Well-trained dogs as survival aids

Should one or more well-trained dogs be part of your survival strategy?

My dog has ears like a bat. If there is an opossum tiptoeing along the top of the fence, she knows about it.

DOG = EWS (early warning system).

If you were planning on breaking into a stranger's home, would you choose one with or without a dog?

Herding dogs can help round up food. Guard dogs can help catch predatory people (aka 'dog food').

Dogs can dig for water.

Dogs can guard gardens.

Dogs can keep you warm (three-dog nights).

Dogs are far more useful than weird in-laws.

Sue

No - if that is the only reason you are considering getting a dog.

Yes - if you have or want a dog as a companion/partner and understand the commitment you are making in this ages old partnership.

-Eric

I find that most dogs belong to the endless money pit - financial strain of survival. I love dogs and owned a few over the years, but they can be expensive over their lifetime that now often exceeds 10-12 years (depending on breed and size) due to the advances in veterinary care.

If were to own a dog again, it would not be ownership based on a supposed survival aid.

Well trained at what? Personal protection? Home security? Search (& Rescue)? I agree with Susan and Eric. "DOG = EWS (early warning system) . . . Dogs are far more useful than weird in-laws" and "Yes - if you have or want a dog as a companion/partner and understand the commitment you are making in this ages old partnership".

I really like dogs as walking sensor systems to alert me to potential threats early. Don't want a guard/attack dog per se.

A dog can help in searching, making more use of that sensor system. Excellent nose, very good hearing and their eyes are okay but canines see differently. Dog sensors complement human senses very well.

There are the very real morale benefits. You walk in the front door and the dog is beside herself with joy. Dogs are always glad to see you. Always there with a gentle touch and sympathy. You can tell a dog anything and it won't run away or gossip about it. A dog will knock itself out getting you up in the morning and do it without complaint or resentment.

In the field a good dog will stay alert enough, even when asleep, to keep a camp site secure.

Dog can be injured quite easily. Thank goodness my dog's never had an injury on the trail cause I know it would be a major exercise to evac a large dog. Dogs are far higher maintenance than most people realize.

If you want high maintenance, try children. And they're not of much use for survival purposes, either.

Sue

No question dogs are an ongoing resource comittment: time, money, attention, etcetera. Like all family members, it's always something.

Could a well-trained dog help avoid violating the Rule of Threes? I suppose a dog might be able to haul or assist you out of water or a smoke / particulat cloud to enable you to safely breathe no longer than three minutes after such unfortunate encounters.

A dog's body and body heat might make enough shelter to avoid death in three hours in a hypothermia-inducing environment. More than one dog might make a favorable outcome in such situations more certain. Not sure how this would work where the challenge was a hyperthermia-inducing environment.

Dogs may be trained to help you follow the scent of water, I suppose. And they could help dig to a water source if so trained. This could enhance the likelihood of finding water within three days. Of course, they form competitors for any water found.

Hunting could be enhanced by dog use. Perhaps they could be trained to hunt on their own and bring the prey to you. I hesitate to mention that if you find yourself three weeks without food, dog might be find its way on to a survivalist menu [also freeing its components for other survival uses].

For those who wish to avoid testing the potential lethality of three months without human contact, it is not unreasonable to think a dog could substitute to at least extend endurance to loneliness beyond three months.

Dog potential against my current survival categories of First Aid, Shelter, Fire, Water, Food, Navigation, Light, Signaling, Self-protection, Hygiene, and Morale?

Shelter, Water, and Food have been brielfly considered as Rule of Threes categories. I do not see how dogs could assist with Light, Signalling, or Hygiene [except as water plays a role in hygiene]. I suppose dogs could aid an injured person to move and so play a First Aid role.

Dogs could aid in self-rescue type navigation in finding the scent of other humans, their byways, vehicles, livestock, and habitations. Self-protection and morale do seem naturals for dogs.

In addition to the list of potential survival positives listed in the last post, which pretty much defines most of the "well-trained" bit would be for survival, I have been trying to think about how you would want a dog or dogs to otherwise conduct themselves.

