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#131600 - 04/30/08 04:45 PM Rifle Choices
LeeG Offline
Member

Registered: 03/24/08
Posts: 100
Loc: Phoenix, AZ
I am soon to be in the market for a new rifle. My firearms collection currently consists mostly of hunting rifles (from .22 to 300 Weatherby Mag), upland game shotguns (12 and 20ga double barrels), and a wide range of pistols plus a Remington 870 12ga for basic home defense.

I have never been into the military style assault rifles and there are a huge number out there and I am hoping someone has some advice to narrow down my research. While I do plan on shooting this for fun, I also would like to have it available for WTSHTF situations.

Requirements:
.223 or .308 caliber
highly reliable under field conditions
Relatively low weight (would be carrying with a BOB+)
Easily field maintainable

Cost is not really an issue as long as it is less than 2-3K. I'd much prefer to spend more and have a more reliable gun. Please be as specific as you can as I know there can be a large variance in quality between manufacturers and even years of manufacture.



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#131602 - 04/30/08 05:24 PM Re: Rifle Choices [Re: LeeG]
benjammin Offline
Rapscallion
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 4020
Loc: Anchorage AK
Ruger Mini-14(.223 remington cartridge) in matte stainless, with black poly stock. Solid design (garand style, like the M-14 and M-1 military rendition), utilitarian in nature, carbine so it's light, lots of available options, but just fine as is, with a solid mfr warranty. Good used ones at less than $500 if you shop, new maybe as low as $650. Get a couple 30 round aftermarket magazines. I can field strip mine with just an allen wrench if need be and the Otis pocket gun cleaning kit makes the whole job a snap.

I've run mine through the ringer chasing the coyote-cong, vorpal bunnies, and the elusive cow-pie at 200 meters. I prefer an aimpoint red dot scope on mine (no magnification), but currently I've got a pronghorn in 3-9x power. About the only quirk with this fine firearm is that the gas port can allow too much energy on hot rounds, jacking the action hard and spewing the brass 30 feet or more. You can change out the bushing easy enough (aftermarket for $20 or so) or reload your own and tailor the powder charge for the recoil you need, which I prefer anyways.


For what you say you are looking for, that is precisely what this little rifle was made to do. It is amazing how fast you can go through 240 rounds with this little unit.
_________________________
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer, English Philosopher (1820-1903)

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#131603 - 04/30/08 05:32 PM Re: Rifle Choices [Re: LeeG]
wildman800 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 2846
Loc: La-USA
Forget about the AR-15 (5.56mm/.223cal). It is sensitive to dirt and carbon buildup. The .308cal on the other hand is heavier but accurate, easy to maintain in the field, & more reliable than most weapons.

The M-1 Garand (.30-06cal). It's main drawback is the weight and 5 round magazine.

I've always felt good with an FNL (7.62mm) in my hands. It has a bit of weight but is reliable and easy to maintain.

If the ranges are no more than 100 yds maximum that you expect to need a rifle for, then you might look at the M-1 Carbine (.30cal) or similar type of carbine.

take this FWIW to you.
_________________________
QMC, USCG (Ret)
The best luck is what you make yourself!

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#131607 - 04/30/08 05:38 PM Re: Rifle Choices [Re: LeeG]
BillLiptak Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 12/19/07
Posts: 259
I'll suggest two. First one is a bushmaster m-17s. Bullpup configuration, uses standard m-16 mags. Modifications that need to be done to it, IMHO, are adding a picatinny rail on the under side for a foward grip and drilling out vent holes in the aluminim receiver surrounding the barrel. The gun gets to hot to handle after about 3 clips without prolonged cooling. Uses the gas system similar to an AK-47 so fouling is not an issue as it is with the M-16/M-4 clones. No longer in production, never a "popular" seller. I see them all the times at gun shows for 500 to 600 bucks.
The other is a FN FS2000. Also a bullpup. Also takes standard nato mags. Haven't owned one like I did the M-17, but I want one. Modular foregrip configuration (white light, laser, grenade launcher for military) so its slightly customizable, at a cost to your wallet. Runs about 2k new. Brass isn't ejected, its collected and pushed out the front. Charging handle can be mounted right or left. All controlls are ambidextrous.
If you want something in .308 (7.62x51 nato) I'd say go with a CETME or a FNFAL. Tons of aftermarket parts to make it your own. Reliable track record on both.

