Getting home; drive, ride, walk...

In a 'situation' the first choice is often to drive home, failing that to ride ( L, Bus, subway) and then to walk.

These all require different mindsets, planning, equipment and time.

First choice is drive, second choice is catch a ride with a coworker (preferably Amanda :D), third is call someone to get me (probably not an option in a disaster), fourth is to try talking the boss into hauling people home using our huge rigs, fifth would be walking to one of the many nearby shops and buy a bicycle. Sixth would be buy a cheap motorcycle from the place across the street.

Seventh would be jump a train, the tracks pass right by both work and home. However, I'd most likely end up cut in half which would be a bad thing.

-Blast

If you cannot drive home, a ride from someone else might not do any good. Nor would using a different vehicle magically solve the problem of disrupted roadways.

Bicycles and motorcycles can get through where cars cannot, so they are worthy of consideration.

Public transit in a survival emergency? If it has dedicated routes other than those that are impossible to drive home, okay. So the bus doesn't look like a strong contender. Rail in any flavor, maybe.

A flood emergency brings the idea of water transport into play.

Walking is pretty much the fallback.

A premium would be placed on the earliest knowledge of developing problems and quick, appropriate response. Driving before the traffic snarls up, for example, even if it means bailing out of other commitments.

Home to job #1 = 1.2 miles. Normally drive, but walk when it snows: to get home involves going up a hill with a sharp corner. If there are snowflakes in the air, someone is always wiped out, and blocking traffic in both directions.

Home to job #2 = 15 miles. Normally drive, but could use one of the work motorcycles to get home, if need be. I've walked it, but only to say that I did. No public transit.
[/i]Edit: [i]If it was just for one night, I'd stay there.

Very true, but it depends on the situation. Houston floods on an almost regular schedule, however I didn't know this when I first moved here. A storm hit during working hours that flooded many roads. The Honda Civic I owned at the time was trapped in the company parking lot but my coworker with the Ford Expedition had no problems driving me home.

I highly recommend learning if any coworks live near you. This can help even in small situations like car trouble. And if something happens where you all have to walk home there's safety in numbers.

-Blast

Never forget it's possible to combine methods of transportation. I've used methods that got me closer than walked many times.

When in doubt, hoof it out.

It is very important to learn lessons from history. To think you can plan for something without looking at history is dangerous.

Let’s just put terrorism into this scenario and look at resent terrorist attacks in three cities, NYC, Madrid and London. Each of these attacks affected the transport systems, Madrid and London attacks were specifically targeted at the transport systems. The London attack was a sustained attack hitting tube lines and surface roads. In both Madrid and London the transport systems ether ground to a holt or were closed. In NY the shear scale of the attack instantly affected the transport systems.

In all cases the roads were clogged by many thousands of people moving away from the attack location. Then the arthritis started closing off areas to evacuate them, this put even more people on the streets and the road systems ground to a holt and traffic backed up for miles in all directions. Vehicles had no where to go because the roads were blocked by traffic in front and behind including side roads. Add to the fact that the emergency services need to move through this traffic to get to the site of the attack. The authorities will eventually want to turn all the traffic around and clear many of the streets so that the roads are clear for searching for secondary devices, evacuation and emergency services.

Now let’s scale up the scenario to an earthquake, dirty bombs, floods, metropolitan tornados, ice storms or snow. Adding to the fact you may not even be able to reach your vehicle. Transport systems may be blocked by debris, vehicles damaged by falling debris and mass casualties in the street.

Reaching your vehicle may be the desired option to get you home but if that is possible the transport systems may be blocked or very slow moving. Being on foot may be still the best or only option.

It is important to build this fact into you planning. You spend the majority of the day at work; if you work in an office have a kit that will allow you to walk out. Be mindful that you might not have a home to go to so your kit maybe the only things you are left with.

Let the situation dictate your action, it might be a case that you are in relatively safety at work, consider whether it might be a better option to stay put and spend the night or two there. The chances are the building you are in is built to a higher standard than your home; this is true for tower blocks. Many large office building have redundancy built in, they may have back up power systems, large water storage facilities and enough chocolate, crisps and other food stuffs in vending machines and colleagues desks to feed a small army.

Don’t get into the trap of thinking a vehicle is your plan or the answer to your problem. It is not, it is a tool that if you have to hand can aid you in carrying out you plan.

