargeable lights you can plug into the solar unit during the day.

Check this page and see if it answers your questions on sine waves:
http://www.donrowe.com/inverters/inverter_faq.html
(With regard to powering laptops, note that recharging the battery is different from running the laptop off the inverter.)

Trying to power all that when there is a power failure is way too much to ask for from a few solar panels and a battery.

You may be better off with a generator to power all that.



The first thing you need to do is to conserve power, replace, dump or don’t use all the stuff in a home that eats electricity like crazy. A person would do good to learn what all the every day items in a home consume in watts. The answer would amaze you as to how much power is being used up for the little or no gain to your benefit.


Almost everything can be put on power strips and shut off (from electricity) to save a lot. All the wall chargers continue to use electricity when they are not charging anything. Feel them; if it feels warm, it’s getting that heat from electricity. Almost everything electronic continues to use electricity when it is turned off (TVs, microwaves, DVD players, Laptops, the list is endless) When you put things on power strips and turn them off, you stop these phantom loads from eating electricity. This is the first step to do before buying a solar panel and a few batteries. Solar electricity is extremely expensive, and every watt you don’t consume is a watt you don’t have to buy.


If you are really interested in this, look for an inline watt meter. This thing will tell you what anything that is plugged into its power requirement are. Its well worth the price (they aren’t cheep) if a person is serious about making & managing their own power. You can’t figure out what things consume by just reading the label on the back. I have a small microwave that says 600 watts on the back; it uses just over 800 watts to run. So the power / watt meter is worth having to get the real answer about what something uses.

Putting things on power strips is a hassle, most people won’t do it. Family members will fight you on this and just leave things powered up. It’s an uphill battle for a person with a family. We are a society that has become very addicted to instant gratification; we push the button on the remote we want the TV on now, not 30-seconds from now. This NOW mentality cost money to have; it uses power at an amazing rate.