I do not know if I have ever even seen a well-trained dog, and I have never owned a dog, so bear with my undoubtedly ignorant ramblings. This would be the start of my how-I-need-my-dog-to-behave list.

Quiet except when we are threatened or on command, including a command for play.

Eliminations when and where commanded, with agreed behavior to indicate pressing need. I have been reading that SAR dogs are trained to do their business on command in garbage bags, for example.

Calm but alert attention to everything around me - not startled or frightened into action or reaction by any of the normal loud noises of the urban environment. Perhaps trained to be steady in the vicinity of gunfire.

Well-socialized, friendly, and patient with non-threatening others.

Primary focus and concern on pleasing me.

Obedient to me, only.

The more I look at this list, the more it seems I would have to go through good-owner training to be able to competently train any dog to be the companion animal I want.

Even elementary dog obedience classes are just as much about training the owner as training the dog. Often times the dog passes, while the owner flunks.

Overall, it appears you want a slave, not a dog. The level of training you are looking at requires a significant investment of time and/or money, as well as the right kind of doggie. Many dogs are not capable of the level of training you are discussing.

Overall, IMHO, resources are better directed elsewhere. I am a dog owner, and, of course, my dog is "well trained," but frankly in a survival situation, she would be a liability, not an asset, overall.

Another thing to consider is the relatively short life span of the dog, relative to the cost of high level training.

The expectations you list will require you to invest a lot of time learning about dogs and dog training before starting on a project with expectations that seem to be at or above those for most working dogs (i.e service dogs, police dogs). Just finding the right dog will be a major undertaking since even with proven training methods and very experienced trainers most service dog candidates get disqualified during the training. Even those that pass the training will only be paired with a compatible human partner.

Frankly I don't think your expectations are realistic, but with the right dog and a lot of time and effort you could probably get a lot what you need (not want) if you are willing to invest the effort. Their are lots of training methods out there and you will need to research them to see what works for you. As a starting point please go to the bookstore or Library and get "How To Be Your Dogs Best Friend" by the Monks of New Skete.

Training isn't everything. My German Shepherds have always been well trained dogs but none of them would meet the needs you list above even though they were very smart dogs. All of them have figured out how to fit in with our family and they have been amazing in their care and support of my son who has multiple physical and cognitive challenges in his life and loves his four legged friends. Partnerships are about give and take, not just a list of expectations.

-Eric

I appreciate the voices of experience.

If it is not too much trouble, could you point out specifically which of my expectations are unrealistic, and why?

I have begun and will contiue reading, thank you for the book reference.

Thanks.

If you commit to something, anything is possible.

I have three self-trained and titled Schutzhund German Shepherds with years of personal and professional training invested in each. They are all independently certified working animals.

However, only one of my dogs (see my avatar) would qualify as "not a burden" if we had to run for our lives. It took me five years to develop the dog to this point.

He is obedient. He stays close. He is a proven serial hunter. Just the other night he caught yet another possum on our evening walk through our woods. He came back to heel position and dropped the animal when I gave the commands. Yuk, but cool at the same time. I praised his effort. I gave the command to heel away and we walked away like it never happened.

He is creative in his methods and ability to find food and water. This is 100% genetic. He always seems OK for it.

He is a ferocious, committed protector, which was developed through years of training, and is regularly proofed with weekly professional training. He really seems to enjoy a good fight. I hope I never have to test this in real life. But I believe he is competent and ready to defend. He is also controllable if something does happen.

I believe that he would be an asset in a survival situation, or at worst, neutral impact.

I think this dog is more the exception than the average. Good dogs are rare finds, and require years of dedicated, competent training to develop once you do find them.

Then once they are developed, they only last a few more years and then they become a burden too.

You have to have generations of dogs in development to ensure this tool is always available.

I have owned at least 10 dogs, before this one. I had professional help selecting the dog, and professional help training the dog. And a lot more professional help training me.

All of my other current or previous dogs would be nothing but hassle in a real survival situation.