-Bill Liptak

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#131613 - 04/30/08 05:56 PM Re: Rifle Choices [Re: BillLiptak]
frediver Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 215
Loc: N.Cal.
IMO
Long guns and a BOB don't really go together, its a weight thing.
Get a short barrel for your 870 and carry 2 bx's of asst. ammo.
It still weights a bunch but well keep you safe like nothing else will. Remember the object is NOT to get into a situation that will require a weapon, you can't win. Lay down lead and get
away!
The post above to consider a Mini-14. While not a real military
weapon is a very good choice to fit your requirements.

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#131630 - 04/30/08 07:09 PM Re: Rifle Choices [Re: frediver]
EHCRain10 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 03/11/08
Posts: 42
Loc: VA
If you are willing to go with a bolt action, they are all extremely reliable and will be more accurate than only the most expensive semiautos
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Sweat saves blood.
Erwin Rommel

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#131631 - 04/30/08 07:11 PM Re: Rifle Choices [Re: ]
7point82 Offline
Addict

Registered: 11/24/05
Posts: 478
Loc: Orange Beach, AL
A lot of gun questions turn into Mary Ann versus Ginger type debates. There are good and bad attributes to just about any rifle. You just have to figure out which criteria are the most important to you.

If at all possible get some trigger time on a few guns and figure out what you LIKE. Ergonomics are not easy to evaluate without getting your hands on a gun. Imagine buying shoes because they look comfortable. grin

Once you know what you like you should be able to find a very nice rifle in just about any configuration.

Some thoughts...

If you like ARs remember that everyone and his brother builds one and quality varies dramatically. If the 5.56 cartridge is a little light for you there are serviceable models in 6.8 SPC or 7.62 NATO.

With the exception of being chambered in 7.62x39 a top shelf AK would seem to fit your other requirements fairly well.

FALs and M1A1s can be very nice but are also heavy.

The Mini-14/Mini-30 aren't bad choices either. The AR is undoubtedly more popular than the Mini-14 but the Mini does have its champions. I'm not sure the Mini-30 brings anything to the table that a similarly priced AK doesn't trump.

There are more specialized options out there as well and a little Googling should dig them up. (The Sig 556 & Bushmaster ACR are getting a lot of press at the moment.)

Don’t forget to check on the availability of accessories/magazines and the price of same. IMO this is one key area that makes the AR popular. They are very easy to reconfigure; add optics, change stocks, etc.

Long story short … there is likely more than one right answer and the right answer for me isn’t necessarily the right answer for you.
_________________________
"There is not a man of us who does not at times need a helping hand to be stretched out to him, and then shame upon him who will not stretch out the helping hand to his brother." -Theodore Roosevelt

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#131633 - 04/30/08 07:20 PM Re: Rifle Choices [Re: 7point82]
benjammin Offline
Rapscallion
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 4020
Loc: Anchorage AK
I've always been the Mary Ann type, favoring function over form, to a point. Mary Ann was easy enough on the eyes that her other more practical attributes put her at the top. Ginger couldn't do anything useful until she spent some time learning with Mary Ann.

Do we have any takers on Lovey (aka Mrs. Howell)? Just curious.
_________________________
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer, English Philosopher (1820-1903)

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#131634 - 04/30/08 07:30 PM Re: Rifle Choices [Re: frediver]
Paul810 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/02/03
Posts: 1428
Loc: NJ, USA
I've heard good things about Saigas as far as reliability goes. They're basically .223, 7.62x39, and .308 versions of an AK-47. I have no experience with them though.

http://www.raacfirearms.com/Saiga.htm
http://www.raacfirearms.com/Saiga_308.htm



Another option is a Remington 7600/7615. These are pump rifles, similar in design to the classic Remington 870 Shotgun. The 7615 shoots .223 and uses AR-15 magazines, which is a nice touch. While not as fast to shoot as a semi-auto it's still quicker than a bolt action and it's about as reliable as a factory 870. I like the design of the Law Enforcement versions best.

http://www.remingtonle.com/rifles/7615.htm

Other than that I'd go with what everyone else here said, a Mini-14 is tough to beat and very commmon.


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#131636 - 04/30/08 07:33 PM Re: Rifle Choices [Re: Paul810]
MoBOB Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/17/07
Posts: 1219
Loc: here
I knew a guy in Alaska that had a slide-action Remington in 30-06. He loved it. Quick and slick. Great follow-up/recovery time.
_________________________
"Its not a matter of being ready as it is being prepared" -- B. E. J. Taylor

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