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#106577 - 09/21/07 08:21 PM Re: Long-term survival planning in a condo [Re: bws48]
philip Offline
Addict

Registered: 09/19/05
Posts: 639
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Quote:
a good place to start is at
http://outdoors-magazine.com/s_article.php?id_article=171
There is alot there, and may take several readings.

:-> No, only one. The best comment to his article is "What a freakin geek." I was thinking the same thing as I looked at his pictures and read about him having his wool vest custom made for him and that he wears it year-round. What a freaking geek.

By the way, I notice he says, 'With the home improvement store right next door to my worksite, I think it is likely that should we have to construct temporary shelter we could “source” tarps, lumber, rope and tools, but having a small highly effective set of these tools is one of my kit requirements.'

What is it you think he means by "sourcing" tarps?

The complete freakin geek quote is,

Quote:
What a freakin geek. Nice thought out kit. You sit at a desk all day with 6 knives, vaseline soaked tinder and an extension antenna.

Doesn’t your mother ship have the capability to just beam you up if there is a disaster?


Schwert's "On-Body Kit" article doesn't address my needs, fortunately.

Your comment:
Quote:
Planning on anything that can be later viewed as looting is not really planning. The point, I think, is to plan to avoid that necessity.

Hence, my question: What do other people who live in urban areas with no storage space do? [edit: Are we back to Schwert "sourcing" tarps, lumber, and stuff?]

So far, the best idea seems to be storing stuff in a car outside. Which you thoughtfully repost.

Quote:
Just my thoughts.

Yeah, thanks.


Edited by philip (09/21/07 08:23 PM)

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#106578 - 09/21/07 08:34 PM Re: Long-term survival planning in a condo [Re: Russ]
philip Offline
Addict

Registered: 09/19/05
Posts: 639
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Quote:
How long does it take to get from your condo, into your car and onto the street? A lot of buildings will remain standing but will be totally unsafe to reenter.

It'll take too long because all the parking is under the condos in a closed garage. It's three flights down, through a locked door, then the garage door has to open.

I'll start trying parking on the street, and see how long I can maintain my interest in having to move the car every three days in accordance with municipal ordinances (at least one neighbor takes it on him/herself to call in cars parked too long).

Quote:
... the kit is with you ...

Luke! Use the kit! :->

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#106580 - 09/21/07 08:36 PM Re: Long-term survival planning in a condo [Re: philip]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5339
Loc: SOCAL
Originally Posted By: philip
Hence, my question: What do other people who live in urban areas with no storage space do?
Most don't do anything because they know it won't happen while they live there, only after they leave.

Kinda like me in SOCAL. I am well prepared to bug-in or hang with friends near where I work, but I'd rather be many places other than SOCAL or anywhere in CA when the Big One hits. . . maybe next year :rolleyes: For now my major kit is in my truck; there's much more food, water and fuel at home and if that's still standing I'm in great shape, but I need to be there. If I'm anywhere else I can bug in place until it's time to move on (walking or driving).
_________________________
Better is the Enemy of Good Enough.
Okay, what’s your point??

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#106581 - 09/21/07 08:40 PM Re: Long-term survival planning in a condo [Re: NightHiker]
philip Offline
Addict

Registered: 09/19/05
Posts: 639
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Quote:
... somebody like me who isn't likely to resort to looting in most disaster scenarios but wouldn't feel too bad about shooting a thief and and taking his stuff.

I'll let that comment stand on its own.

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#106584 - 09/21/07 08:45 PM Re: Long-term survival planning in a condo [Re: philip]
Russ Offline
Geezer

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 5339
Loc: SOCAL
Originally Posted By: philip
It'll take too long because all the parking is under the condos in a closed garage. It's three flights down, through a locked door, then the garage door has to open.
Yep, and by the time you get there the power will have shut down and the door won't open.

Make up a BOB or Go-Bag (whatever you want to call it) and have a set of work clothes (HD outerwear, boots and gloves) in another bag you can grab and go. Change into the work clothes in a safer location. Watch out for broken glass.
_________________________
Better is the Enemy of Good Enough.
Okay, what’s your point??

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#106587 - 09/21/07 08:57 PM Re: Long-term survival planning in a condo [Re: philip]
Blast Offline
INTERCEPTOR
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 07/15/02
Posts: 3684
Loc: TX
Philip,

What is the general layout of your condo? Are there other condos above/below it or is it more of a townhouse/brownstone style? How big is your garage? Can you access the roof of your condo? Can others access your roof? When was it built and what were the building codes then? What is it made of?

With that information we should be able to figure out where stuff might be accessible if the condo collapses.

The Triangle of Life has been discredited for saving lives, but it might help you save some gear...

-Blast


_________________________
Foraging Texas
Medicine Man Plant Co.
DrMerriwether on YouTube
Radio Call Sign: KI5BOG
*As an Amazon Influencer, I may earn a sales commission on Amazon links in my posts.

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#106590 - 09/21/07 09:06 PM Re: Long-term survival planning in a condo [Re: philip]
philip Offline
Addict

Registered: 09/19/05
Posts: 639
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Okay, so it looks like my best option is to use a car to store stuff in and to park it on the street instead of in the garage under the condos.

Enough people have suggested off-site rental that I'll look further into that. My initial impression is that there are no self-storage units within reach, but I'll confirm that and reconsider based on location and possible survivabililty. (I'm aware, for example, of a former moving and storage building that's been converted to self-storge, but it's in a three- or four-story building of unreinforced masonry. It's within a long walk, but that building won't be standing.)