Option 1 is move close to work. Maybe I'm just lucky but our city as the cost of doing business downtown kept going up most of the larger companies built office buildings on the north side of the city outside the outerbelt. I've worked here since 2001 and had to drive 20 miles each way. Last year when we were looking at moving I found all these nice houses between 150k and 200k in all the nice suburbs and then found this house for 169 right across the street in a small subdivision. I did everything I could to get in the house across the street, went real easy on the inspection, paid all the closing costs nstead of asking them to, etc. So I now work .5 miles from work. If somehting happens I can work home, bicycle, etc. Even if I were to be laid off from my current job there are lot of other companies around this area so while I would have liked to have been further outisde of the city to have some more land I can;t compain about having everything I need within a mile radius.

Eugene,

Living that close to your place of employment, have you considered that the emergency situation at work might also encompass your home turf?

That is something I've taken into account. I work for a nationally known company in one of their large offices (10,000 employees). A major electric feed comes in right to the south of my neighborhood so we still have power when people elsewhere will be without. But the largeness of the company and such makes it be a possible target.
I used to carry a lot of gear in my truck so I could make it the 20 miles home, now I shifted most of that gear to home since its nothing to make it home. I now have a small old camper that I'm currently rebuilding the roof on sitting in my garage that will be ready to go at a moments notice. Plus exploring back roads so I know alternate routes and being outside the city's outerbelt help with that some.

You're making an assumption you'll always be able to get home. Consider the possibility of other emergencies occuring that could prevent you from getting home (i.e. natural gas leak ). I would suspect that safety zones around such things would still be in place, even after an event of national significance (unless everyone is gone for one reason or another, which would most likely include you)

Wife is a stay at home mom, so her and both kids would be in the house so if I were trying to drive that way, I would try to convince the LEO I needed in to get them, or have her grab whatever will fit in her car and meet me someplace.
I'm close enough that I can see my office building out of the kids bedroom window so at worst case I walk around the side of the neighborhood and sneak through the woods if they are still in the house.

You don't already have a meeting place set up? Dude, you need to get more paranoid!

-Blast

I have a 13 mile walk if I need to get home on foot, which Google tells me would take a little over 4 hours. This is assuming that I am uninjured and things aren't all hosed up (which they probably are, if I'm walking home from work).

I have gear in my EDC Bag to make that hike doable, even with an overnight or two tossed in. I can also use this gear to SIP at the office for a few days. More if they share their supplies with contractors...

Actually have more than one meeting place, I just was generalizing.

Ah, a should have known better.
Well done, sir.

-Blast

I think it's worthwhile to actually try hoofing it home from work to see what it's like.

I grew up in San Francisco and had my impressions of what constituted "close" and "far" inside the city. After spending years living in NYC and doing a LOT of walking, I eventually came back to San Francisco for a couple years. I had always thought that my work was "far" from our apartment. Mentally, I couldn't picture myself really trying to walk home because of my previous ideas about distance within the city. But one day, I tried it, and it wasn't bad at all. After that, I tried making it a point to walk home a couple days a week, mostly for exercise, but also to just be comfortable with walking all the way home. What seemed almost crazy before quickly became commonplace.

You may be pleasantly surprised by how do-able walking home could be. The biggest hurdle could just be mental. If something happens and there is gridlock, hoofing it could easily turn out to the be fastest way home. (Have comfortable shoes!) I've had a number of experiences stuck in traffic or trying to use public transit where in hindsight, I just wished that I had walked in that situation.

WRT public transportation such as subway and/or bus. Are there any protocols in place for disasters where the bus or subway goes into lockdown and no one gets on or off and it goes to a "safe" place. Thats just somehting I could forsee happening, you evac work and try to get on a bus going toward your home and the bus gets orders to turn around and go the other way.

I don't know how subway systems are intended to react during disasters - mostly I assume they'll stop until the track integrity can be checked and obstructions cleared, then if there is power they will continue to run (as long as there are train operators). I know in King County the objective is to keep buses running on the same basis, at least to finish their routes / shifts and clear a possible backlog of riders. I have heard their radio traffic after a snowstorm, buses get frequent radio comms telling them about road conditions ahead on their routes. Its just a variation on the tried and true adapt, improvise and overcome strategy. But it points to a pretty important thing about disasters: there is no secret protocol for how transit operators will react after an uncommon disaster, they will probably react pretty much like they do after common ones. I know of no credible strategy to return all buses to base, passengers be damned. If the buses are blocked by traffic, they're not going anywhere, and you should walk. Most times if the bus is running, it will get you there, eventually. But if the bus driver abandons his bus, something truly weird is underway, you should consider leaving the area too...

