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#129928 - 04/11/08 02:54 PM Re: So.....am I crazy? [Re: Dan_McI]
Hacksaw
Unregistered


Originally Posted By: Dan_McI

And as far as the original question in this thread, Taurus, if you are crazy, then you are asking lunatics in the asylum to diagnosis you.


LOL. This is the truth!

For me I couldn't imagine shooting anybody in my home...it's just not how I was raised. I don't think I'm capable of it (not right now anyhow). The other thing is that I live in a condo so for every shot which misses is a potentially killed neighbor.

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#129930 - 04/11/08 03:10 PM Re: So.....am I crazy? [Re: ]
Dan_McI Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 12/10/07
Posts: 844
Loc: NYC
Originally Posted By: Hacksaw
The other thing is that I live in a condo so for every shot which misses is a potentially killed neighbor.


That's one reason I like the shotgun. From 10 feet away, it almost doesn't matter what shell is being used. A 12 gauge has enough power to do some very serious damage, at 10 feet, even if it is loaded with lead bird shot. At 10-12 feet, the pattern from bird shot can be as samll as 6 inches in diameter, which if you are accurate pours all of your lead onto the intended target. Penetration is not as good with bird vs. buck shot, but most of the bird shot is still getting 4 inches deep into him, and it is not going through the walls to get to your neighbor's cat.


See:

http://www.gunsandammomag.com/long_guns/def_090105/

http://www.firearmstactical.com/briefs10.htm


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#129937 - 04/11/08 03:48 PM Re: So.....am I crazy? [Re: Dan_McI]
Taurus Offline
Addict

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 423
Loc: Ontario
This is another reason I handload. I can increase or reduce the charge weight in my shells depending on what I want them for. The benifit is lower recoil and reduced penetration for home defence.


Its fun to make hot loads using 12 gauge 3 and 1/2 inch hulls and stacks of dimes as well. Bet that would be a fairly effective home defence cartridge. laugh
te he he he....

might not hold up in court too well though..........................

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#129944 - 04/11/08 04:57 PM Re: So.....am I crazy? [Re: Taurus]
wildman800 Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/09/06
Posts: 2811
Loc: La-USA
After reading many of the post in this thread, I'm reminded of that old golden rule: All things should be keep in moderation.
_________________________
QMC, USCG (Ret)
The best luck is what you make yourself!

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#129945 - 04/11/08 05:02 PM Re: So.....am I crazy? [Re: ]
unimogbert Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 08/10/06
Posts: 855
Loc: Colorado
Originally Posted By: Troglodyte007


To put it bluntly; I'm going in after the intruder(s), and I'm going to kill him/them, hoping that I got there in time to stop him from raping and murdering my wife and children who I hope are still dreaming peacefully in their beds. If he did get to them already, and he is still in the house, not only am I going to kill him, but I am going to kill him by beating him to death with his own arms that I twisted and ripped away from his torso while he was screaming how sorry he was and that he couldn't help himself 'cause he was off his meds.



Trogs, you can be my neighbor anytime. I'll even help clear the house with you and pass you some of my tools to do it with.
If I'm on the jury, you'll get a medal rather than a sentence but....

Jury selection would weed out everyone on the forum for unacceptable bias against the poor downtrodden subsistence home invader who was just trying to feed his family before going down to buy drugs on his way to the polling place to vote.

I strongly recommend Massad Ayoob's books which address the second battle in your scenario- the court fight to defend your liberty.

Making statements like the above automatically sentence you to jail in our (US) present judicial system if it can be traced to you. Being right is not enough when there are lawyers about.
Remember it's more about being a system than it is about justice.

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#129951 - 04/11/08 06:02 PM Re: So.....am I crazy? [Re: unimogbert]
Hacksaw
Unregistered


At least in the US your laws clearly start with those freedoms. In Canada the law about such things is so vague and muddy that no two people, experts, cops, or judges seem to agree on what is legal and what isn't.

If you read the law and just interpret the words, everybody would go to jail for shooting another man unless he could prove his life would end if he didn't...regardless of home invasion or any other situational differences.

Perception and reality are completely different. A cop once told me that as long as you don't shoot somebody in the back and you make sure you KILL him and do it ON your property, you'll get off unless your lawyer is completely incompetant regardless of the actual situation.

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#129953 - 04/11/08 06:39 PM Re: So.....am I crazy? [Re: ]
Taurus Offline
Addict

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 423
Loc: Ontario
I guess shooting an intruder with a load of dimes mixed with rock salt would be a wee bit hard to sell to a Judge in Canada. grin

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#129957 - 04/11/08 08:22 PM Re: So.....am I crazy? [Re: Taurus]
Dan_McI Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 12/10/07
Posts: 844
Loc: NYC
Originally Posted By: Taurus
I guess shooting an intruder with a load of dimes mixed with rock salt would be a wee bit hard to sell to a Judge in Canada. grin


You might have a problem with that in the northeastern U.S. states too. But in most of the western states, you would never be indicted.

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#129960 - 04/11/08 08:34 PM Re: So.....am I crazy? [Re: Dan_McI]
Hacksaw
Unregistered


I'd hate to be a medical examiner that day.

Cause of death? Trauma due to internal organs being punctured by 15 dimes.

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#129970 - 04/11/08 10:16 PM Re: So.....am I crazy? [Re: Taurus]
SwampDonkey Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/08/07
Posts: 1268
Loc: Northeastern Ontario, Canada
Hey Taurus,

Glad your are back, you sure do add to the conversation around here.

Concerning reduced shot loads, rock salt and dimes in a shotgun, for home defence check out the website called "The Box of Truth". The author and his buddy test all of these and much more for terminal ballistics. Very well done and interesting, exposes a lot of myths.

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/theboxotruth.htm

If you have never checked out this site before you better; go to the bathroom, send the kids to the neighbours, unplug the phone, make yourself a sandwich and get a beer (or 3) because once you start reading/watching this stuff out you will be busy for a couple hours.

Mike

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