Generator Autothrottle Vs. Refrigerator

So - is this a coincidence or a problem.

In the recent hurricane/tropical storm, my home was running on generator for a few days. It's a Honda, older model (from 1998), and it's got an "auto-throttle" feature to save gas when there's no load.

Now, two of my loads are a refrigerator and a freezer. The others are just pumps that come on based on pressure or float switches.

About 2 days after the power came back on, we noticed the refrigerator wasn't quite keeping stuff as cold as it should and soon after we had a service technician come in and the compressor motor was dead. Cost to repair was near cost to replace, it was 11 years old, so we replaced it.

But I've been thinking about how auto-throttle works and was wondering if I may have accidentally killed my refrigerator. The generator drops the voltage and slows down until it detects a load of a bit more than 1 amp. This fridge had an "energy saving mode" that drew less than an amp at times - I wonder if there could have been some kind of issue with the compressor attempting to run on 50 volts while the generator was in slow mode.

Does anyone think/know if this is possible or is it just bad luck.

Refridgerators/Freezers can survive for 20 yrs or more if one provides a little simple maintenance,very easy to do!#1- Pull fridge away from the wall,aprox. 4',place yourself right or left side of fridge,place your foot at the lower back corner & push/tilt the fridge towards the wall 45 degrees or more,so the fridge stays tilted on it own,leaning against the wall,If you hear a rattling noise,No worries,it's the condenser fan,of which is mounted on a pinion,no harm done!.#2-get a vacuum cleaner with hose&attachments(HEPA filter type works best),& vacuum the entire bottom of the fridge(the crevice attachment & a paintbrush works well here) you will see alot of hair,dust,etc. built up on the condensor coil,usually lower back end(looks like a radiator),Suck all that stuff off with the vacuum,usually takes about 5 mins.,& if you can't get all the fur out,reverse the vac hose to the blow side & blow out all that fur,etc. you may want to wear a particle mask or bandana to cover your nose/mouth while doing so,when it is clean,reverse the hose to vacuum up all the debris,gently pull fridge back down on all fours.That simple task will give much extra life to your fridge,especially if done annualy!If you see water behind the fridge on the floor,that is water from the condenser pan in the backside,you can also clean that area as well,removing the thick cardboard cover,usually 5/16" or 3/8" hexscrews(be sure to vacuum the cover,it will be dirty as well)& be careful,slow,deliberate (there are alot of sharp edges waiting to ambush your fingers)just make sure you unplug the fridge 1st,you do not have to unplug the fridge for the above 1st task.If you clean the condenser pan,& Fan blades,you will notice almost immediately afterward that,Your fridge is smelling a whole lot better,& much colder air going into the freezer as well!The #1 chief cause for compressor failure is a clogged condensor coil & dirty fan motor/blades!Also many fridges/freezers are mis-diagnosed as having a burnt compressor motor,when in fact it is merely a burnt out capacitor-$10.00 part( the little black rectangle-1"x3" with 2-wires attached to it,(usually located leftside of compressor tank,mounted to the pan w 1/4" hexhead screws,use insulated needlenose pliers to extract the wires from the capacitor,& do not touch the contacts with your fingers,you may get Zapped,capacitors sometimes hold a charge.Place the pliers onto both contacts,if there is a charge,it will pop/spark,it is now de-energized,take capacitor off,& take it with you for a replacement at the appliance shop/Sears/etc. 9 times outa' 10 any voltage problems are going to burn out the capacitor,1st/foremost,a mere $10 part!The above info or $750+,Your choice!

The only thing I can think of is using a battery backup unit with a voltage regulator. The ones with a voltage regulator cost a little more than $100. They are sold at computer stores since it is best to supply a computer with reasonably constant voltage.

Jeanette Isabelle

Gee, thanks, that's really a useful set of tips, and I've added them to my checklist of home chores.