For us it's either drive, hitch, walk, and soon we are gonna keep a bike in our vehicle in case the roads are packed and we need to get home. W/nearly 50 miles to cover and thousands of feet to climb walking would take a couple days!

Actually trying it out seems to be a really good idea. Something that keeps niggling at the back of my mind (man it's dark in there) is that quite some time ago (probably years), there was a posting by a guy who did just that. He wrote it up about what worked and what didn't and so forth. It was a really good posting. I have tried the search engine, but haven't been able to find it. Does that ring a bell with anyone else, or is my imagination just running wild?

LW


P.S. GREAT new forum section. Thanks to Doug Ritter and the new moderators for the forum and for just doing a great job in general.

Yeah...that sounds familiar. It might have been Raspy though a part of my mind says it was on a different forum.

-Blast

I think it was a different forum.

Walking.

It's the only way in NYC:

http://camworld.org/archives/001236.html

Those pictures are amazing... and make it really hammer home how hard it would be evacuate such a large # of people in short amount of time (walking, driving, biking, train, etc!).

Martin, you've mentioned many times that New York City officals are well prepared for a disaster, but what about the average person there? Have people learned from 9/11 and the blackouts that they should keep an emergency kit on hand?

-Blast

Not sure which you are thinking of. I got stuck without wheels for a week this January, and had to run my "walk out" drill nightly. I know we've had a few people write up after actions after such things, intentional or otherwise.

There are some things they have in common though, which you can prepare yourself for.

Your need to know how to get where you are going is one of those things. You can prepare yourself for that in a few ways.
You should have a map. It does not need to be the most expensive, even a cheap street map can help a lot.

Get familiar with landmarks in your city, you should be able to orient yourself by looking at the city skyline. It might not be exact but it certainly does not hurt.
(edit: magnetic compasses are shockingly inaccurate in cities, too much metal and electricity around them)

It would be good to be familiar with your city's grid system. Knowing which side of the streets are odd numbers and even, which direction the numbers get bigger or smaller in Here the numbers get bigger as you go north and go west, the last place started from the center of town and the numbers grew as you went farther away from the town center. Whether the street names are alphabetical order or not you should know too. (again, for orienting yourself without a compass)
These are all things that can help you not get lost.

Of course you should walk at least some of your route once if you can. You should also explore alternate routes.
The shortest way home on foot is likely not the same as the fastest way to drive home, and it is likely to change in an emergency.

You may be thinking of the story, "The Long Road Home."

I'm sure Google will get you to it.

OK,

If I get a chance I'll look around some more. I'm thinking it was in here however because the only other forum of this type that I frequent is the Zombie Squad and I found them LONG after I found Equipped To Survive.

I did a search on Raspy's name yesterday but didn't find anything that struck a chord. Oh well ....

On another note entirely ..... I'm now a newbie and no longer a stranger !! Whooo Hoooo !!!

Thanks,
LW

Blast,

That's an interesting question, but I'm afraid we'll all be dissapointed with the answer. In truth, I don't think that the average person is more prepared.

I've had to evacuate from three office buildings in Manhattan over the past eight years (9/11/01, 2003 blackout, 2007(?) steam pipe explosion) and I make sure that I always have, at minimum, a flashlight, comfortable shoes, and a water bottle ready to go (usually I have more than just this). However, when I pull out my light to help find something, most people are incredulous, and would never have thought to carry such a thing on a daily basis. I might get one or two knowing glances out of a group, but that's it.

However, I will say that most offices are much more prepared. There are regular emergency drills, and I have been issued an emergency kit containing a dusk mask, light, water, and even a small battery-powered radio. This will certainly help people who are at their desks to have some small amount of gear to make their treks home more comfortable.

Now that I live out in the 'burbs my trip home will be more complicated than when I lived in Brooklyn or Manhattan, but that's a whole other topic for another day.

Preparation in NYC? I also live in the 'burbs, acually only about six miles south of the Indian Point nuclear power plant - and i agree with Jesselp that while institutionally companies, building management and the city government(s) are better prepared around here, very few people have actually improved their own personal or family preparation.

that's anecdotal, based on people I know.