Dogs are a lot of work. 24/7/365. Your work schedule, social life, vacations, etc. will all have to accommodate the dog. Also, expect the unexpected when it comes to vet bills and health issues and buy the best premium quality dog food you can afford. Consider it preventive medicine. And unless you can afford a good trainer (they're expensive) expect a lot of frustration and work. My advice for first time dog owners? Get an adult rescue dog thats mellow and well socialized. Every breed imaginable has a rescue society and the dog's history is usually well known. Not to mention rescue dogs are extremely grateful and loyal. And if the dog will not be able to run off leash hiking, in dog parks, etc, on a regular basis then get a small dog. Sorry if I'm over emphasizing the work part, but I find it very sad when people adopt an animal and then give them up when they realize the commitment involved. Something I've witnessed far too often.

If things get really desperate and you eat the dog people give you sympathy for being forced to make such a hard choice. Eat the kids and people look at you funny.

+1 dogs.

You make a very good point. IMHO a lot of people fall in love with the idea of having a pet without realizing that ideas don't puke into your shoes, demand begin let out at inconvenient times, require inoculations and heart-worm medication. Ideas don't get lonely and chew up the couch or scoot their butt across that oriental rug your grandmother gave you.

I've seen too many people who claim to be 'dog lovers' neglect and abuse their animals because they can't bridge the gap between what they think their idealized dog is all about, and what a real dog does.

LMAO. Too true.

"Get an adult rescue dog thats mellow and well socialized."

Those aren't the dogs that usually end up in rescue. Rescue dogs tend to have stupid/lazy/ignorant/etc owners who create the problems and the next owner (if any) ends up having to deal with them. The new owner, if motivated and knowledgeable, first has to deal with the bad behaviors, THEN train them into the good behaviors. Many owners and many dogs don't understand the concept of change.

If you're wanting a dog for survival purposes, you're probably going to fail. What Dweste wants is a robot dog. Robot dogs do exist (usually of the working breeds), but they generally don't act independently with varying conditions, they just wait for commands. If someone throws a large mail bag over you and whacks you in the head with a length of pipe, without any verbal or hand commands, the dog will probably just stand there and watch.

Suppose you do get a 'survival dog', chosen and trained, and you never need it? What then? Is the dog treated as a pet/friend? Is it left out in a run or chained to a stake for the next ten years?

As far as I've seen, the protective instinct in dogs seems to be determined by his relationship with his family. The dog is protecting HIS owner, HIS kids.

Sue

The SAR dog training books are pretty clear that part of the training is protecting their handler, and other friendlies, if threatened without command. Those dogs also constantly react to changing conditions and are trained to deal with them calmly and appropriately. These dogs operate off-lead but rarely out of sight of handler-partners. Robot dogs, if they exist, would not make the grade. Any dogs selected for intense and constant training of the first year or so that do not work out are returned to the breeder as part of the purchase ccontract. Training is usually by owner under the supervision of very experienced trainers and their is frequent supervised testing and training of both owner and dog.

Sue -- his/her pack.

Without training, a dog will revert to instinct. My dogs get behind me when they're scared; as the pack leader, they look to me for protection. They haven't been trained differently. They are very protective of my wife and children, however, and I'm confident that either or both would kill and or die to defend them.

Perhaps I have overestimated your Mark One, Standard Dog.

Hi guys, long term lurker's first post. I work with dogs (but I am not a dog behaviorist and have no qualifications in this field) and this thread finally convinced me to register. There are a lot of interesting points covered that I want to put my thoughts on, I hope I don't ramble too much ;-)

Firstly, don't get a dog unless you are primarily wanting a close relationship with it that goes beyond any possible survival benefits. We need things from dogs, but they also need things from us in order for them to be happy and well balanced. Even if you get the 'perfect' dog, at some stage it will get old and arthritic and you need to care for it then too. Millions of dogs in the western world are euthanized every year because of lazy / uncaring / unthinking owners, it does not reflect well on our society IMO. You are doing the right thing by researching first!

Here in Australia the average cost of a dog over a 10 year life expectancy is $25,000 - bear in mind that for the sort of training you will need this cost will go WAY up, and also that most dogs live well beyond 10 years. Can you afford it? If your dog snaps a cruciate and you have a $5000 vet bill - can you afford it?

