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#109269 - 10/20/07 02:23 AM Re: Another attempt at a kid's hiking kit. [Re: Grant]
teacher Offline
Addict

Registered: 12/14/05
Posts: 691
I agree with the above posts --more 'basics,' fewer tools.

You might start with a kid sized pack (w reflective tape!) wpacked ith a light jacket and room for a 1/2 sized water bottle. Then attach the whistle permantely to the zipper fob, ditto with a coin cell type flashlight.

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#109283 - 10/20/07 06:52 AM Re: Another attempt at a kid's hiking kit. [Re: Grant]
frenchy Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/18/02
Posts: 1320
Loc: France
Warmth : you may add disposable Hand warmers ....
_________________________
Alain

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#109483 - 10/22/07 02:21 PM Re: Another attempt at a kid's hiking kit. [Re: frenchy]
digimark Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/28/07
Posts: 70
Loc: Chesapeake Beach, MD
Thanks for the advice, everyone. We came back from our camping trip. The firesteel worked amazingly well -- my son got the the hang of it and started our campfire with it. (Although it does make a difference if you strike using the UP side of the metal drag. Nor sure why.) So that was an unqualified success. Even my wife is telling her friends how well that worked. We used the campsite fire ring, so we still have to practice using an "in-the-forest" made-up fire pit, so he'll know not to burn the forest down.

The original items I picked were definitely more appropriate for an adult than a child. I was thinking this would be something he could grow into, but of course there's no reason not to add to or supplement as he gets older and more capable. D'oh.

The MKZ "saw" sucked. It made great sawdust powder, but it took ten minutes for them to cut down about 1 1/2" and they gave up before I had to tell them to. I guess it would be better than nothing if you had no other choice, but just barely, and not for a kid. Gone even before I read your advice.

Here's what I'm taking away from your advice:

1. I've visited the Hug-A-Tree page and the Childrens Survival kit page and will incorporate those ideas.

2. The paracord, saw, space blanket and most of the FAK is gone. From the FAK, I'm leaving some bandaids, bug bite wipes, the ointment and the Benedryl/inhaler I added. And I'll put some MP1 tabs in, but we're going to try them first. The stuff I'm taking out can always be added back later if desired.

3. I'm adding the tinder (he knew to look in his pockets for lint -- we had watched Survivorman together. How's that for impressive?!) and the bandanna. I'll work on an instruction card and laminate our picture to the other side of it.

4. The reflective tape is a neat idea.

5. In hindsight a small backpack would be more useful. I'll stick with the fanny packs for now just because we already have them. He wore his seemingly OK but if it were lighter/less full, I'm certain he'd be happier about it.

6. Put food in.

I'll write back with a picture of the results and the instruction card writings asap.

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#109823 - 10/24/07 02:08 PM Re: Another attempt at a kid's hiking kit. [Re: digimark]
DaveT Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 08/15/03
Posts: 208
Loc: NE Ohio
Thanks for the after-action report. Good to see what worked and what didn't.

If you're looking for something to replace your saw, I've had really good luck with the Gerber/Fiskars Sport Saw. I got several of these years ago, and have one in each car and one in the garage.

Gerber Fiskars Sports Saw

Very aggressive teeth, stores well inside the very hard plastic/resin handle, and it's a very handy size. Only weak points I see to it is that you use that orange nut to tighten the blade into place feels like it may someday fail to snug down, or perhaps strip threads if used too roughly, and I take care about bending/flexing the blade too much when I'm sawing. That said, it goes right through branches in the 3-4 inch diameter range, and I've gone through bigger stuff when large branches were downed in my back yard by cutting at an angle to get a wedge out, then sawing straight through the remainder.

Anyway, thanks again for the update, and would love to hear how well the changes work out.

Dave


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#110046 - 10/25/07 08:23 PM Re: Another attempt at a kid's hiking kit. [Re: DaveT]
digimark Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/28/07
Posts: 70
Loc: Chesapeake Beach, MD
First draft at a kid's instruction sheet. It doesn't show it in the posting, but all caps and the first line of each numbered paragraph are bolded. Also, I haven't formatted this into a card yet -- I want to get the wording right first. Comments please. -Gary