Since the companies are doing the heavy(?) lifting, the employees probably feel no need to do any lifting at all.

Bad things happen when you are least prepared.

Considering the number of overpasses between home and the farthest (usually) places I go for work, driving will not be an option if there is an earthquake here. And then there are the large rivers to cross, and about 85 miles of densely-populated terrain. Yuck!

I remember a few years back that a serious traffic accident had caused a major headache for everyone trying to get home. Here are the links.
Link 1
Link 2
Me and a bunch co-workers went to the Like Like Drive In. Got dinner and stayed for an hour and a half. On top of that it took me and another co-worker 3 hours and a half to get home by car. That's 6 hours of headache for a normal 45 minute ride home.

Sounds like a drive I took last winter... I went against the usual VERY LITTLE traffic... I mean population <1000, in the woods, and probably only 60% or less commute further than where I was.. And it was snowing good, multiple spin outs, took me HOURS to get someplace that like you said normally 45min to 1 hour. Not to mention the constant stop and go on ice slick snow covered roads! I almost saw a bunch more accidents that way too. Sure wish I would have turned around when I cuold have

If that were to happen, I would first do everything I can to know why. If the bus driver abandoned a perfectly working bus with an "every man for himself" mentality, I would try to contact DART (Dallas Area Rapid Transit). If I can't get a hold of DART because everything has gone to blazes in a hand basket, and if no one else has stepped up to the plate, I may get behind the wheel if I have a justifiable reason. By this time I would have already taken my anxiety medication. I have already closely observed bus operators several times in the event, for whatever justifiable reason there may be, I need to take the wheel. "It's just like driving a really big Pinto." -- Speed

Jeanette Isabelle

If it's bad enough and I have to go home, I'm in the company van and can drive it as rough as need be.

If it's bad and I'm leaving home, then I'm in my Jeep. And I can use it like one would use a tank.

If I'm walking, it's really gotten bad.

Oldie but goodie. . .?
If I'm away and can't drive home it's either because the truck broke down, in which case I make a call and get it towed and fixed. Then I drive home or I find a hotel.

If the truck isn't broken and I can't drive home it means the roads are blocked for some reason. In SOCAL that may mean the "Big One" just hit and the road system an a lot of other infrastructure is damaged. This is where the 96 hr kit plays a big role.

...The point is to plan...and then create a back-up for that plan. For me - I'll drive home. If I can't drive, I'll ride. If I can't ride, I'll walk.

Each plan takes some consideration -- and a different set of tools.

I have only read half of the posts so forgive me if sopmeone has already suggested this. How about putting a bicycle in the trunk of your car and keep it there (as EDC) whenever you go to work.

As for me, I am too overweight and out of shape to do it, but lying in our back yard are 4 bicycles of different sizes. Kids have grown and don't want to ride them anymore. Sometimes I have seen full grown men riding smaller bikes with handlebars and seats pulled up as far as possible to accomodate an adult. Th eadult size bike will get you home faster but the smaller one will fit even in truncks of smaller cars.

You may choose an adult size or kid size bike as a bug out vehicle, or you may even use it as a barter tool to get a ride LOL.

In my case, IF I did this, the goal will not be to reach my home ( I would have a heart attack before reaching there LOL ) but the goal is to reach a relaticve's house a few miles from my office building. From there I may stay with them or pick a ride to my house. If it was that messy, it would almost definitely mean staying with them for sometime.

Having said that, my 1st option , if anything happen NOW, is to inform our buiding security that I am going to sleep in my office for the night. I have enough stuff for 2-3 days.

Some people have been known to stash a bike at their office.
If you have a mountain bike you can pack it into a pretty small space by taking the wheels off.

If you put a wrench with it so you can remove the front forks and handle bars you can usually fit a bike into a large duffle bag.
A bag they use to pack wheel chairs for travel by plane or train should do nicely.

It usually takes 15 minutes or less to pack or reassemble one.
It helps to have enough cable to let you remove the handle bars without needing to unhook the cables.

This evening I was discussing this forum with friends. I specifically mentioned the post above and ran the only conceivable scenario I could think of. I don't know the blast radius of a nuclear explosion and we, my friends and I, had different ideas on the most likely place in the Metroplex where a nuclear explosion would take place. It may come down to the intent of the responsible party.