Dogs don't belong in the back yard, they are social animals and need to have company. Also outside guard dogs, unless VERY well trained, are too easy to neutralise (poisoning, shooting,letting them escape etc). A dog in the house with the ability to roam everywhere is much more effective, intruders have to break in to neutralise them by which time you are well warned, and they will still hear / smell people from well outside the house. You just have to have the dog in the house - great if you like dogs and want the companionship, not so great if they are just a tool. Can you share a house with your dog, their slobber, their wind and their hair?

Dogs act by instinct unless otherwise trained. This instinct is dependent upon nature and nurture - in other words how they are raised, their personalities and their breed.

Forget most of what you might think you know about dogs - the science has changed hugely over the last 10 years. For the average domestic pet the best training these days is based on Positive Response training, designed to provide a well balanced calm dog that interacts well with family members and the public (human and canine). Forget choke chains and Cesar Milan (if you want to learn about dogs pay for a professional, don't expect to be educated by an entertainment show). Positive Response training is largely about teaching you what motivates your dog and how they think, so you can motivate them into becoming a good family member. Old methods are based on fear, and can create an unpredictable dog and in a family / civilian environment that is dangerous.

For what you are suggesting, this sort of training will go a long way, but not the whole way. If you want a dog to attack on command, only take food from you (very important for guard dogs), poop in a bag and pull you away from danger, you are wanting it to behave way differently to its instincts and stronger training will be required. This goes into army / SAR / police dog training territory about which I know very little, only that beware when finding a trainer as there are loads of charlatans out there advertising this sort of training for domestic pets. If they offer a doggy boot camp BEWARE - you need training just as much as the dog, training has to be ongoing and for what you want daily. This will be very expensive and need a daily commitment from you.

You will never know how a dog will naturally respond to things until you try it, hence the large failure rate of working dogs. We had two Golden Retreivers, the larger bossy dog hid behind my legs when faced with an intruder in the back yard whilst the little timid one barked and snarled and looked generally scary - she scared the intruder off.

If you are going to look further into getting a dog, you are best getting a puppy so you can train it your way from an early age. Rescued dogs can be too unpredictable - you never know their full background (nurture). I have a rescue dog that I love to bits, but I never know how he will respond to new situations despite lots of training. Some thoughts on this;

- research the breed, some breeds will be better suited to your needs than others (nature). Maybe a gun dog like a Labrador Retriever (bred to accept loud noises, easy to train, loyal and eager to please) would suit you. They need a lot of loving too though!

- Research the breeder. The first 8 weeks of a puppy's life are the most important (nurture) and its vital that it is looked after properly in this time. They need to be well socialised and loved in this time or you can easily end up with a neurotic dog. They will wee on the floor and tear up your house. Don't buy from a pet shop or a newspaper ad, make sure you meet at least the mum and preferably both parents to judge their nature, and see the environment they are growing up in. If offered the puppy at 6 weeks walk away - they aren't a knowledgeable breeder - pups must have 8 weeks with their mum and litter mates. Don't get the one that walks straight up to you, they will probably be dominant and more difficult to train. Don't get the one hiding in the corner - too nervous for your needs. Get one that happily plays with its litter mates but doesn't shy away when you approach - well balanced.

- As you have such specific requirements, find a trainer before all this and discuss breed and training from day one

My dogs (and cats) will be both a benefit and a danger in survival situations. My two most likely survival scenarios are flood (I would sit tight as I am on a hill) or severe storm (I would evacuate as my house is not cyclone proof). They would be a benefit for sitting tight, providing entertainment, company, warmth and security (I always have extra supplies for them thanks to this forum). They would be a liability for an evacuation as they would not be allowed in evac centres (at least initially), would not be helped by the Sate Emergency Service (can't see me or my wife leaving them behind) and would add to the time it would take to safely evacuate. We also go camping with our dogs in the bush - they would be a liability there if anything went wrong due to the rescue boy's unpredictable nature and the old age of our other dog (but would provide warmth and a morale boost!).