On suggestions to hike out, that's another idea I'd discounted but that I'll reconsider. We're on a peninsula, so we're limited to hiking from mid-peninsula towards San Jose. It may be that it's not possible to hike out, given the geographical constraints along with the issues of health and age. A two-day hike for a twenty-something man in an area where the safer destinations could be anywhere in 360 degrees is not going to be a two-day hike for my wife and me, and the only safer destination is south, where it may be no safer there than here. But it still should be on the agenda as a consideration, because we have no clue where the area of destruction will lie, especially if a local fire causes more destruction than the quake itself. (Or that dreaded tsunami washes into the bay against the advice of all those experts.)

It was interesting to note that most of the suggestions were self-referential: people said what they would do in their area at their age and in their health. I didn't even think about my constraints when I stated my problem and asked for suggestions, and it was educational to see how people answered. Fine-tuning what my situation was resulted in several fine-tuned answers, which I appreciate. (My question was just as self-referential, of course - I assumed my area, my age, and my health would be taken into account.)

Many thanks for the time and thought you've all put in - I do have a good answer, and I have good reason to re-think a couple of areas I'd discounted.

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#106593 - 09/21/07 09:23 PM Re: Long-term survival planning in a condo [Re: philip]
JCWohlschlag Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 11/26/06
Posts: 724
Loc: Sterling, Virginia, United Sta...
It seems to me that you didn’t really think much about Schwert’s article. The main purpose of Schwert’s article was to show the structure of how a full survival kit is assembled, i.e. the redundancy of on-body, carry bag, car, work, home, and friend/relative/out-of-area location kits.

The fact of the matter is this: there is no single solution to this question. There is no magic answer that will solve all of the problems, just like there is no magic kit that will solve all of your problems.

The things you can do to prepare for an earthquake are the same things that everyone else can do to prepare for an earthquake. All of them have already been suggested here: have a properly equipped go-bag next to your bed, have a properly equipped car kit (you might wanna think about a work kit, too), carry decent EDC gear, get a public storage space, and find a friend or relative that lives out of the area.

These suggestions are meant to be collective together to increase your chances no matter what happens. There are too many variables for this to be a simple solution, therefore some sort of redundancy is necessary.

You cannot rely solely on the car kit because you cannot guarantee your car will be available after an earthquake. You cannot solely rely on stuff stored in your condo because you cannot guarantee that your condo will be available (or standing) after an earthquake. After those two are exhausted, it goes to the public storage space, then to the friend’s or relative’s place.

If you want to start looting after the disaster, that’s up to you. The good and the bad is a debate for another thread. Personally, I’d like to have enough stashes of stuff located in various places to know that I wouldn’t have to loot to survive. That’s what planning is. Planning to loot is no plan at all.

The decision to park your car on the street sounds like a feasible one. Having to move your car at least every three days doesn’t sound like much of an inconvenience, and it will give your car kit a greater chance of survival.

If you think there are no public storage places in your neighborhood, then you might want to look harder or expand your perception of what your neighborhood is. There may not be one 500 feet from your condo, but I can almost guarantee you that there is one within 5 or 10 miles. It may not be the perfect storage place, either, giving you 24-hour access and a fault-tolerant access system, but something is better than nothing. If you’re wondering how you would transport goods, a bicycle with racks and/or a folding cart could be used. You can store them at the condo, at the storage place, or one at each.

Remember, the goal isn’t to give yourself a solution, because there really isn’t one. It is to give yourself options.

P.S.: Forgot to add this originally… If you are really that concerned about the structural integrity of your condo, the best (and most complex, definitely) preparation you could make is to move. Move to a regular stick-built house, or move to an area that doesn’t have earthquakes. Of course, none of the above kits and storage spaces can be done in a day, and neither can moving.

P.P.S: Additionally, taking a look at your home and attempting to mitigate any risks of falling furniture and so forth is something you can to today (or tomorrow), and could greatly increase your chances of getting out of the condo alive before it does collapse.


Edited by JCWohlschlag (09/22/07 06:46 PM)
Edit Reason: Additions & typos
_________________________
“Hiking is just walking where it’s okay to pee. Sometimes old people hike by mistake.” — Demitri Martin

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#106641 - 09/22/07 12:08 PM Re: Long-term survival planning in a condo [Re: ironraven]
Brangdon Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/12/04
Posts: 1204
Loc: Nottingham, UK
Originally Posted By: ironraven
You'd be amazed how little space two weeks of food actually takes up when all is said and done. It is water that is bulky. Store what you eat, and rotate it.
It's the rotation that's the problem for me. It's easy enough to stash food in little obscure hidey-holes, but if I am to "store what I eat, and eat what I store" then it needs to be accessible so I can do that. I currently store 3 times as much tinned sweet corn as tinned carrots, because the corn comes in plastic-wrapped packs of 3 tins so it's easier to move around and stack. The carrots are individual tins; if I stack them it becomes to hard to get at the bottom tins, and I need to do that whenever I buy new.
_________________________
Quality is addictive.

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#106664 - 09/22/07 05:33 PM Re: Long-term survival planning in a condo [Re: philip]
Stu Offline
I am not a P.P.o.W.
Old Hand

Registered: 05/16/05
Posts: 1058
Loc: Finger Lakes of NY State
Originally Posted By: philip
What's the agenda for people who live in cities with no space for bulky food storage?


Put the bed up on risers or blocks to increase under bed storage. Do you have a balcony? Gear wrapped in tarps can become plant stands on the balcony. Gear and supplies and be stored under hanging clothes in closets. Utilize all the cabinets in your kitchen and bath, most people have room in there. Move the couch out 6" from the wall - great place for storage of thin containered items.
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Our most important survival tool is our brain, and for many, that tool is way underused! SBRaider
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