The scenario: A nuclear explosion has struck the Dallas-Fort Worth International Airport. News of this has quickly spread like a wildfire, everyone in the vicinity who is awake and breathing knows about it. The driver of the bus I'm riding has deviated from the rout to get home so he and his family can get out of Dodge. He leaves the bus running and he sprints. I am unable to catch him. The driver is now AWOL. I can't get in touch with DART and I am unable to use my cell phone to get in touch with my family. I'm the only passenger willing to attempt to drive the bus. Depending on where we are, I may drive East or South. I ask my fellow passengers, hopefully there aren't many, if they wish to be dropped off or make a quick stop at their home. If their home is close to our location, and if it appears we are out of the immediate blast radius, or is on our way out of Dodge, I stop. If my home is on the way out of Dodge, I'll make a quick stop there and one other place. If my family is there, great, if not I will quickly gather needed gear. Now would be a good time to have a bug out bag. I may quickly make an indication I was home. From their, I need to make a decision, head south or east. Where I'm headed depends on two factors: First, what is the traffic like on the different routs? Second, where would my fellow passengers want to go?

Jeanette Isabelle

"It may come down to the intent of the responsible party."

Intent is one thing, ability to execute the plan is something else. Terrorists and other criminals often make really stupid mistakes.

I believe survival near the blast site depends on several things: power of the bomb, if it was detonated at ground level or in the air, etc.

The concussion from the blast is going to make stuff that wasn't vaporized initially turn into dangerous missiles: chunks of building concrete, steel beams, telephone poles, light standards, vehicles, cornerstones, bronze lions, etc. Can you imagine all the parts of of NYC being reduced to chunks of various sizes, moving parallel to the ground at high rates of speed? It would be a truly ugly sight.

Survival would probably depend on sheer dumb luck. The idea of an open street is more than I can imagine. Multiply the crash of the Twin Towers by 50,000, with debris moving sideways.

Sue

Ride home from someone else... Would this include prior planning that should they be stuck at your house and have no supplies of their own that you now have to make a choice? Cut them off or include them into your food/water/waste provisions? Were they eleceted DD because they were one of the few people in the parking lot who had 4 wheel drive? If so how many people were they trying to drop off before or after they arrived at your house and could go no further? 1 guest becomes more.

So the border is closed, and you are on one side with your family on the other.

How are you going to get home? If it is a short term closing, I would say wait it out. Long term I think one is going to have to start looking for small "county" roads that the locals use day-in and day-out.

Many moons ago we tried an experiment like this in the National Guard. The test was to deploy enough folks to "close" down a single county. All that was really happening was we were watching the regular traffic go by our HMMWV (we weren't stopping any traffic), but being there was the "road block". Then later, a well known local guardsman was flown about in a Black Hawk pointing out all the "border crossings" missed by the map and all the places one could trespass on someone's property to cross said boundary.

At the time I thought a lack of field training budget combined with a state commander who had read too much Tom Clancy produced that training. Then things like Anthrax attacks, Avian Flu, and Swine Flu came about and the memory gained new meaning.

Hummmm, how to get from Calgary, Alberta to DFW, Texas on back roads. I am going to need a map.

We have lots of uncontrolled border crossing you can drive through.

But trust us, once you are here you won't want to leave.

I chose Dallas-Fort Worth International Airport in my scenario for two reasons: First, it is a plausible target. Second, I'm likely to be close enough to need to leave and yet far enough to survive the initial blast.

After carefully examining the map, making a quick stop at home may not be a good idea. The best thing to do is get out of Dallas NOW. Interstate 30, 20 or 45 may be the best choices.

Jeanette Isabelle

My home to work is about 7 miles. I've walked it once when the snow stalled traffic on icy streets, and have ridden my bike to work often enough to know I don't want to ride my bike - too much riding in car traffic. I know one bike shop a few blocks from work where I might buy a bike, but in most circumstances their credit card processing will be down, and if the owner has any wits he will be locked up - most bikes cost more than I carry as pocket change. So if something hits, I plan to walk, its part of my plan worked out with my family:

- check my local environment (workplace): assist anyone who needs help. That may take a while. Phone / message my out of state contact, telling them I'm okay and where I'm moving next, ultimate destination home.
- message and meet up with brothers 2 and 4, who work nearby. We have a contingency to meet outside my building. Brother 2 lives a few blocks from me, brother 4 in another direction. Assess transportation and communications, then head for home. Brother 4 will almost always go another direction, but if we can drive we will divert in direction of his home to see him most of the way home. Vehicle is just that, when the road ends or becomes impassable we get out and walk. It's just a car, I have others.
- check in at the high school my son attends. Schools have a disaster plan, hold til release. That means I need to come and get #1 son or he sleeps on the floor there. I helped pack their container a few weeks ago, its as good a place as any to spend a night. Pick up son, head for home.
- getting from HS to home actually involves a detour around a slough and lots of land that will liquefy in a bad earthquake. It adds 3 miles to the walk home, which is okay, but son will complain.
- home. If my wife has been nearby during an event we'll find her there, if not we may divert to whatever direction she was last located. #1 daughter is now across the lake at college, unless the floating bridges are open there's no way to contact her. Once home I have ham frequencies and contacts on the west side of the lake, if I can raise them I can initiate a message giving our status and trying to find out hers, hopefully she remembers to contact our out of state contact. I also message out of state contacts to give them our status and whereabouts, and try some in-state relatives that should be outside the disaster area. Otherwise I change socks, eat, drink, rub my feet, and take a deep breath. Getting home was an adventure, but I'm sure the fun is just starting. Neighbors with cuts, broken arms and legs, head injuries, crush injuries no power, no food, isolated fires, probably no emergency responders in our area, missing kids and spouses, some fatalities, alot of stress, and people don't always respond well under stress. And I may be experiencing some of this firsthand, if my son or wife can't be found, or can't be moved. Any plan is just a best case - none of this get home plan happens if I'm under rubble or have a broken leg. Then I am depending on the kindness of strangers...

That's definitely something to consider. 1/2 mile isn't very far, disaster-wise.

she (or any SAHM) still needs a get-home plan though. for instance, I'm sure she leaves the house at some point for groceries, errands, doctor appointments, school, general outings.

I lived in NYC until the fall of 2004. I didn't see efforts made by any company I freelanced at, nor hear any mention of any plans. Not even drills. During the blackout the company I worked at was not only staggeringly unprepared (not even a single flashlight in the entire office), but management abandoned the employees without notice. Zero plans, zero leadership, zero responsibility.

I also did not see or hear of any efforts made by the average citizens, to any degree. It's a city with a huge, dense population so statistically I'm sure some people must have made changes, but I never encountered anyone who had made even the smallest attempt at preparation. This is despite the American Red Cross PSAs after 9/11, despite the east coast blackout a few years later and despite others knowing I had a kit (which would have provided the opportunity to share that they had one). Me having put together the most minimal ARC kit was considered "quirky" at best and then ignored, and "anal/paranoid" in most cases.

My observation was people fell into 1 of 2 camps: convinced that the worst had already happened so nothing else would happen again, or totally unable to deal with the subject so they stayed in a safe denial bubble of pretending nothing was wrong. I hope it's changed in the past 5 years.

Like others, for me driving is the preferred option, walking is the last resort.

Among other things, I keep sneakers, a pair of socks and a wheely cart in my car in the event that I need to walk home. My GHB/car kit is in progress, but is mostly set up for a grab-and-go on foot scenario since that's my worst-case plan. Right now I'm lacking a good local map (it's gone missing) and a compass to allow me to navigate by foot, which I've learned is much harder than you'd think when you're used to other transportation. Though fortunately you can usually tell direction here if you can get a glimpse of the mountains.

Fortunately my bf currently works not far from home and works with 2 friends who also happen to live within walking distance. That makes the home-from-work situation much easier for him. Not only is the distance short enough to reasonably walk in a few hours, but he'd likely have well-known company. And if for some reason the car isn't an option he has 2 other people to potentially ride with.

There is some public transport here (buses), but I've never used it. Fortunately one of the stops is very close to my home so I should consider that as an option. I do need to get a schedule, get some details, and keep some bus fare as part of the emergency kit should busing it be a better option (or necessity) to walking.

Y T: "I hope it's changed in the past 4 years."

I got a good paycheck (relatively speaking) last week. I'll bet it all against that.

Sue

Eugene: "Wife is a stay at home mom, so her and both kids would be in the house"

What if the house is the LAST place to be, and she has to evacuate? Please tell me that she isn't going to be sitting there with the kids, waiting for you to rescue her. Please.

Sue