I would suggest you look at your own survival needs, and get a shorter list of what you want a dog to do. All the things you have so far listed are possible (with the right dog and lots of training) but not all for one dog. A SAR dog won't make a good police dog, a guard dog won't make a good assistance dog etc. Think about your likely scenarios and prioritise.

Sorry for such a long first post, I have learned so much from this forum and it stood me right for the floods earlier this year, finally a subject comes up I think I can help on so there you have it.

Thanks for a great first post, KenOTBC! And welcome to ETS!

Thanks Phaedrus!

Ditto and welcome!

Hi and welcome.

-Eric

Dweste,

I'm not sure any particular expectation is unreasonable but the full set of expectations is pretty daunting. Finding a dog with the temperament, instincts and intelligence to meet those expectations would be like finding a preschooler with the potential to be an olympic or professional athlete. It can happen but the odds are against the dog you select having all those required attributes and then what are you going to do - return it, euthanize it, keep it and be disappointed?

The other part of the equation is you. The dog is a pack animal and you need to be the pack leader. That means you will need to invest a lot of time training and socializing with your dog. To even have a chance of meeting your expectations your dog will need to be fully integrated into your life. Since most jobs don't allow pets while working that means you will need to "make up for lost time" with a lot of your "free" time. Similarly your expectations mean you won't be able to "outsource" most of the training. You and your dog will essentially be on a training program equivalent to preparing for the Olympics to develop the skills an rapport needed. That is a tremendous time and energy commitment and like all skills these will require constant practice to keep in tune.

I grew up with dogs all around, my folks had them, my grandfather raised and trained german shepherd dogs and I have been blessed with four great dogs since getting a place of my own. I think, maybe, two or three out of all of these dogs would have been able to truly help, beyond providing companionship and a canine early warning system, in a survival situation. Not due to training (two were barely obedience trained) but due to their intelligence and loyalty to our pack (my family).

-Eric

Don't apologize; this is excellent. Welcome!

Great first post, Ken. Welcome!

So, Ken, what do you think about getting dogs as survival aids - along with the other reasons for getting dogs? Is it worthwhile, or should we go back to herding cats?

OK,
Dogs are the better people!
We had dogs the past 35 years and can not im. life without them.
Good EWS, friends, fetch shot ducks from the water, keep bears away.
What I found out, most Indians (one of the few problems up here)
are afraid of large dogs.

Amen.

(don't let my wife see this!)

Excellent first post, KenOTBC! Very nice, indeed.

Going back to the original question, I wouldn't go out and acquire a dog as part of a 'survival strategy'. If you want a dog, get one that you would get for a pet and then work with it.

And remember that dogs don't really think, they associate. They're not going to think a problem through and then do what is best. Even a trained dog can revert to instinct, as in the case of Bane, the still-missing Michigan police dog.

Bane was on-lead, assisting in a search for a dementia patient in the woods. He got tangled in some brush, his handler disconnected his leash to free him, and just then a deer bolted by, and Bane took off after it. This was in November of last year, and he hasn't been found yet.
Find Bane

A strong connection with your dog is probably going to be worth more than all the training you can provide.

Sue

nothing useful to add to the discussion other than get a dog for the right reasons. I really just wanted to welcome ken and thank him for an awesome first post.

EDIT: Another welcome to mpb.

Thanks for the warm welcome guys!

Dweste, I wouldn't get a dog just as a survival aid. Way too expensive in time and money. Only get a dog if you love dogs.

Police dog handlers love dogs - its very competitive to become a police dog handler. Same with army dog handlers and customs dog handlers. To spend so much time training a dog you HAVE to love it.

If you do love dogs then why not? Its good to have a goal for training, so long as that goal is realistic. Just don't underestimate the time and money required though. Expensive for a survival aid but cheap for a best mate.

Well, I like dogs but love cats. But I doubt I could pick or keep a dog without falling for it pretty fast.

Fortunately, I am not pressed for time in making any dog /no dog decision.

Dweste, you've opened up a whole new line of thinking!

Trained Attack Cats in Survival Situations!

Of course, you would need the proper feline characteristics: trainable (the big hurdle), controlled attacking, large and heavy enough that flying weight could knock someone down. Cat claws can be formidable weapons, so don't declaw him.