---------------------------------------------------------------

FROM Mommy & Daddy, if you need itÖ

1. STOP. Sit down. DONíT PANIC. If you donít know where we are, and you donít know where you are, youíre lost. Itís OK Ė it happens. We wish you werenít, but you are, and now you have to think and do things to help us get you home safe. FIRST THINGS FIRST: STAY WHERE YOU ARE. Moving around will only get you more lost. WE WILL COME TO FIND YOU. STAY THERE.
2. THINK. Donít do anything until youíve thought it through.
3. OBSERVE (LOOK AROUND). How long before it gets dark? Is it cold, hot, or OK? Are you thirsty or hungry? What do you have with you that you can use?
4. PLAN. Until we come to find you, what can you do to help wait? Without walking around, what can you do to help us hear and see you?
5. Am you hurt? Use band-aids, wipes and ointment to clean and cover cuts and scrapes.
6. If itís cold, stay warm. Put on your hat, gloves and jacket Ė whatever you may have. But donít let yourself sweat Ė sweat can make you colder. Use the poncho and hand warmer to cover up and keep warm.
7. Blow on your whistle. Three shorts blows Ė WHISTLE WHISTLE WHISTLE tells anyone that hears, that youíre lost and need help. (Donít blow three whistles unless youíre lost!)
8. If itís sunny, use the signal mirror. Aim through the hole so that the flash "dances" on the plane in the sky or off in the distance.
9. Save your food and water for as long as you can. Once its gone, you wonít have any more until we find you, so try to make it last.
10. If there is water nearby, you must not drink it unless you know its clean. Fill your water bottle up and then put ONE water pill in it. WAIT AT LEAST ONE HOUR BEFORE YOU DRINK IT.
11. If it begins to rain, cover yourself with your rain poncho. Zip up your clothes, and try to get under as much cover as you can to stay dry. But if you do get wet, donít worry -- youíll be OK, You can dry off afterward.
12. We may not find you until after it gets dark. If that happens, youíll have to stay where you are in the dark. Itís OK. Stay covered under your poncho, as warm as possible. If youíre still cold, you can stuff leaves into your jacket and pants to add more insulation. Noises you hear are just that Ė noises. So try not to let them spook you. And you might want to make a fireÖ
13. How to make a fire:
a. Clear a flat area of ground. Take all the branches, leaves, rocks, everything away so nothing will burn unless you want it to. We donít want to start a forest fire! Look up to make sure there are no low-hanging tree limbs.
b. If you can find some rocks nearby, gather them and make a fire ring in the center of the cleared area. Try not to use wet rocks Ė the heat can make them explode!
c. Gather as many dead branches and fallen pieces of wood as you can, at least two arm-loads. Donít pull branches off the trees unless you have to. Youíll need two types Ė stuff like dry brown leaves that you can use to get the fire going, and heavier, thicker branches that will keep the fire going for a while.
d. Build it into a pile in the middle of your fire ring. Push some of your tinder under the pile, and use your firesteel to start the fire. Slowly feed it wood. Once youíve run out, you wonít have a fire until you can find more wood, so do your best to keep it going as long as possible. You may have to gather
10 to 12 armloads of branches to last the night. It doesnít have to be bright and super-hot to be a good fire.
e. Donít breathe in the smoke. Be careful not to dangle your clothes too close to the fire Ė you donít want them to catch on fire.
f. When itís light again, make sure the fireís out as best you can.
g. AND ALWAYS Ė DONíT FORGET Ė IF YOU"RE NOT CAREFUL YOU CAN GET BURNED. So BE CAREFUL!
14. Keep looking at our family picture. WE ARE COMING TO FIND YOU. Donít lose hope, and stay safe.


Edited by digimark (10/25/07 08:25 PM)

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#110073 - 10/26/07 12:08 AM Re: Another attempt at a kid's hiking kit. [Re: digimark]
teacher Offline
Addict

Registered: 12/14/05
Posts: 691
digi -- nice start. My first impression is that its way too lon. You are trying to teach on this card - instead you should be trying to get the kid not to panic and stay in one place. That's it.

teacher

My rough edit below


STOP. Sit down. .

STAY WHERE YOU ARE.

WE WILL COME TO FIND YOU. STAY THERE.


6. If itís cold, stay warm. Put on your hat, gloves and jacket Ė whatever you may have. But donít let yourself sweat Ė sweat can make you colder. Use the poncho and hand warmer to cover up and keep warm.

7. Blow on your whistle. Three shorts blows Ė WHISTLE WHISTLE WHISTLE tells anyone that hears, that youíre lost and need help. (Donít blow three whistles unless youíre lost!)


11. If it begins to rain, cover yourself with your rain poncho. Zip up your clothes, and try to get under as much cover < my note : 'what does 'cover ' mean to an 8 year old? what you mean to say is ' gst under a tree'>
as you can to stay dry.

Keep looking at our family picture. WE ARE COMING TO FIND YOU. stay right where you are..

love mom & dad ( and barkley the dog)

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#110109 - 10/26/07 06:26 AM Re: Another attempt at a kid's hiking kit. [Re: teacher]
aloha Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 11/16/05
Posts: 1047
Loc: Hawaii, USA
I'm with teacher. The whole kit that we made up was to encourage the child to stay put, drink water, not get too hot or too cold, and to give them something to do while staying put including actively signally with their whistle, mirror, flashlight, etc.

I also have told our kids since they usually do outdoor stuff in a group that if they get lost, to take turns signalling while they wait in one spot.

Oh yeah, we also tell them to stay put on the trail unless it is dangerous to do so.
_________________________
---------
http://hanzosoutdoors.blogspot.com/

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#110200 - 10/26/07 10:16 PM Re: Another attempt at a kid's hiking kit. [Re: aloha]
massacre Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 12/07/05
Posts: 781
Loc: Central Illinois
I'm working on some cheap kits Aloha, and I read through your previous thread for ideas as well. I've searched and searched, checked my bookmarks and for the life of me can't find this... I'm looking for the $1 LED coin-cell keychain flashlights. They look like a cheapo Photon, but for my purposes, that's plenty. I seem to recall them being sold in lots of 10. Does anyone remember these and have a link?

Thanks!
_________________________
Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards.

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#110222 - 10/27/07 01:07 AM Re: Another attempt at a kid's hiking kit. [Re: massacre]
Alex Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 03/01/07
Posts: 1034
Loc: -
Check eBay. Many offers like 13 for $10 shipped. Just bought such a lot for presents. Very good quality, continuous and momentary modes.

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#110224 - 10/27/07 01:15 AM Re: Another attempt at a kid's hiking kit. [Re: massacre]
ironraven Offline
Cranky Geek
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 4642
Loc: Vermont
CountyComm had them.
_________________________
-IronRaven

When a man dare not speak without malice for fear of giving insult, that is when truth starts to die. Truth is the truest freedom.

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