Yep, same situation. That's a $1,400 mistake I won't make twice.
I'm disabling auto-throttle as soon as it's back from the shop (had the carb & fuel system rebuilt to be ethanol-resistant after some issues cropped up). I'd rather spend an extra $50 on fuel than another $1,400 if we have a power failure that long again.

If I follow what Jeannette is recommending, use a back-up power supply in conjunction with your generator to stabilize the power. Back-up systems like those provided by Xantrex come with an internal power inverter to turn the DC battery voltage into AC power. Get one with a big enough inverter and a big enough battery.

I have the XPower Powerpack 400 and I doubt that it has the reserve power to ensure stable power for a refrigerator. For this application, I'd go bigger.

Or....I could just leave auto-throttle off.

After the fridge died, we had a good sense of what it costs to re-stock it, and we also know how much fuel the generator uses when running "full power" - based on that, it's worth running the generator for 4 days in a row before fuel costs exceed food replacement costs. I'm OK with that.

Best of all, if we have a long-term blackout in winter, we just move the food into our attached, unheated garage and don't even plug in the fridge!

I know from personal experience that good, expensive ($1000+) UPSes are destroyed outright by laser printers and floor buffers. I would definitely not plug anything that had a pump or a condenser in it into a UPS I wanted to keep.

BINGO.

I have one for my computer, which uses a laser printer, and I have no problem with it.

I also use one for my home theater. It has worked for years.

Jeanette Isabelle

maybe i'm slow, but i don't get it:

for a quarter century, we've lived off the grid on solar. because town is hours away, we only go once a month (or every other month in winter) for supplies. we just have a tiny propane frig (with mini top-freezer) to hold fresh milk, eggs, butter, cheese, veggies and maybe some ice cream as a special treat. most foods we have don't need refrigeration.

seeing that most people live within a few minutes of a supermarket, what's the point of keeping so much food in your huge personal refrigerators and freezers?

in other words, i'm wondering why you need to have so much perishable "stuff" on hand, that then requires expensive generators & fuel to protect it once the power goes out?

please explain.

Some UPSes have power outlets that go directly to line power. Is your laser printer plugged in to one of those? I'd be interested to know what make and model of laser printer and UPS you're using.

I have the APC Back-UPS BN1250LCD and the HP LaserJet P1005 Printer.

Jeanette Isabelle

Some people need refrigerated medicine to survive. I'm glad to say that this isn't an issue we have.

What we do have is three kids who consume a lot of dairy. As a family we eat a lot of beef, pork and poultry. I really don't want to go to the grocery every day or every other day. In addition to the time efficiency of limiting my grocery trips, there's also the economic efficiency of buying larger quantities at Costco.

I just bought a generator; it's so new that I haven't even started it yet. Tomorrow will be Generator Test and Break In Day.

While I wouldn't turn up my nose at keeping my refrigerator or freezer working, the main reason I bought it is to keep my house from flooding. During the Spring and Summer, if we have a big storm with a lot of rain and the power goes out, I'll plug the sump pumps into the generator. During the Winter, I'll be able to supply the furnace with juice to keep the pipes from freezing, at least if the natural gas doesn't go out.

APC makes excellent gear, and that's a particularly good UPS for SOHO use.

On the back of it there are two outlets marked "SURGE ONLY" and bear ideograms of a printer and what looks like a scanner. If your printer is plugged into one of those ports, then it isn't backed up by the battery and won't kill the UPS.

thnx for the insights CS. i've always valued your comments.

i wasn't including medicine refrigeration in my question, that's a necessity and a given. and i suspect a tiny propane RV frig (that uses a 1/2 gallon fuel per day) could handle that problem.

and like everyone here, i too have a generator (a small honda eu2000i) for emergency back-up that would do perfectly for running little things a sump pump, lights and battery charging. on the ECO mode it can run 16 hours on a gallon.

but its the need for huge generators that i question, the ones that suck nearly a gallon a hour as suggested above. that just seems a bit out of balance to keep a box cold. and at today's fuel prices, that $100 in fuel per day.

i'm not slamming anyone here, just suggesting: less is more.