Benefits:
* A cat would take less effort to feed in a long-range situation.
* A cat can often provide at least part of his food by himself.
* A cat would take up less space than most dogs.
* A cat is more portable than a German Shepherd or Pit bull.
* A cat requires far less fresh drinking water storage than a dog.
* A cat can keep rodents down if you find yourself having to live in substandard conditions.
* A cat can often catch/kill rabbits, so he might be willing to help provide food for you.
* A cat doesn't roll in rotting animals and then climb into your lap.

Tip: Don't try to bath it, let the cat take care of that himself.

Sue

Sue, you must be reading my mind! But I leave you to start the new thread this concept deserves.

I don't know... maybe Blast is the person we need... Experience over theory, you know.

Sue

Count me out of this discussion, I'm way too biased.

-Blast, currently down to #5 in google image search for "cat bite"

LOL!! That more like it! I've got spares if anybody would like one or 5!

I think I've got one good hunter cat. I walked through my bedroom one night about 10 days ago, and Blackie was asleep on the bed. I went back in there an hour later to go to bed, and he was sitting on the bed chirping to me, and there was a dead opossum on the floor. Blackie had been closed in alone there since about 6 p.m.

It was a young opossum about 8" long (w/o tail). This being a crappo mobile home where the builders cut 6" holes in the floor for 2" drain pipes, I'm assuming he came up that way. Blackie followed me into the bathroom and proceeded to open the cabinet door and look in, then backed out. No more opossums, I guess.

Possum and collard greens; Possum, grits and gravy; Possum stew...

Sue

Benefits:
* A cat would take less effort to feed in a long-range situation.
It is a matter of return on investment. And, as revolting as it may seem to us, will gladly eat what we excrete. This is how Ferrel dogs live. Cats can't handle it.

* A cat can often provide at least part of his food by himself.
Ferrel cats are short lived and miserable. Most live off the mistaken sympathy feeding by humans. Domestic cats don't last long in the wild.

* A cat would take up less space than most dogs.
A cat is miserable on a leash so they demand a crate to survive the woods. So the difference is minimal.

* A cat is more portable than a German Shepherd or Pit bull.
Depends.
A dog can be trained to return and behave themselves and allowed out on their own in a wilderness setting. Even on a leash the dog is traveling under its own power. Cats you have to crate and carry.

* A cat requires far less fresh drinking water storage than a dog.
Dogs will drink from puddles. Will lick dew from grass and will such down what you spit out brushing your teeth. Avoid using toothpastes is Rover is waiting.

* A cat can keep rodents down if you find yourself having to live in substandard conditions.
Cats are pretty miserable as rodent control. Small dogs, like terriers, are much better, determined and consistent, at it.

* A cat can often catch/kill rabbits, so he might be willing to help provide food for you.
Many tribes and hunters use dogs to hunt, or help them hunt, game. Nobody uses cats for that purpose.

* A cat doesn't roll in rotting animals and then climb into your lap.
Dogs mark the edge of their territory but are quite selective. Male cats are quite indiscriminate; the females stay pregnant, and both are quite noisy and resistant to confinement for much of the year.

Dogs can form working and productive relationships. Cats are largely incapable of productive work.

You can eat a dog. Cats are very poor food. Cats are perfectly willing to eat you, alive if necessary, if you are incapacitated. Dogs wait much longer and don't eat pack members while alive.

Dogs can be fitted with a harness, carry a pack, draw a travois, cart or sled.

http://www.womenofthefurtrade.com/wst_page16.html

Domestic cats are entirely dependent on humans outside human habitation, cannot be effectively put to work, and are generally indifferent to humans. If you want a pet you can go with cat or dog. If you want to get something done you go with a dog. On the other hand, if you want decoration, cats are more decorative.

We exist for the pleasure, amusement and service of our cats. Dogs are or can be at least a cooperative partnership.

A. It was a joke.

B. "Dogs...will gladly eat what we excrete." Only if it's high in protein.
* Feral cats are not part of the equation.
* Cats are miserable on a leash? Well, I wish you'd told me that before I trained Trilby to a leash. She never seemed to mind it. Odd... maybe she was unique.
* You don't have to crate a cat to carry it, backpacks work just fine.
* Dogs and cats will both drink from puddles, but I don't like my pets ingesting giardia and radiator coolant.
* All of my pets are neutered/spayed. Irresponsible fools are the main owners of intact housepets.
* "Dogs... don't eat pack members while alive." Both dogs and cats kill their prey before they eat it, and it's a fallacy that dogs will wait for a packmate to die first. Starving is starving; a mother dog will eat her own puppies.

Sue

You guys are forgetting the other animals. It's not just dogs and cats, you know:

Turtles - the "bug in" experts. Sure, they are more philosophical advisors than servants, but at times we do need input on our strategic thinking.

Cockroaches - the ultimate survivalists. If a nuclear bomb goes off, just think, what would the roaches do? Before you know it, your genetic material will be all over the world for billions of generations.

Tiger, 1, caged - necessary for defending oneself against an attacker armed with a banana.

Ostriches - if all else fails, stick your head in the sand.


bingley

This is somewhat related. When discussing ways to signal for help with our scouts, we talked about being sure to have whistles, mirrors, be big and bright, etc. One of the scouts, who I didn't give enough credit to at the time, said he would just carry a dog whistle to call for a highly trained rescue dog. That took me by surprise. I shoud have commended him for thinking outside the box, and then asked him what he would do if he were at a park 500 miles away and the dog were at home. Instead I told him that it was a bit far-fetched. Shame on me. I won't make the same mistake again.

Interesting idea. How would a "highly trained rescue dog" react to a dog whistle when in the field?

Of course, rescue dogs are not a part of every SAR scenario - it's more likely that a helicopter would be deployed as soon, or sooner, than the doggies.

It was his idea that the dog would be his, and that it would be trained to come rescue him when he blew the whistle. This all came up when we did Hug-a-Tree and Survive at one of our meetings. When I asked what they would do if they got lost he thought about it for a while. That was his response.

Interesting idea. Kids are amazing sometimes! Definitely out of the box thinking and not a bad idea. I wouldn't want to rely on it as primary though.

My 'trained' dog proved me wrong once again. Having a dog that hunts down and brings back a skunk is not very helpful. This official lumps all of my dogs into the PITA category if it was a run for your life situation. Now adding hydrogen peroxide, baking soda and dishwashing soap into the bug-out-bag for de-skunking the dogs.

This is EXACTLY what I would expect from my rocket surgeon older dog. The younger dog has shown himself conclusively to be less intelligent.

Our dogs make reasonably good intrusion alarms and they have significant positive impact on morale. They're very protective of my wife and daughters, too. Overall, however, I view them as net negatives to our preparations and planning.

Watching a crime program.....1st up was a peeper,breaks into home and kills boyfriend,peeper wouldnt have even been out in yard if a Pomeranian lived there.Boyfriend would have KNOWN the danger was there.

Next came an old lady asleep,guy breaks in to sleep it off,ole lady confronts him,he stabs her to death.

A yapper alone would have sent him on his way,he wanted an EMPTY house to crash in.She could have armed herself if a yapper had barked.

A GSD or a Husky,his day would have been ruined.

See a trend here? Folks without dogs are the ones being killed in these home invasions,not the folks with dogs.Dog owner killed,very unusual compared to non dog owner victim.

My point is this,the DooDoo hit the fan for those folks,and thousands of others every year are murdered that just the noise of a dog,let alone the dog capable of putting the bite on an intruder,they would have been safe and alive today.

A big dog,or two,best thing Ive EVER done to protect my family and home.My number one home security items,my dogs,hands down.

Quiet night couple days ago,about 11pm....Snooky starts barking,more we ignore her,more irritated she gets. Take a look outside,a guy has placed a 5 gallon bucket in the planter and is standing next to it looking at house.Auto light is illuminating him.

Sorry,just resting,didnt mean to make your dog bark....neighbor lets out her Rottie,he goes about his way.

Now whats a guy doing with a 5 gallon bucket at 11 PM in front of house? My guess is 'Christmas' shopping.