I try to only post when I'm sober .



That would be a kick-ass backup for that sort of thing.



My CERT has an EU2000i, and for a small generator it is the cat's meow. It's an inverter-based generator so it provides very clean power for electronics. Be aware, though, that one sump pump is likely all it can handle. Sump pumps have very large startup loads.

I have two sump pumps, and I didn't have $900+ to spend on this. Cabela's had a sale on a 3500W running/4000W startup load generator, and I got that. I have it running now to break it in as per the manual, and so far so good. Supposedly it will run for 12 hours at 50% load on 4 gallons of gas.



Makes sense.

Also add to list the need to power medical devices and equipment. Most don't take a great deal of power, but you need long run times and reliability.

.

well done, chaosmagnet.



bws48,

i have a buddy who comes to visit and stays in our separate tiny solar-powered guest trailer (an old 1960's remodeled campy-looking thing).

he needs a cpap machine and we found that it can run all night on just the solar system consisting of a 100 watt invertor, a 35 watt panel and a deep-cycle golf cart battery.

he can run it as long as he's here, if there's some sun to recharge it each day. (when there isn't, my honda is used to recharge the battery in no-time. or extra batteries could always be added if it was a more serious concern.)

he liked the system so much, he built his own for taking car-camping with his family. in particular they like the fact that there's no noise or smell to bother anyone, unlike the generator he used to use.

something like this might be all that's needed for what you indicated. and its far cheaper to set up than a generator.

Would you mind posting about how you put it together? I don't know where to find a 35 Watt solar panel that doesn't cost an arm and a leg.

Depending on the load of the refrigerator/freezer the following list should be able to maintain a combined refrigerator/freezer (especially if you are using a high efficiency type).

1000 W Pure sine wave inverter

80 Amp/hr 12V SLA deep cycle battery x2

30A MPPT Charge regulator

100W Mono Crystaline Solar PV panel (2 might be needed depending on geographical latitude)

With cabling etc - total cost would be around $1000 - $1300.

The SLA batteries could also be charged from a small Generator if no sunshine was available and with 160 A/hrs @ 12V (960 Whrs @ 50% duty cycle) should give around 1 to 2 days use for a medium sized A or A+ rated conventional fridge freezer (i.e rated at around 200 KWhr/year)

The solar power backup solution is expensive, that is until you run out of fuel for the Gennie.

i wasn't specifically suggesting that wattage, all depends on need/usage/size of battery, etc.

i threw my original trailer system (panel and battery only) together on the cheap just for use with the 12V trailer lights, but as guests asked to use it with their 120V toys (like radios, laptop computers, iPad speakers, etc) i then picked up a $20 inverter. the rest is history.

i bought my 35 watt solar panel used for $50 but a quick google popped up new panels like this one for $107:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/35-Watt-Solar-Panel-12-Volt-Battery-Charge-Controller-/110643021101

Easy. I'm not you. You live your lifestyle, I live mine. I'm OK with that.

I'll add...

My home is also the Emergency Operations Center for the tiny township, which does not have a generator. Additionally, my water well requires electric, my septic pump requires electric and my furnace requires electric. Since I raise my own chickens and take a deer or two every year, my freezer has the meat I literally can't buy in the store, and it would be a shame to waste it.

good helpful answers. allows me to understand the needs of others. thnx.

and no offense meant.

Everyone has different answers to why do you do X?

In this case mine goes - need the generator to run the sump pump in the warmer months and the furnace in the colder months. With a kid with various medical challenges I just don't want to add to the "fun" just because mother nature and the local power company have decided that electricity is optional.

Running fridge & freezer is a nice bonus and may have become the driver since my son is on a very restricted diet and even in good conditions we can't always depend on the local grocery stores to carry what we need.

like much in life - you mileage may vary.

- Eric

thnx eric. good input. i'm always open to learn more.