Another example of the the WATCH dog,vrs the guard dog....a WATCH dog is a valuable security tool.Doesnt have to be a killer dog,just ears that are better than yours is very useful.

I'm glad that nothing else happened. I hope you called the police.

No,not much point,he would be long gone before they showed.I will save the police calls for something more substantial than a (possible) yard thief on foot.

Thanks Chaos,Im glad nothing else happened either but I sure love my pair-o-mutts,I still havent met anyone who wants to challenge them in crazy barker mode.

The last call we made was the motorcycle putting around at idle quietly instead of the usual blast you out mode,stopping,turning off bike and shining his lights in yards.

Cops showed fast,and lo and behold what drives out right after they patrol past house a couple times...a pickup with the bed half filled with assorted gas cans.They looked a good hour I bet,but seems they got away.Now that,at 1:30 AM in a little neighborhood was very odd,muttsters woke me for that one.Good ole Snooky is very good at threats,anything out of ordinary and she is on it,Girl is more 'KILL THE RACCOON,KILL THE RACCOON" barker.

Together though they sure do the job.

LOL ,we see this




They see that

I'll go with the old-fashioned St Bernard and a small keg of brandy strapped to it collar. I know that technically you're not supposed to drink alcohol when hypothermia is a threat. But this old-time solution would work pretty well for me ... a fluffy St Bernard could generate a lot of body heat :-)

Pete2

Yep, dogs make a good sensor package and most are good about letting you know something is up. The dog here is a very muscular 11 lbs and feisty -- a guard dog he is not. But he sees/hears the UPS guy before me and he sleeps light.

My GSD definitely believes the UPS guy is working for the Taliban. He gets the official "enemy of the state" rapid-fire bark. I can't get any of them to get closer than 30 feet from the house.

I love our current dog just like the last one, who died too soon and left a void in my heart. We (my dog and I) joke that if I die at home he'll wait at least 3 days to start eating me, which gives my immediate family a decent chance of checking in and finding that I vapor locked or something. Keep a pretty corpse you know; but in the end if I'm dead I really wouldn't mind if its lions or polar bears or my dog that eats my bones.

Sully has obviously been trained in all the social graces, he is a good pup and stays very close during walks, but has a protective streak that means when the plumber says hello he is as likely to nip his hand as wag his tail and say hello. Not sure where he gets that, except from some mistaken sense that he is protecting us. But he will give one short, sharp bark to most strangers, and sometimes lunge. Enough that we keep him leashed and wait for plenty of human contact before letting him sniff the person's crotch.

My private dread in life, we invite the Queen of England for tea, and Sully sniffs her crotch. "Ooo! Oh my!" One would definitely follow the other.

Great responses.

A Shih Tzu is a great watch dog,sleep very light and the males anyhow are fearless little buggers. I think they are hypoallergenic and dont shed and arent delicate,have very strong thick bones for a mini dog,give em a puppy cut and low maintenance little guys,and very loving with kids and live to entertain you. Just get a puppy though,rescues with baggage
are hard to live with,they never forget if abused.Ever.But if you have little space the Shih lives there fine and are GREAT vehicle dogs,surprising how many Long Haul truckers have a Shih!



Snooky is about 70 LBS,did the same with the UPS guy yesterday.Im squishing out door while she has wrist hooked around it and pulling open,she is strong being husky mix they live to pull.UPS guys eyes like saucers!

Sniff the Queen,too funny!

Most of the problems with dogs are owner related. the vast majority of people who self train dogs do a very poor job of it and the dogs are just not well trained at all.

Most dog "trainers" are not much better at it.

Fortunately, even poorly trained dogs are usually not that much of a nuisance.

I like hiking with my beagle. She loves it out in the woods and just has a grand time. But I do not delude myself into thinking she is an asset anymore than a child is an asset. Both require far more in resources than they are worth most of the time. Yet human beings have traditionally kept both dogs and children for some reason.

We have a very small zoo in our town which is not very good. They have only one animal on exhibit. It is a Shih Tzu.

Yes,This is very best to make them the part of rescue activities.They are very best and more effective for such things.All over the world dogs are extensively used for such activities.